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Thread: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

  1. #1041

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    I see... makes sense. Think I will shift the 4th Painter to main aswell and see if I like. I'm always a bit reluctant when it comes to change, so yesterday was the first time I played the deck with the 4 Bolts in side instead of main and the first time actually trying out the copters.
    They were a blast. Totally underestimated that card. That was another change I should've made earlier. Guess the maindeck Bolts were primarily for fighting Arcanist. If this holds truth when Ragavan hits paper - Time will tell.

    I think I liked the wishable Painter so much, because I'm usually a control player and as the deck has some nice prison elements, I've always leaned towards locking the game up first and then going for the 100% sure kill. That way having 6 plus mana was seldomly a problem, sitting there with multiple weldereffects, moon and bridge with an opponent basically unable to intervene with what I'm about to do. Often not even going for the Painter right away with Karn but rather looking for some more shenanigans.
    I'm simply lacking the predatory comboplayer skills to see my turn two or three "go for it" window after all the Counterbalances I've hidden behind :D

    Part of what I like most about the deck are the sheer resilience, amount of shenanigans and the load of routes that are unforeseeable for the opponent. It's just the kind of deck that makes me smirk from one ear to another while constantly feeling like I've next leveled my opponent into oblivion. Friggin' awesome deck.

    Thx for the answers.

    Edit.. also I liked the added flexibility of wishable Painter..

  2. #1042
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Kap'n Cook View Post
    Wanted to give a quick Modern Horizons 2 update. List first:

    4 Ancient Tomb
    3 City of Traitors
    3 Bloodstained Mire
    2 Wooded Foothills
    4 Mountain
    2 Plateau
    1 Great Furnace

    2 Urza's Saga
    3 Lotus Petal
    1 Lion's Eye Diamond
    1 Simian Spirit Guide

    4 Imperial Recruiter
    4 Painter's Servant
    3 Goblin Engineer
    3 Goblin Welder
    1 Goblin Cratermaker
    1 Ethersworn Canonist

    3 Grindstone
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Blood Moon

    4 Pyroblast
    4 Lightning Bolt

    2 Enlightened Tutor
    3 Karn, the Great Creator


    side:

    1 Lotus Petal
    1 Grindstone
    1 Engineered Explosives
    1 Walking Ballista
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    3 Surgical Extraction
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Rip Apart
    1 Magus of the Moon


    Saga is crazy good. I quickly went up to two copies after trying the first. They quickly snowball, and the uncounterable beaters/welder fodder plus LED/Petal/Stone and sideboard Crypt is amazing. Saga plus Painter is also an easy turn 3 win. I have aspirations of a third but need a lot more testing to see what sticks out.

    The four bolts are a concession to Ragavan and UR delver, which appears to be the new deck of choice. We line up well, being able to block and play bolts and blast the new dragon, but it's still a very tough matchup. Saga helps here too providing more mana around Daze, and so far every time I've gotten Wastelanded, it's always been the Saga over Plateau/Sol land. Pressure off our Tombs is actually huge. I've been regularly e-tutoring for a Saga to hit my land drop and to just provide insane value over three turns.

    The EE and Ballista are quick flex spots for 1 drop delver and whatever else, one of those spots will 100% be Portable hole. There are a lot of other moving pieces with the metagame right now that a lot could change, but this is where I'm starting
    Since you seem to be one of the most successful players with this deck, I tested this list as well for something like a 100 or so games. Here are my notes:

    1 - Mycosynth Lattice deserves a sb slot: upping the land count allows you to consistently play it much easily. Against control decks you can drop Karn, -2 to get and play Petal, then if you have another mana source in hand you're capable of slamming Lattice into play the very next turn. I like the idea of Karn not just being an oversized tutor engine but also a real threat, capable of winning in spite of a Pithing Needle that's naming Grindstone.

    2 - The aggro plan is weaker than ever: while Sagas are nuts indeed, very few games ended with me winning through beats (actually, they are 3, one against Standstill, one against U/B shadow, and one against Bant Control). I feel that from here we have two routes: upgrading the aggro plan or going all-in for the combo. If we want to keep the pseudo-aggro alternative plan i feel we should add Smuggler's Copter to the mix again. This would also make Recruiter better again, since more often than not they sit in play doing absolutely nothing and i've been tempted to swap the 4th Recruiter for the 4th Goblin Engineer. If we want to abandon the aggro plan, then i feel we could probably go heavier on white, cut the Bolts and substitute then with Swords to Plowshares. This would give us more defense against decks like shadow, Thespian-Depths combo, and even reanimator, but it would make the manabase more fragile than now.

    3 - Rip Apart's not very performing: maybe it's me and i've been unfortunate with pairings but the enchantment issues seem so rare that i'm not sure they are worth their sb slots. Abdrade looks better in so many situations, first of all because i'm happy to side it against the rampant UR delver, while i'm not so enthusiastic to do so with Rip Apart due to color requirements

    4 - Is Meekstone worth a sb slot?: I'm not sure with this but it's a good artifact fetchable with Saga as a sort of 2-class Ensnaring Bridge. I tried it and it shone in some occasions

    Please let me know what you think, the real-life 180 men tournament is approaching (next week) and i'm willing to give this a spin!

  3. #1043
    Bob Ross
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Davek View Post
    Since you seem to be one of the most successful players with this deck, I tested this list as well for something like a 100 or so games. Here are my notes:

    1 - Mycosynth Lattice deserves a sb slot: upping the land count allows you to consistently play it much easily. Against control decks you can drop Karn, -2 to get and play Petal, then if you have another mana source in hand you're capable of slamming Lattice into play the very next turn. I like the idea of Karn not just being an oversized tutor engine but also a real threat, capable of winning in spite of a Pithing Needle that's naming Grindstone.

    2 - The aggro plan is weaker than ever: while Sagas are nuts indeed, very few games ended with me winning through beats (actually, they are 3, one against Standstill, one against U/B shadow, and one against Bant Control). I feel that from here we have two routes: upgrading the aggro plan or going all-in for the combo. If we want to keep the pseudo-aggro alternative plan i feel we should add Smuggler's Copter to the mix again. This would also make Recruiter better again, since more often than not they sit in play doing absolutely nothing and i've been tempted to swap the 4th Recruiter for the 4th Goblin Engineer. If we want to abandon the aggro plan, then i feel we could probably go heavier on white, cut the Bolts and substitute then with Swords to Plowshares. This would give us more defense against decks like shadow, Thespian-Depths combo, and even reanimator, but it would make the manabase more fragile than now.

    3 - Rip Apart's not very performing: maybe it's me and i've been unfortunate with pairings but the enchantment issues seem so rare that i'm not sure they are worth their sb slots. Abdrade looks better in so many situations, first of all because i'm happy to side it against the rampant UR delver, while i'm not so enthusiastic to do so with Rip Apart due to color requirements

    4 - Is Meekstone worth a sb slot?: I'm not sure with this but it's a good artifact fetchable with Saga as a sort of 2-class Ensnaring Bridge. I tried it and it shone in some occasions

    Please let me know what you think, the real-life 180 men tournament is approaching (next week) and i'm willing to give this a spin!

    You bring up some interesting points, I think the meta in general has already evolved from where we were two weeks ago when everyone was overreacting to UR delver and calling for bannings. For some data, my first 38 mh2 matches were a 53% win rate, with the next 54 matches (pretty much 3 saga) at a 81% wr.

    A lot of the removal is now exile based, with many decks playing white for Prismatic Ending. This complicates a couple things, you can't as easily leave naked Grindstones lying around. You hope the Goblins eat removal, but in general they are having more trouble than before trying to act as protection. I have some ideas for small tweaks, but I really just want to practice various maindeck builds against the meta before Portable Hole comes out in two weeks.

    To your points:

    1) You're right that I should revisit testing Lattice with Sagas now. The line of just jamming Saga and then grabbing Led for Karn to then wish for something is very real. It also solves scenarios where you end up with only those two cards and haven't drawn a recruiter, or can't reasonably entomb something with Engineer.

    2) Sure, the Copter beats were always a nice side avenue for the deck, and I have been missing the ability to block fliers. Moreso I've been missing the filtering. The overall problem is that I don't see where to fit copters in, and I don't know if that's a knock on recruiter. He's usually one of the best cards for enabling combo, in that the ability to block and tutor to hand is subtle card advantage something like Engineer can't provide. There are enough games where you need Cratermaker too. Feel free to chop, but a big reason I've always liked the deck is just playing the full set.

    3) Rip Apart - yea I could see dropping these once Hole is out. There are enough Sylvan Libraries out there that it's been nice to have these as an answer, and I like their ability to pressure a Karn in play compared to Abrade. I don't board in Rip apart against Delver, because of the whtie which is another knock. There are arguments that we should just run Prismatic Ending

    4) Certainly worth testing, I like that you can flex a Beta Meekstone on all the Walmart Delver players before dying to a Ragavan self assembling Painter and Stone on it's own lol. It competes with Bridge, but another Saga target could be nice. Might need 4 sagas in this case


    The broader things I'm seeing right now are the rise in Depths and midrange decks now that people have started to learn the Delver matchups. It's interesting that Ragavan completely cannibalizes the Delver mirror, as you are playing a second copy of your deck, so one Monkey hit and you are up a mana for Daze and up a card. So they have completely inbred their decks into this one drop UR pile, with separate midrange brews like Rug Delver and newer stoneblade lists popping up. Then the bigger control decks like Bant/UW/Bug. Saga is also a major player, and more people are prepared with Wasteland decks and ways to tutor it up

    Saga is still better than Copter, but I miss the filtering. As much of a meme it is, I might end up trying a single Brainstone since that's also a Saga target, and I wouldn't mind it as a value Engineer target. The ideal case is being able to move the bolts back to the board. That solves the lack of beatdown transition back towards a combo-control weird stack deck that hides behind bridge and counters your stuff

    I could envision a build like this:

    4 Ancient Tomb
    2 City of Traitors
    3 Bloodstained Mire
    2 Wooded Foothills
    4 Mountain
    2 Plateau
    1 Great Furnace

    3 Urza's Saga
    3 Lotus Petal
    1 Lion's Eye Diamond
    1 Simian Spirit Guide

    4 Imperial Recruiter
    4 Painter's Servant
    3 Goblin Engineer
    3 Goblin Welder
    1 Goblin Cratermaker

    3 Grindstone
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Blood Moon
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Portable Hole

    4 Pyroblast
    2 Red Elemental Blast

    1 Brainstone
    2 Enlightened Tutor
    3 Karn, the Great Creator


    side:

    1 Grindstone
    1 Lotus Petal
    3 Surgical Extraction
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Portable Hole
    1 Pithing Needle
    4 Lightning Bolt
    1 Magus of the Moon
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
    #FreeNedleeds

  4. #1044
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Thank you for the quick reply. In order to raise to 80+% your win-rate, did you drop the bolts as suggested by your potential new list or just swap a city of traitors for the third saga?

  5. #1045
    Bob Ross
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Davek View Post
    Thank you for the quick reply. In order to raise to 80+% your win-rate, did you drop the bolts as suggested by your potential new list or just swap a city of traitors for the third saga?
    Here's the list:


    4 Ancient Tomb
    2 City of Traitors
    3 Bloodstained Mire
    2 Wooded Foothills
    4 Mountain
    2 Plateau
    1 Great Furnace

    3 Urza's Saga
    3 Lotus Petal
    1 Lion's Eye Diamond
    1 Simian Spirit Guide

    4 Imperial Recruiter
    4 Painter's Servant
    3 Goblin Engineer
    3 Goblin Welder
    1 Goblin Cratermaker

    3 Grindstone
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Blood Moon

    4 Pyroblast
    4 Lightning Bolt

    2 Enlightened Tutor
    3 Karn, the Great Creator


    side:

    1 Grindstone
    1 Lotus Petal
    3 Surgical Extraction
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Pithing Needle
    1 Walking Ballista
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Rip Apart
    1 Magus of the Moon
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
    #FreeNedleeds

  6. #1046
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Thank you again! Now, a question about sideboarding: against show and tell/emrakul in general, do you bring in Crypt or do you leave it out as a target for Karn? Wouldn't it be better to cut a Surgical for an additional Crypt/Lantern so that you can keep one in the the deck and the other for Karn's wishboard?

  7. #1047
    Bob Ross
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Davek View Post
    Thank you again! Now, a question about sideboarding: against show and tell/emrakul in general, do you bring in Crypt or do you leave it out as a target for Karn? Wouldn't it be better to cut a Surgical for an additional Crypt/Lantern so that you can keep one in the the deck and the other for Karn's wishboard?
    Depends on the emrakul deck - sneak/omni/post/tin fins, but the main way against sneak/omni Iíve been doing is

    -3 stone, -1 led, -1 moon, -1 karn, -1 painter, -4 bolt, +1 petal,+3 surgical, +2 blast, +1 canonist, +1 bridge, +1 needle, +2 rip apart

    this gives the best control approach to the matchup, you have a ton of live drops off show and tell and tutors to get bridge in play. ideal scenario is canonist/painter in play with blast in hand. Usually you need to answer two attempts, by then you either hope you can beat down or get a karn and go -2 stone -2 crypt. itís still a three card combo but karn acts as a pseudo 2 card and letís you go heavy stax and keep the dead stuff in the side
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
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  8. #1048

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Iíve been noticing that having all these urzas sagas means that weíre more Ďgung-hoí into finding stone via the last saga level.

    My thinking is that 3 saga, 2 stone, 2 etutor, 3 engineer, 3 karn should really be enough to find the stone, right?

    Isnít it better off then, to go down a stone, and use one more slot as hate vs whatever the meta is? I was thinking of a pyrokinesis main, since itís so good vs a bunch of little dorks, and it could give us even more flexibility at a not very large cost in deckbuilding.

    Ive also played a bit with dragon rage channeler, and let me tell ya; if youíve never had the pleasure of paying R, blasting a land, AND feeding your welder via surveil, you gotta try it. Even if itís just meme-good. It feels great.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Legacy decks: mono U painter, strawberry shortcake, imperial painter, solidarity, burn
    EDH decks: zedruu voltron, rakdos the defiler, persistent petitioners, blind seer

  9. #1049
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    So, yesterday the 170-men tournament went pretty well, for i managed to top8 it! Basically, i listened to the suggestions of both of you guys, because i listed a pretty similar list to the one that Kap'n kindly shared while i ended up shaving 1 grindstone and 1 petal for 2 of my beloved copters. Sideboard differences in comparison to Kap'n were 1 lattice and 1 meekstone instead of walking ballista and magus of the moon. Ended 6-1-1 with an intentional final draw, losing only to ug show and tell and beating 2 jeskai miracles, food chain, TES, Death and taxes and Bug delver with chain of smog combo. Deck felt awesome and we ended up splitting top8 prizes

  10. #1050
    Bob Ross
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Davek View Post
    So, yesterday the 170-men tournament went pretty well, for i managed to top8 it! Basically, i listened to the suggestions of both of you guys, because i listed a pretty similar list to the one that Kap'n kindly shared while i ended up shaving 1 grindstone and 1 petal for 2 of my beloved copters. Sideboard differences in comparison to Kap'n were 1 lattice and 1 meekstone instead of walking ballista and magus of the moon. Ended 6-1-1 with an intentional final draw, losing only to ug show and tell and beating 2 jeskai miracles, food chain, TES, Death and taxes and Bug delver with chain of smog combo. Deck felt awesome and we ended up splitting top8 prizes

    Shortcake Tier 0

    The meta in general seems extremely wide open, that's a pretty big spread of decks you faced

    The copter additions I like a lot for a more tanky build. Playing with the bolts and Sagas gives a ton more beatdown presence and ability to block Delver and the red one.

    I usually like to build toward full combo redundancy, so I'll probably always play the full four stones in the 75. I don't see a problem shaving one to play more like a Trinket Mage era Blue Red style painter deck though
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
    #FreeNedleeds

  11. #1051
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Wanted to give my DnD list update now that Portable Hole is available on mtgo. Been through maybe 4 leagues, decent performance so far, mostly been testing manabase configs:


    Strawberry Shortcake 7/9/21

    4 Ancient Tomb
    2 City of Traitors
    3 Bloodstained Mire
    2 Wooded Foothills
    3 Mountain
    3 Plateau
    1 Great Furnace

    4 Urza's Saga
    3 Lotus Petal
    1 Lion's Eye Diamond
    1 Simian Spirit Guide

    3 Grindstone
    1 Brainstone
    1 Portable Hole
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Ensnaring Bridge

    4 Imperial Recruiter
    4 Painter's Servant
    3 Goblin Engineer
    3 Goblin Welder
    1 Goblin Cratermaker

    4 Pyroblast
    4 Lightning Bolt

    1 Enlightened Tutor
    2 Karn, the Great Creator


    side:

    1 Lotus Petal
    1 Grindstone
    1 Pithing Needle
    1 Portable Hole
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    3 Surgical Extraction
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    1 Magus of the Moon
    1 Karn, the Great Creator
    1 Karakas




    I've been steadily working in Urza's Saga in greater numbers, and the card is probably too good not to run the full set of. That has made the manabase and playstyle a bit different, as a lot of times you are operating on colorless mana only. There were enough hands I've wanted to keep that didn't have a permanent red source in them that would come back to bite me. I've been mentioning how Saga is a lightning rod for Wasteland, I think going up to three Plateau for color stability can work. Otherwise I'll just go back to the usual 4/2 split. Getting a fifth fetch back in is also a way to help the red count, and I plan on leaning more heavily on Brainstone to fix flooding, where fetch will help too. There's 22 lands now in the deck, I've always run 19. The deck is super mana hungry with Saga construct production, so I'm hoping the extra lands aren't really that bad.


    For the board, when I was running Rip Apart and Prismatic Ending they always felt like a bit extra. It was tough finding cards to cut to bring them in too. With Hole now, we have so much coverage against the majority of cards you'll run into. That freed up some space, where a card I've never run but I think makes sense right now is Karakas. It gives us a lot more game against Reanimator and Depths, while just being more mana against Delver and bouncing Ragavan. It's an angle Painter usually doesn't have, and I feel like the effect helps some of our harder matchups. The last card was just Karn. There isn't anything I really want to run instead, and getting the third copy back in the 75 gives a lot more post board flexibility
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
    #FreeNedleeds

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