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Thread: MTG Arena General Discussion

  1. #581

    Re: MTG Arena

    Who had on the arena sweepstake 'after our update you are now locked out of your account and we do not care' ?

    https://www.reddit.com/r/MagicArena/...irely_useless/

  2. #582

    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by jmlima View Post
    Who had on the arena sweepstake 'after our update you are now locked out of your account and we do not care' ?

    https://www.reddit.com/r/MagicArena/...irely_useless/
    Wizards sets the bar even higher.

  3. #583

    Re: MTG Arena


  4. #584
    Hamburglar Hlelpler
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    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by jmlima View Post
    Rosewater talks to players the way men that hate their wives explain the home finances. "Honey, the whole reason we have a savings account is..."
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    Creature type - 'Fuck you mooooooom'
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  5. #585
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    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by TsumiBand View Post
    Rosewater talks to players the way men that hate their wives explain the home finances. "Honey, the whole reason we have a savings account is..."
    You're right, but in fairness to him, Arena is succeeding in that, whether we like it or not.

    I started playing Arena, idk, a week ago, and it feels like a substantially different game from real MtG. And some amount of fun is being had, though I can't say I'm interested in spending any money on it at this juncture.
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  6. #586
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    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce View Post
    You're right, but in fairness to him, Arena is succeeding in that, whether we like it or not.

    I started playing Arena, idk, a week ago, and it feels like a substantially different game from real MtG. And some amount of fun is being had, though I can't say I'm interested in spending any money on it at this juncture.
    I know that MaRo makes the claim that players feedback is different from wHaT wE tHiNk iT iS but I would like some player facing data to confirm that apart from Blogatog posts. The issue to leave Historic as-is (or as-was, whatever) is one of the biggest current issues on the Arena Bugs and Suggestions page and their social media is being swamped by players that hate it.

    I get that message boards don't necessarily represent the majority but watching the occasional "whee I love Alchemy" posts get ratioed, and my own personal experience of much longer queue times in Historic Brawl, I'm not sure what else to assume except that people aren't really feeling it.
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  7. #587

    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by TsumiBand View Post
    I know that MaRo makes the claim that players feedback is different from wHaT wE tHiNk iT iS but I would like some player facing data to confirm that apart from Blogatog posts. The issue to leave Historic as-is (or as-was, whatever) is one of the biggest current issues on the Arena Bugs and Suggestions page and their social media is being swamped by players that hate it.

    I get that message boards don't necessarily represent the majority but watching the occasional "whee I love Alchemy" posts get ratioed, and my own personal experience of much longer queue times in Historic Brawl, I'm not sure what else to assume except that people aren't really feeling it.
    I think, certainly from my perspective what I think will be the ultimate decider is how frequent the changes to alchemized cards will be and how much they screw decks. Let's face it, wildcards in Arena have a substantial cost in time or money. This is not heartstone where there are no land cards and top rarities are restricted to either 1 or 2 of each card. This is MTG where a manabase can set you back 20 rares. So, when faced with a decision on how to use my wildcards, do I create a deck that is based on a certain card that, if the deck proves sufficiently popular, will be nerfed? This is a real concern here. Last thing they want is to empty Arena from all the players that have to make that type of choices to only keep those with money or time to spend. The MTGO'zation of Arena is not what they want, but it is very likely to be what they will get with this scheme.

    One thing is for certain, looking at this year's festive schedule, they are going to push alchemy like hell, which means they are not about to reverse course on it.

  8. #588
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    Re: MTG Arena

    I will say that it's really, really, really good that none of the new Alchemical swills is legal in Legacy.
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  9. #589
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    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce View Post
    I will say that it's really, really, really good that none of the new Alchemical swills is legal in Legacy.
    Well, yeah, I mean - how do you implement perpetual effects in Legacy, or conjuring cards, or any of it at all?

    I think the thing that's bugging me the most is that they don't even seem to think about *why* digital TCGs do this kind of randomization. They found out early in Hearthstone that when you take drawing land out of the equation your games play out very similarly. The RNG is there because they needed a way to keep a similar level of randomization, while having an alternative to the "draw land and play it" mana system of MTG. Since a ton of digital TCGs can skirt the mana issue in this way, they implement it in similar ways.

    Alchemy just adds one more layer of RNG on top of that so you have all of the feelbads of random chance going one player's way and none of the upside involved in introducing that randomness. Imagine getting fucked on land while your opponent is just getting pure gas off of Tome of the Infinite in addition to just drawing normally. It's a very stupid situation to be in, and it ought to be opt-in across formats, not just jammed in because "all digital tcgs are doing it". Like if they wanted to go whole-hog with it they should have just had an Alchemy format that was also landless; it'd be derivative as hell, but it'd be honest, and maybe even tolerable.
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    EDIT: Tsumi, you are silly.

  10. #590

    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by TsumiBand View Post
    ...
    Alchemy just adds one more layer of RNG on top of that so you have all of the feelbads of random chance going one player's way and none of the upside involved in introducing that randomness. Imagine getting fucked on land while your opponent is just getting pure gas off of Tome of the Infinite in addition to just drawing normally. It's a very stupid situation to be in, and it ought to be opt-in across formats, not just jammed in because "all digital tcgs are doing it". Like if they wanted to go whole-hog with it they should have just had an Alchemy format that was also landless; it'd be derivative as hell, but it'd be honest, and maybe even tolerable.
    I find even more stupid things like the fact that you cannot play Lightning Bolt, but you can play a card that each time it swings places 4 Lightning Bolts in your deck.

  11. #591

    Re: MTG Arena

    Is it me or has arena been even buggier since they introduced alchemy?

    I did their stupid sealed event just to drop out because my Jadar refused to make tokens after it did in the first game.

  12. #592

    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by Zoid View Post
    Is it me or has arena been even buggier since they introduced alchemy?

    I did their stupid sealed event just to drop out because my Jadar refused to make tokens after it did in the first game.
    The latest update wasn't very stable, no

  13. #593
    Hamburglar Hlelpler
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    Re: MTG Arena

    I've seldom had stability issues with the client. "Works on my machine", lel

    I think adding named cards to a deck that's already Red is probably not the worst thing to play around, I mean you can plan for exactly what the card does and it's doing something Red already does. Some of these other effects where you're tutoring for random outside effects are more damaging to the game in terms of reasonably prepping for counterplay. Neither player really knows what Tome is gonna do, it could whiff horribly or give the player a huge advantage. The problem is it's being decided by luck, it's always going to roll in favor of one player and against the other. It's not a power level concern, it's just a stupid mechanic in a game that's already got enough rng.

    That's why I keep comparing it to Mario Party/Mario Kart; it could be a banana peel or it could be a blue shell (and lol dammit, you're only supposed to get blue shells when you're behind, so it's worse than that) but whatever it is, neither player really gets to plan around it, you can either interact with Tome itself or you can't. Whatever pops out is whatever pops out, and someone's gonna feel bad, and we already know that that's shitty gameplay from all the other digital tcgs that tried to do things that way, so why Magic wants to replicate it makes no sense.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dissection View Post
    Creature type - 'Fuck you mooooooom'
    Quote Originally Posted by Secretly.A.Bee View Post
    EDIT: Tsumi, you are silly.

  14. #594

    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by TsumiBand View Post
    I've seldom had stability issues with the client. "Works on my machine", lel

    I think adding named cards to a deck that's already Red is probably not the worst thing to play around, I mean you can plan for exactly what the card does and it's doing something Red already does. Some of these other effects where you're tutoring for random outside effects are more damaging to the game in terms of reasonably prepping for counterplay. Neither player really knows what Tome is gonna do, it could whiff horribly or give the player a huge advantage. The problem is it's being decided by luck, it's always going to roll in favor of one player and against the other. It's not a power level concern, it's just a stupid mechanic in a game that's already got enough rng.

    That's why I keep comparing it to Mario Party/Mario Kart; it could be a banana peel or it could be a blue shell (and lol dammit, you're only supposed to get blue shells when you're behind, so it's worse than that) but whatever it is, neither player really gets to plan around it, you can either interact with Tome itself or you can't. Whatever pops out is whatever pops out, and someone's gonna feel bad, and we already know that that's shitty gameplay from all the other digital tcgs that tried to do things that way, so why Magic wants to replicate it makes no sense.
    One could almost say that RNG in games that aren't designed around it are bad.
    Who knew?

  15. #595
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    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by Zoid View Post
    One could almost say that RNG in games that aren't designed around it are bad.
    Who knew?
    I think the opposite is true here and Magic's inherent randomness doesn't need another layer on top to "keep things interesting". We have to draw mana sources where most digital games do not; these other games can build decks that are pure gas. There's no mana screw in LoR or Hearthstone and mana denial is also near unplayable or non-existent, and with games like Hearthstone you also have hero powers which guarantee you'll at least be doing something on turn 2. Those games have to spam random effects in order to up the variance or else your matchups are essentially already decides.

    Magic doesn't need this shit to keep the variance at an acceptable level, but the Arena devs either don't know that or don't care.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Secretly.A.Bee View Post
    EDIT: Tsumi, you are silly.

  16. #596

    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by TsumiBand View Post
    I think the opposite is true here and Magic's inherent randomness doesn't need another layer on top to "keep things interesting". We have to draw mana sources where most digital games do not; these other games can build decks that are pure gas. There's no mana screw in LoR or Hearthstone and mana denial is also near unplayable or non-existent, and with games like Hearthstone you also have hero powers which guarantee you'll at least be doing something on turn 2. Those games have to spam random effects in order to up the variance or else your matchups are essentially already decides.

    Magic doesn't need this shit to keep the variance at an acceptable level, but the Arena devs either don't know that or don't care.
    The difference is that Magic is (was) designed around random draws but deterministic effects.
    That is just the mechanics of how card games work.

    Unless the game is designed for "play this card and lets see what RNG does with it" most players are going to have a bad time.
    The only players who enjoy true randomness are the ones that are so bad they can't win consistently without RNG.

    On that note has anyone played the valve digital TCG Artifact?
    The original version had a bit too much RNG but was pretty solid.
    Sadly people were throwing a fit because they expected a freemium game and not something like MTGO.
    It also didn't lend itself to being easily watchable on Twitch.
    A few devs actually redid the game a while ago which was imo much better but I still kind of lost interest.
    At this point I'm close to giving it another try.

  17. #597
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    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by jmlima View Post
    I find even more stupid things like the fact that you cannot play Lightning Bolt, but you can play a card that each time it swings places 4 Lightning Bolts in your deck.
    Yeah, that's the thing that irked me. That and the 2-mana tribal scaling (lol) ramp guy with Protection from Power Word: Kill.
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    Just in time for Valentines Day 💝

    Roses are red, violets are blue
    Omae wa mou shindeiru
    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    Quick question, are you also still waiting for the great pumpkin it did you finally pick it in once December hit?
    Quote Originally Posted by iatee View Post
    I am tired of malicious top 8s and it is time to put an end to the practice.

  18. #598

    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew View Post
    This has been the appeal to me, especially in the current reality where an unwashed mouth-breather can get you sick.
    I don't like your post.

    First of all don't disseminate the "Magic players are people of bad hygiene standards" meme, it stopped being funny two decades ago and you're just gratuitously rude.
    There are mandatory face masks since the covid outbreak, so you shouldn't be able to discern any mouth-breather even if they'd try to mouth-breathe you to death. Not to mention that it's not really empathetic to mock someone's health issue.
    Also, unless you are an octogenarian or severely immunocompromised, there's not much reason for your germophobia, I guess you won't die from omicron induced runny nose. And there are several safe and working vaccines available to boost your antibodies, too.

  19. #599

    Re: MTG Arena

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Hack View Post
    Also, unless you are an octogenarian or severely immunocompromised, there's not much reason for your germophobia, I guess you won't die from omicron induced runny nose. And there are several safe and working vaccines available to boost your antibodies, too.
    You were doing so well! Why did you add this?

  20. #600
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    Re: MTG Arena

    Alright, before I need to start editing and/or deleting posts, lets leave it there. Thanks.
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