LET'S GO
Originally Posted by CutthroatCasual
The sky is not falling. We aren't even sure what the first wave of changes will bring, let alone what the meta will settle to. Just watch and then adjust. I am not a goblins player at heart, but I do want to steamroll miracles and this does that for sure. Also, I think this archetype has flexibility, which is definitely a point in it's favor for a changing legacy landscape.
If you're concerned about TNN/Goyf, try the black splash. Warren Weirding is great against both, and I keep an engineered plague hiding out too. Plague wrecks a surprising number of decks, not just us!
Have you shared your list recently? I'd be interested if you don't mind.
I agree with this (the bit about Warren Weirding)
I'm still going to start with playing all 4 Tarfires because the deck wants efficient interaction in the fair matchups where you need to kill Delver of Secrets and Mother of Runes, but I wouldn't be surprised to see the metagame end up somewhere that I only want 2-3
TNN isn't much of a problem itself, you can go wide vs it. If it's paired with Equipment that's another story, but the new Trashmaster will do a lot of work there. I think Goblins is well set up vs those kind of decks.
Here is my list:
(link)
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Wasteland
2 Rishadan Port
2 Badlands
3 Mountain
3 Bloodstained Mire
3 Wooded Foothills
3 Cavern of Souls
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Mogg War Marshal
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
2 Goblin Chieftain
3 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
4 Aether Vial
2 Goblin Piledriver
3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Tarfire
2 Stingscourger
1 Volley Veteran
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Goblin Trashmaster
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Grenzo, Dungeon Warden
Sideboard:
1 Dread of Night
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
2 Pyrokinesis
1 Thoughtseize
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Goblin Chainwhirler
1 Earwig Squad
While I like the black splash, I'm not a huge fan of Warren Weirding. Thoughts?
20 Lands is too few
You look in the DNT thread and they are thinking about going up to 24 now (because of Brightling), they don't even have any card that costs 4 or more (except Batterskull I guess)
With the full playset of MWM and 2 Stingscourger your early plays are very low-impact
I would rather play Weirding to destroy the opponent's creature than stall it temporarily by chump blocking or bouncing it
You might think that you need many MWM to enable Piledriver, but I think that Piledriver sucks
Any advice beyond this is going to be very narrow and basically 'play my list' which isn't very helpful
Personally I don't like Krenko, Grenzo, SGC, or Veteran, but if they work for you then I guess keep doing it
Things I've been thinking about:
-With DRS gone is it necissery to still run tarfires? Maybe running like 3 gempalms is enough removal? Allows us to be more threatdense? Still at 1 currently for matron situations but could just be cut
-Goblin settler seems amazing with drs gone (as it really works well into the mana denial plan)
-I would expect graveyard decks to be on the rise, so running adequate hate is necissery
Thinking of running this:
4 Aether Vial
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
11 Mountain
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
4 Goblin Warchief
3 Mogg War Marshal
3 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Piledriver
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Tarfire
1 Stingscourger
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
2 Goblin Settler
1 Goblin Trashmaster
Sideboard:
1 Goblin Chainwhirler
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Blood Moon
2 Damping Sphere
3 Surgical Extraction
1 Stingscourger
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
3 Thorn of Amethyst
Interesting list. I would probably drop one Settler, and one Piledriver. Instead I would play Chainwhirler (then again, you’re playing Sharpshooter main), and one extra Tarfire.
Your reasoning is sound, but Tarfire is still great vs Delver, and Chainwhirler is a great MD-answer vs combo, RUG Delver, DnT to name some decks that probably see a uptick in the months to
I would probably take a closer look at your manabase as well, but as a startingpoint it’s good.
Also, why no Skirk Prospector? Super Sharpshooter c-c-c-combo ;-)
"Be it ever so crumbled, there's no place like home."
RGCL (GQ)
Youtube-playlist dedicated to RGCL
Prospector sounds good. I may underestimate how much dnt comes back into the meta. I understand that tarfire is great against delver but not mongoose or goyf (which i expect to uptick now that pyromancer and angler lists seem worse). They seem to have way less early drops you need (and can) interact with. So as a wayclearer for lackey on t1 it just seems less necissery and am thinking that there's benefit in running an extra toolbox or threat.
Chainy vs Sharpshooter is interesting, and due to the mana and having only 15 red sources im leaning to sharpshooter. Aand I agree that getting a prospector in the list would be great, and I should probably make space for it. If I do i figure I should probably drop the settler for it, and maybe a piledriver for an extra war marshall.
What do you think about the manabase that would make you want to re-evaluate it? I tried to make the manabase as clean as possible with the maximum number of mana denial lands (as i think that will be a common way to victory).
I also am thinking about the benefits of a chrome mox warren instigator list. The main reason I see is a 'level 2' approach where there maybe an uptick in non-blue decks which in response get overwhelmed by fast combo. Getting mox and instigator in the list allows for more explosive draws to race fast combo and the ability to slam hatepieces on the first turn. But that might have to wait for when the meta settles down a bit more.
Well, if you would choose Chainwhirler you would probably want some more red manasources. Chainwhirler hits more than a single Sharpshooter, and you don’t have to make it work (only get it into play).
I also think Karakas is a solid choice, because SnT will be one of the first combo-decks people turn to when the meta gets shaken up.
"Be it ever so crumbled, there's no place like home."
RGCL (GQ)
Youtube-playlist dedicated to RGCL
I'm actually really liking your list, but I would also make a few changes.
1. I would run chainwhirler over sharpshooter main, and have 1 shooter in the side. I find that sharpshooter does a whole lot of nothing unless were playing against fair creature based decks, or if we have a sack outlet (prospector / chirurgeon) and a lot of dudes. At least chainwhirler can swing in.
2. I would also run 1 settler over 2. I just think it's not usually something you would want 2 of.
Personally, I'm gonna try 1 volley veteran main deck. I know it doesn't look super amazing at first glance, but I really like the 4/2 body is brings, and it deals 1 more than cycling gempalm. I'm still probably going to run a couple gempalm. It's also important to note that volley veteran's text says "target creature an opponent controls" so if they don't have any creatures it wont sit in your hand.
As for lands, I'm liking mono red with ports right now. I think port with wasteland will be strong going forward. Gonna play 1 karakas as well.
In the sideboard I'm gonna try faerie macabre for a while. Might be a lot of reanimator running around and UB has counters, while RB has chancellor of the annex. I'd like to play around that if possible.
I agree with the idea that people go to SnT, but i feel that the scourger main/side is enough hedge to not play the karakas. Just feels like i rather run other colorless lands than just hedge with karakas which i have to draw ánd be relevant. Just looks like that would screw you over more often than actually change the game.
Note: Not tested, just the general idea i have.
Just really feel bad about the land situation to run chainy. I agree with the points you raise for sharpshooter vs chainy, but I like the avenue of adding the sac-outlet more simply due to castability of spells. Maybe I'm overemphasising this stance, but I don't think it's powerlevel is higher enough to justify running it with the current manabase (which I'm a great fan of). The consistency thing is also the reason I won't run karakas, esp. not with chainy in the deck.
I like the mention of macabre for the board, that might be a good choice over surgical actually (since it dodges duress out of storm as well)
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Hello ppl.
I want some suggestions to my list. Really excited with the bannings!
Maindeck
4 Wasteland
3 Rishadan Port
4 Cavern of Souls
1 Plateau
1 Karakas
2 Arid Mesa
4 Mountain
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Aether Vial
3 Tarfire
4 Goblin Lackey
1 Skirk Prospector
4 Goblin Piledriver
3 Mogg War Marshall
1 Stingscourger
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
2 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Goblin Trashmaster
1 Siege-Gang Commander
Sideboard
2 Pyrokinesis
1 Goblin Chainwhirler
2 Red Elemental Blast
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Faerie Macabre
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Damping Sphere
1 Goblin Trashmaster
Running a RW build with Thalia on the sideboard and 1 Karakas main. I kept 3 Tarfires for if there are lots of Delvers and SFM around, but maybe I can cut some, or even go down to 1 Gempalm.
I don't know if the Damping Spheres on the sideboard are worth it, but it can help against Elves and Aluren (dunno if it will still be good without DRS).
I can also see myself going monored, taking out Fetches and Plateau for Mountains (still keeping Karakas, because why not?). Sideboard I'd take out the 3 Thalias and add +1 Stingscourger, +1 REB and +1 Faerie Macabre.
My last doubt is on the SB Trashmaster. Maybe it's better for it to be TukTuk Scrapper to be able to play around Needle.
What do you guys think?
There is a TON of 2 mana air in this list. A full set of piledrivers, plus 3 MWM seems very excessive, especially in a Rishadan Port deck. I would either swap some of these for some utility dudes (sparksmith still is a two drop, but gives some flexibility), or go up a bit on your curve. I just don't value piledriver as a T2 play, he's great as a 1-2 of tutor target, but this list seems overtly agro, without much oomph for grindier games. If you want to go that way, maybe swap out ports for a more aggro utility land like a pendlehaven or two.
4 piledrivers, what are you expecting to play merfolk all day? You have one "fatty" in Siege, I would cut down on piledrivers and add Krenko, Kiki, something.
I like the idea of 1 tuktuk in the side to play around needle, as I think people will be playing needle in an open meta. But if they're naming that with needle and not sharp/krenko/vial/gempalm, i like my chances. It would have to be some real corner case type scenario where naming trashmaster pans out for them,but it wouldn't shock me if DnT decks eventually took this up.
I would play Rest in Peace with the white splash. It is just too good. Hoses goyf and mongoose, dredge, snapcaster decks, slower reanimator (UB if it makes a comeback was always slower than BR).
I disagree with the above posts. 3 Marshall and 4 Drivers is perfect for Goblins gameplay; bit of mana-denial, bit of removal, all of a sudden you explode onto the board thanks to a Ringleader and a Warchief. It's been 6 years since that plan was effective but now it actually has a chance.
I would certainly go up to 4 Gempalms though, that card is an essential engine piece of Goblins in a world without Deathrite.
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