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Thread: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

  1. #421

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    What do u think about the jim davis deck

    Monestary Mentor as main Wincon and 2 back to basics main
    no counterbalances

    In the feature matches agains soldiers and delver the back to basics were dead cards most of the time and terminus won those games.
    Gut it was better than the other versions.

    What do u think about the deck

    http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=18668&d=316427&f=LE

  2. #422

    [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    I guess you can chose between azcanta and btb, as they dont go well together and both are good vs certain decks. Not sure why he cut balances, they should have been great in that field full of delver decks.

    @whitefaces: The premiere way of fighting miracle these days seem to be TNN and liliana otlh. Moat stops both of these wincons, just saying ;)

  3. #423

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by JackaBo View Post
    Moat stops both of these wincons, just saying ;)
    Humility does too for like $400 cheaper. Humility also stops grislbrand and emrakul.

  4. #424
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    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    The decks playing TNN and LtLH are also playing plenty of cards that don't care about Moat too, it's still too narrow. Would you board it in vs Grixis Delver or Pile? Vs Delver the namesake card and DRS don't care about it, plus being a 4cmc sorcery speed card. Vs 4c DRSs, Strix and Jace ult don't care about it. When playing a bomb with a high cost you need it to have much more of an effect in matchups that you need it.
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  5. #425

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    This is an article by jim davis explaining his deck

    http://www.starcitygames.com/article...In-Legacy.html

    the gist is:

    - he thinks wasteland is one of the strongest cards in the format and therefore he only wants to play basics

    - going in hand with basics he plays back to basics now

    - counterbalance is a win more

    - entreat doesnt fit the deck since it (miracles in general, lel) cant go late anymore

    - he generally moved his deck more in a tempo role and plays 2 color now

  6. #426

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Hi. I am trying a 4c miracles right now. Maybe is a crazy idea but after play different combinations in some months ( with red ) i finally find the right versión (with black). This is the decklist:

    3 snapcaster mage
    4 baleful strix
    1 entreat the angels

    3 sylvan library
    4 Brainstorm
    4 ponder
    4 terminus
    4 swords
    1 council judgement
    4 fow
    2 flusterstorm
    3 jace tms
    1 engineered explosives
    1 Search for azcanta
    1 spell pierce

    2 Underground sea
    2 tropical island
    3 tundra
    1 Island
    1 plains
    1 swamp
    4 Flooded strand
    4 polluted delta
    2 misty rainforest

    1 flusterstorm
    3 surgical
    1 ethersworn canonist
    2 Vendilion clique
    1 council judgement
    1 entreat the angels
    3 thoughtseize
    1 supreme veredict
    1 disenchant
    1 zealous persecution

    Yesterday i played some small tournaments at GP Madrid with great results: 7-1-2.

    1-1 vs uw planeswalker control. I Will win but the game finally in turns. I need 3 minutes more to win...

    2-0 vs dredge.
    2-1 vs 4c control. Entreat un the right moment= win
    2-1 vs elves
    0-2 vs elves
    1-1 va grixis delver ( I missplayed with my jace when the match was nearly over)
    2-0 vs merfolk
    2-1 vs Lands
    2-1 vs ant

    I only Lost vs elves (Julian Knab). I missplayed a lot in those games.

    The library was very strong vs combo and control. It let me keep the miracles on top. Baleful was mvp vs delver and gives me extra protection when I play jaceand time. The cantrip effect helps a lot in a control deck, the reason i don't play predict.

    I think cheap counters are better than counterbalance by far because i need protect the terminus in the right moment. Probably try any hydroblast because pyroblast are really strong vs jace

  7. #427

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Magicmarvin View Post
    This is an article by jim davis explaining his deck

    http://www.starcitygames.com/article...In-Legacy.html

    the gist is:

    - he thinks wasteland is one of the strongest cards in the format and therefore he only wants to play basics

    - going in hand with basics he plays back to basics now

    - counterbalance is a win more

    - entreat doesnt fit the deck since it (miracles in general, lel) cant go late anymore

    - he generally moved his deck more in a tempo role and plays 2 color now
    Thank you Jim, Back to Basics is now $70+ dollars before the Legacy GP. Good thing I got my copies long ago.

    I wouldn't interpret as win-more, even though he wrote that regarding Entreat. He doesn't want to produce UU using his basic lands to play Counterbalance turn 2, he's not even interested, he rather find his plains early, answer threats, and maybe go tempo. Hence he's already decided he doesn't want CB to be part of his game plan. Also, he's committed in spending cantrips on Mentor, he will not give himself the option to set up CB triggers, again he's not interested. The stretch cantrips too thin argument he's also made it against Entreat.

    I understand where he's coming from regarding CB. However, I feel he fundamentally misunderstood the use of CB. It's meant as a value card, cumulatively. There's rarely occasions you Want to spend brainstorm to setup, unless you must counter a Glimpse of Nature or Infernal Tutor. His points make sense in his build; the archetype as a whole might want to rethink about CB some more.

    The argument of win-more for Entreat just doesn't make sense to me. I get it you want to load up on cantrip and spend them to create Monk tokens, but sometimes Mentor and Co. just cannot do it, people have game plans against Mentor. The reasons to play Entreat is that it is a standalone good card and it's not easy to hate it out.

    Overall, his philosophy/approach is similar to Miracles in Eldrazi Winter, stop short of running Daze (flusterstorm instead).

  8. #428

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Hey all, here are some games with the new Preordain list I've been testing: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...0HRiLfuMXlZE8Y. No commentary this time around but hopefully this helps get an idea of how the list plays out.

  9. #429
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    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by AnziD View Post
    Hey all, here are some games with the new Preordain list I've been testing: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...0HRiLfuMXlZE8Y. No commentary this time around but hopefully this helps get an idea of how the list plays out.
    This is very interesting.
    Thanks Anzid foro share.

  10. #430

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by twndomn View Post

    I understand where he's coming from regarding CB. However, I feel he fundamentally misunderstood the use of CB. It's meant as a value card, cumulatively. There's rarely occasions you Want to spend brainstorm to setup, unless you must counter a Glimpse of Nature or Infernal Tutor. His points make sense in his build; the archetype as a whole might want to rethink about CB some more.
    In my experience, every mirror I’ve played comes down to who resolves counterbalance first. Also what are people’s thoughts on this basis land build with one volcanic and one mountain to play red blast in the board?

  11. #431

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Also without counterbalance I feel like the deck is very vulnerable against discard spells, especially Cabal Therapy.
    That said, the card is just huge against ANT I think.

  12. #432

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    I made a template that can be used for a sideboard map

    the decklist is that one of itsunfair
    with sideboarding configurations edited by him.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing

  13. #433

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_Leger View Post
    Also without counterbalance I feel like the deck is very vulnerable against discard spells, especially Cabal Therapy.
    That said, the card is just huge against ANT I think.
    Turbo Xerox, Cabal Therapy, and Loam are like the biggest elements CB is great at shutting down. I am unsure what other solution best beats these three as well as CB.

  14. #434

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Can someone point me in the direction of the discord forum?

    Thanks :)

  15. #435

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by WThomas View Post
    Can someone point me in the direction of the discord forum?

    Thanks :)
    Found it!

  16. #436

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by NimbleJosh View Post
    In my experience, every mirror I’ve played comes down to who resolves counterbalance first. Also what are people’s thoughts on this basis land build with one volcanic and one mountain to play red blast in the board?
    Another Jim Davis no-CB Convert
    http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...?DeckID=119763
    Well SCG did make monk tokens of him. Interestingly, Karakas and Search as SB tech, his SB makes a lot more sense than Jim's.

    Similar list in Kyoto 2018
    https://magic.wizards.com/en/events/...sts-2018-03-25

  17. #437
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    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by twndomn View Post
    Another Jim Davis no-CB Convert
    http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...?DeckID=119763
    Well SCG did make monk tokens of him. Interestingly, Karakas and Search as SB tech, his SB makes a lot more sense than Jim's.

    Similar list in Kyoto 2018
    https://magic.wizards.com/en/events/...sts-2018-03-25
    Coval is literally just playing the "corrected" version of Jim's list, found here
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  18. #438

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Hey guys.

    I’m really struggling with the 4c Control matchup.

    I feel like they’re better at grinding than I am, and REB, Snap, REB is tough to beat.

    I can’t ever stick a permanent. I just feel like I lose every interaction.

    If it’s really needed I’ll post my list, but I’m more or less looking for general strategy because I must be playing it all wrong.

    I always play to the board when possible so my cards don’t get hymned or thoughtseized away.

    Any help would be much appreciated.

    Thank you!

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    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by vegetarian234 View Post
    Hey guys.

    I’m really struggling with the 4c Control matchup.

    I feel like they’re better at grinding than I am, and REB, Snap, REB is tough to beat.

    I can’t ever stick a permanent. I just feel like I lose every interaction.

    If it’s really needed I’ll post my list, but I’m more or less looking for general strategy because I must be playing it all wrong.

    I always play to the board when possible so my cards don’t get hymned or thoughtseized away.

    Any help would be much appreciated.

    Thank you!
    In this matchups you need to side out lands (you need to find spells), fow (2 for 1) and plow (just one for one). Need to side in REB, Fluster and... i really like to play 2 blood moons (they need to kp fow or hydroblast to deal with). Our best weapons are counterbalance, pyroblast, moon and flusterstorm backups.

    I think 4c control is favored to us (ofc, there's some games were we got t2 hymn and t3 snap hymn...)

    Gl!

  20. #440

    Re: [DTB] UWx Miracle Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Stefanogs View Post
    In this matchups you need to side out lands (you need to find spells), fow (2 for 1) and plow (just one for one). Need to side in REB, Fluster and... i really like to play 2 blood moons (they need to kp fow or hydroblast to deal with). Our best weapons are counterbalance, pyroblast, moon and flusterstorm backups.

    I think 4c control is favored to us (ofc, there's some games were we got t2 hymn and t3 snap hymn...)

    Gl!

    Stefanogs, I was looking at your standstill miracles list down below and was very intrigued. How has that deck worked out? Does it have any bad matchups? Do you think you could splash a third color if you wanted?

    Thanks!
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