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Thread: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

  1. #341
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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    I'm archiving this part of the primer which was written to discuss the core of the deck, common card choices and recent evolution of the deck.

    -----------------------------------------

    Common and a few not so common core cards of the deck (by decreased order of frequency in decklists, subjectively)

    Post 2020 approach:
    I will describe here my personal development in deck building strategy for MOST or 4c/3c Vial. Some still play something very close to the earlier versions.
    In early 2018 I started using the Recruiter of the Guard and Flickerwisp combination of cards from Death and Taxes to get a card advantage aspect while also having a lot of utility and the tutor function. I basically cut 1-2 copies of Fauna Shaman and added Recruiters. It's a less powerful tutor effect, but it's harder for the opponent to interact with and leaves a body and if you flicker that body you get another tutor effect for free (which is a great advantage).

    When Esper Vial first appeared in the reports of MTGO results using Soulherder (probably with this list: Jeff Lin's Esper Solution later Esper Vial), it seemed clear that the combination of creatures with etb abilities that could translate into card advantage especially with Soulherder could be a powerful approach. This made me reevaluate creatures that don't provide card advantage, especially the manadorks. Well, another reason to reevaluate using manadorks was that I noticed that Jeff was using more lands and no mana creatures to ramp with, Esper doesn't have them, offering a slower start but a more stable mana development. I figured I'd try the same, being less explosive but more reliable. And it seemed good. I think Delighted Halfling might be worth building with, however, and Dryad Arbor is good if running a GSZ heavy list. As of late 2024, the meta has become very aggressive and so GSZ may have an advantage over Recruiter in that it can accellerate your manadevelopment in the first two turns.

    With the printing of Orcish Bowmasters, the deck takes another turn as it forces you to reevaluate all your creatures and how you play.

    I will discuss here some cards that are good in a WUBG version of the deck. However, all cards with draw effects need to be reeavaluated in a format where Orcish Bowmasters is a popular card, which it probably will be as long as Brainstorm is a good card.

    Examples of good cards for a WUBG version:
    Yorion, Sky Nomad
    Phelia, Exuberant Shepherd
    Nadu, Winged Wisdom
    Psychic Frog
    Tamiyo, Inquisitive Student
    Endurance
    Force of Will
    Brainstorm
    Abundant Growth
    Once Upon a Time
    Swords to Plowshares
    Abrupt Decay
    Prismatic Ending
    Orcish Bowmasters
    Recruiter of the Guard
    Green Sun's Zenith
    Spellseeker
    Solitude
    Lagrella, the Magpie
    Leovold, Emissary of Trest
    Baleful Strix
    Ice-Fang Coatl
    Gilded Drake
    Gaddock Teeg
    Meddling Mage
    Lavinia, Azorious Renegade
    Plague Engineer
    Skyclave Apparition
    Knight of Autumn
    Samwise the Stouthearted
    Haywire Mite
    Witch Enchanger
    Stoneforge Mystic
    Knight of the Reliquary


    Abundant Growth makes a good Arcum's Astrolabe-imitation, it helps smooth out the mana requirements, let you operate more easily on fetching basic lands and gives you a chance to play through a Blood Moon. It also makes Yorion a better follow-up, and it helps letting Phelia attack while growing and drawing cards. When building a deck in 2024, you need to consider how an opposing Orcish Bowmasters will change theh value of Baleful Strix, Ice-Fang Coatl and Abundant Growth; I prefer Coatl because having flash lets you sometime play around your opponent's Bowmasters.

    Examples of good cards for a WURG version, red additions:
    Imperial Recruiter
    Fury
    Broadside Bombardiers
    Mawloc
    Magus of the Moon
    Minsc & Boo
    Pyroblast
    Flame of Anor
    Omnath, Locus of Creation
    Punishing Fire
    Dack Fayden
    Shaman of the Great Hunt

    Pre 2020 approach (for a 60 card maindeck, Yorion not yet printed):
    • Lands: 14-18 cards

    1 Forest
    0-1 Plains
    1-3 Savannah
    1-2 Tropical Island
    1-2 Bayou
    0-1 Tundra
    0-1 Underground Sea
    0-1 Taiga
    6-8 Fetches for Forest type cards
    Not counting Dryad Arbor among the lands.

  2. #342
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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Have you tried playing a Nadu MOST?

    In GBuw you get access to:
    Creature Tutors
    Psychic Frog
    Nethergoyf
    Orcish Bowmasters
    Wight of the Reliquary
    Nadu
    1 Nomads en-Kor
    1 Bristly Bill, Spine Sower
    1 Springheart Nantuko
    1 Sylvan Safekeeper
    1 Scryb Ranger (blocks Psychic Frog!)

    You could play a lot of the best current creatures in Legacy alongside Nadu support.

  3. #343
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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Have you tried playing a Nadu MOST?

    In GBuw you get access to:
    Creature Tutors
    Psychic Frog
    Nethergoyf
    Orcish Bowmasters
    Wight of the Reliquary
    Nadu
    1 Nomads en-Kor
    1 Bristly Bill, Spine Sower
    1 Springheart Nantuko
    1 Sylvan Safekeeper
    1 Scryb Ranger (blocks Psychic Frog!)

    You could play a lot of the best current creatures in Legacy alongside Nadu support.
    Yeah, that's what I'm playing now, thanks for the suggestion! You can see a little discussion on the list I'm testing, or one of several lists Im testing, in the stream linked yesterday.

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Thanks! I just watched a bit of the video.

    That build looks GUWb, with a lot of interesting tech. Nice to see Merieke back with Scryb Ranger! Phelia has so many synergies too. Tamiyo may be less good: it's mana hungry and you have fewer spells than tempo decks.

    Have you tried a black-heavier GBuw Nadu build to also incorporate the new black powerhouse creatures: Psychic Frog, Bowmasters, black Goyfs, etc? The average creature quality might rise, leading to less variance in the early game before you can assemble the late-game engines. It would likely be more graveyard-centric: maybe Fiend Artisan, Wight of the Reliquary, Meren.

    Did you avoid that direction on purpose to keep a high blue count for Force? With the top decks being Reanimator & fair decks (Eldrazi, UB, Red Stompy, Cradle Control) & creature-based combo (Nadu, Painter), maybe Force isn't needed. Endurance & Faerie Macabre can fight Reanimator arguably as well as Force. Getting to run your own Frogs has a lot of benefits.

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Thanks! I just watched a bit of the video.

    That build looks GUWb, with a lot of interesting tech. Nice to see Merieke back with Scryb Ranger! Phelia has so many synergies too. Tamiyo may be less good: it's mana hungry and you have fewer spells than tempo decks.

    Have you tried a black-heavier GBuw Nadu build to also incorporate the new black powerhouse creatures: Psychic Frog, Bowmasters, black Goyfs, etc? The average creature quality might rise, leading to less variance in the early game before you can assemble the late-game engines. It would likely be more graveyard-centric: maybe Fiend Artisan, Wight of the Reliquary, Meren.
    I played both Tamiyo and Frog in a build recently and I liked Tamiyo better, but I'll keep changing and testing them.

    It was nice to play Merieke again and she can have quite the impact on a game, but in order to fit sideboard Taiga and Pyroblasts I think I cut her for a fourth Abundant Growth. I made several cuts so it's not entirely clear which card was cut for what. Anyway, my priority now is to improve the matchup vs Eldrazi and Nadu decks, if possible. So that's why I'm adding sideboard Pyroblasts (hence adding 4th Abundant Growth). As for Eldrazi, I'm thinking creatively about that but may need to go for Harbinger. Or maybe add Nadu combo elements.

    I think there's too much graveyard hate in maindecks now to play Meren (edit: not Merieke which I accidentally wrote), Witness is a bit more flexible and has Phelia synergy so I'm on that for now, also it brings back Wasteland and fits better in a tempo-oriented metagame. But that change is always a consideration.

    Scryb Ranger was pretty good, it has great synergy with Nadu and then it just stonewalls a bunch of blue creatures (Atraxa, Frog etc). And with surveil lands it's suddenly library manipulation too. And protecting lands vs Wasteland of course, and getting an extra mana if you don't have a land drop, and vigilance to your Nadu for blocking duty. As long as opponent's aren't playing many Bowmasters it's great.

    I haven't tried Wight yet. I can't see good usecases for it, at some point I'll try it. I think it requires more focus on utility lands and also having more creatures to sacrifice, so that's a bit much deck building restrictions. But I was thinking of just maximizing tutors in a list and see what works out.

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Thanks! I just watched a bit of the video.
    Did you avoid that direction on purpose to keep a high blue count for Force? With the top decks being Reanimator & fair decks (Eldrazi, UB, Red Stompy, Cradle Control) & creature-based combo (Nadu, Painter), maybe Force isn't needed. Endurance & Faerie Macabre can fight Reanimator arguably as well as Force. Getting to run your own Frogs has a lot of benefits.
    Yeah I think you make another good explanation as to why FoW isn't as clutch as it might sometimes be, Nadu decks play Cavern and/or Halfling, Painter plays blasts, vs Reanimator Leyline is better in the sideboard, I think especially Vexing Bauble existing is going to influence how much play Force sees. But that easily develops into a rock-paper-scissorcs-metagame development, perhaps.

    I think the white cards are best and the black cards are more a matter of preference. I started the Nadu decks playing more black and less white, with Fiend Artisan for example, but quickly during testing it evolved into more white than black, and now I think the next test might be cutting maindeck black for more maindeck red. But I'm evaluating other options too. So many alternatives!

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