[Deck] Aluren

[theBloody]

I like standard build too. Testing something like this. Living wish could be nice. I'm curious if it work for you swoop.

[kiblast]

I like standard build too. Testing something like this. Living wish could be nice. I'm curious if it work for you swoop.

Hey, that's an old list of mine. I'd really increase the number of Coiling Oracle in it, probably cutting a Selkie Hedge Mage.

Edit: and probably upping the land count to 21.

[swoop]

Interesting to run with Intuition would be 1 Volrath's and 1 Loam perhaps.. with 1 witness MD

[Cacks]

Swoop - that has been tried before, but generally found to be rather slow. But do give it a go, as it gives real flexibility.

[swoop]

I know, it might be a meta choice. 3 Living Wishes however can provide us with a few solutions.

Bojuka Bog / Xantid Swarm / bounce / kill / w/e

[swoop]

SCG t16 deck is so horribad I can't even mention it

[5doorfury]

@swoop - I promise I am not trying to be a troll, but could you please explain your reasoning on why the top16 deck is "horribad?"

I only looked at the last couple pages and you seem to get respected in here, but TBH, that post was worthless. Do you just hate recruiters because you can't afford them? I saw that in July you "just picked up a Taiga" so I am suspecting that is the case.

If you won a recent legacy GP with Aluren or something I will stand corrected, but I really just don't understand why you feel that you can come on and say that with no reasoning.

Please explain.

[Nonex]

Shall I post the list in question:

1 Bayou
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Polluted Delta
1 Taiga
2 Tropical Island
1 Underground Sea
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Forest
2 Island
1 Swamp

1 Parasitic Strix
1 Cavern Harpy
4 Coiling Oracle
2 Dream Stalker
1 Eternal Witness
4 Imperial Recruiter
2 Wall of Blossoms

4 Aluren
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
2 Intuition
3 Repeal
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Gitaxian Probe

Sideboard:
4 Go for the Throat
1 Progenitus
2 Firespout
4 Natural Order
3 Thoughtseize
1 Dryad Arbor

Which is to say, the list is exactly Tom Raney's except -1 Ponder, -1 Repeal, +2 Intuition.

I tested the list with the original changes and found it, well, not bad, but the lack of tutors was evidently a problem. Sometimes you had to dig hard through the library and abusing Repeals in ways you didn't really want to, just to get there. Depending on what you face, you may end up in a position where you have to go balls-to-the-wall, be it Aluren or NO-Prog, and risk getting it countered without protection. But the list in general still has some remarkable attributes:

* 5 basics, including a Swamp
* Plenty of fetchlands and no more duals than necessary
* 2 Dream Stalkers, which is the minimum required to be "safe" from removal
* Minimum disruption acceptable (FoW + Therapy) plus cantrips that improve it
* Good creatures overall, nothing fancy or reliant on Aluren
* Now with Intuitions to solve the consistency problems
* Versatile sideboard with solid answers to both aggro and control

So, as far as Recruiters are concerned, the list is as good as it can get. However, I agree with swoop in that I don't like the list, and I guess he doesn't precisely because it runs Recruiters, in which case I also agree with him. I speak for myself when I say the reason has nothing to do with money or having access to them, though, since I bought them a bunch of months ago and here they are.

It's hard to understand why Recruiters would be bad in Aluren unless you thoroughly test them. The analogy could be the inclusion of Life from the Loam in Canadian Threshold. Apparently, it's all advantages: you get protection from opposing Wastelands, you can recur your own Wastelands to deny them mana, recurring fetchlands help preventing you from topdecking lands, and Nimble Mongeese become 3/3 in no time. Why don't Threshold players run them, then? Because the deck is heavily tempo-oriented, and Life from the Loam contributes to anything but tempo. The same happens to Recruiter: Aluren is a control deck above everything else, and Recruiter is only good at comboing, making it a very poor card in any other situation. Forcing another color and Dream Stalker over Man-o'-War adds the insult to the injury.

Summarizing, Recruiter itself is unique and very good and provides numerous advantages to Aluren, but is mostly bad because it goes against Aluren's main strategy. However, Recruiter got so much hype when it became legal that it stigmatized Aluren ever since:

- Most people think Aluren needs 4 Recruiters to be good and that versions without them are inferior
- Most of them have never played both versions to truly know which one is better, mostly due to lack of Recruiters
- When asked about playing on MWS or proxying Recruiters, the answer is generally that testing a list they'll never get to play in real tournaments is pointless

This way, you get a collective faith dogma with no real basis to stand on. Whoever owns Recruiters will play Aluren with them, and those who don't won't consider Aluren as a reasonable choice. This is why the few Aluren lists that do something important run 4 Recruiters.

[swoop]

If you won a recent legacy GP with Aluren or something I will stand corrected, but I really just don't understand why you feel that you can come on and say that with no reasoning.

I believe we have yet to wait for someone to win a GP with Aluren.

Nonex basically argumented everything. I would just like to comment on his few marks:

* 5 basics, including a Swamp
* Plenty of fetchlands and no more duals than necessary

- pretty normal/smart for any build

* 2 Dream Stalkers, which is the minimum required to be "safe" from removal
* Minimum disruption acceptable (FoW + Therapy) plus cantrips that improve it

- pretty normal/smart for any build - though probes are useless most of the time

* Good creatures overall, nothing fancy or reliant on Aluren

- remove probes, add some more harpies, coiling oracles and you've got yourself a deck.

* Now with Intuitions to solve the consistency problems

- All lists I've played in last 5 years had atleast 2 Intuitions there, smart solution, perfect number (maybe +1)

* Versatile sideboard with solid answers to both aggro and control

- standard sideboard. Thoughtsize is an interesting addition.

[GoblinZ]

Hello every one

I am interested in this deck, but I want to know how to deal with turn 1 lackey or Nacatl.

[death]

If you're on the play, cast a Wall of Blossoms or Coiling Oracle. If you're on the draw, there's Force of Will.

[Lejay]

Or chain of vapor in a good controllish build.

[Cacks]

Or win on turn 3.

Or turn 2 ;-)

[kiblast]

Hello every one

I am interested in this deck, but I want to know how to deal with turn 1 lackey or Nacatl.

The solution is:

a) Ignore the turn 1 lackey (I am not going to worry about a deck which represent less than 2% of the meta) as in the past I've raced turn 1 lackeys easily...just drop some blockers and combo off. Seriously the only thing you need to worry about in this mu are Port+Waste.

b) Take 3 damage then drop some blockers, dig, play a couple of Cabal Therapy, combo off turn 4-5.

[swoop]

MM the Lackey.

of wait.

[TheDreamStalker]

@Nonex

you brought up some interesting points about not having to play imperial recruiters. i've been playing dredge for a while now, and i have recently decided that i actually want to play magic, so i wanted to pick up Aluren. could you maybe post your current list for a Aluren deck that doesnt use Imperial Recruiters? thanks

[Nonex]

Providing an optimal list is a tough call, since it's been a while since I last played Aluren.

I have always noticed certain problems with the mana base, and after some months playing Food Chain (3 Ancient Tomb + 4 Birds of Paradise + 2 Llanowar Elves) and Astral Rift (3 Ancient Tomb + 4 Mox Diamond) I have come to the conclusion that the "fair" mana base I always played Aluren with just isn't enough. Some 1cc accelerant is needed. Ancient Tomb has a little of a hard time coming in because of the costs.

If I had to play Aluren right now, it would probably be something like this:

4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Tropical Island
2 Bayou
1 Underground Sea
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Dryad Arbor
3 Forest
2 Island
1 Swamp

4 Veteran Explorer
2 Cavern Harpy
4 Raven Familiar
2 Man-o'-War
1 Parasitic Strix
1 Selkie Hedge-Mage
2 Eternal Witness
2 Phantasmal Image
4 Coiling Oracle
4 Wall of Blossoms

4 Aluren
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Diabolic Intent
2 Chord of Calling

It's creature-heavier than average, but I think it's a good place to start. Phantasmal Image is the latest tech, since a resolved Natural Order into Progenitus was pretty much game over before. I choose Veteran Explorer as the 1cc accelerant, for it's a fantastic wall against aggro and has great sinergy with Diabolic Intent. Chord of Calling is incredible, it can be cast for free almost too often, and it even has sinergy with Selkie Hedge-Mage when going off.

I wouldn't know how to build the sideboard. Pernicious Deed sure should have a place, as well as some Thoughtseize, but the rest I guess is up to the metagame. Some silver bullets for Chord could be appropiate, too.

[kiblast]

...list...

Ok srsly Nonex where are Fows? :)

I'd probably cut Phantasmal Image, as I don't really see Natural Order being a problem for Aluren. You need (and should use properly) protections, in the form of Fow and Therapies. I don't think a 2 turns clock is *so* scary for a control combo deck like Aluren. Anyway, if you let opponent resolve Order, let's say by turn 3 through turn 1 Hierarch/GSZ acceleration, you'll have lost by turn 5. Which means you have 5/6 turns (depending if you were on the play or on the draw) to win with a deck that normally goldfishes on turn 4-5. It is definitely enough, and if it's not enough, it's not because of Order, but rather because of bad draws/misplays/ opponent with crazy good hand etc...
I understand Image is nice while going off but I really would never rely on it to go off simply because it can't be bounced back. Also if opponent is skilled enough he will kill the critical creature you want to copy in resp to Image.

Chord of Calling is interesting and has seen use in the past in various Aluren builds, but I think is really overrated. While comboing, you basically need GGG (In a 3color deck with 21 lands,even with sac outlet+Explorer is not easy to reliably have GGG by turn 4-5) + at least 2 creatures out to find an Harpy, or 3 creatures to find Raven. Instead, if you play Chain of Vapor, you may easily bounce multiple creatures for the low cost of U, and continue bouncing/casting/digging your library.
With Vapor, you can also put on the stack multiple bounce abilities (like Dream Stalker/Man-o'-War + Harpy) targeting all your opponent creatures, and without passing priority bounce your Aluren with Chain of Vapor, and swing with your creatures next turn while opponent has no creatures on board. Seriously, you absolutely want 1-2 Chain of Vapor maindeck.

Explorer+Intent/Therapy is a very good interaction, I tested it in the past and I think I'd run it.

Here are the changes I'd do to your list, imho:

-2 Image
-2 Chord
-1 Witness

+3 Fow
+2 Chain of Vapor

Edit: Moreover, Chain is golden in those matches where you are facing some beaters (ex: Goyf/s) and you are in flood. Chumpblock with your Walls, bounce them and sac your lands to bounce multiple cantripping creatures you own, play them again, draw extra cards, continue chumplocking... seriously Chain is so flexible in this deck that you simply never want to cut it.

[Nonex]

Chord of Calling doesn't need GGG, tapping three green creatures is enough for that matter. I know what Chain of Vapor does and the multiple tricks it enables, too. I just think it's time to try something different because conventional builds seem too slow right now.

[Dravus Mallinard]

Had everyone give up from this deck ??? There are no new techs for Aluren ????

Isn`t it possible to acelerate it with chrome mox, petal or spirit guide ????

Or enter throught a wizard control mode??? (cursecatcher+patron wizard+vendilion clique).

I never played this deck, but i`m really interested... would like to know resoults from people that are currently playing it !!!