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Thread: 4 Card Blind

  1. #5421
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    I don't have all results yet, but after doing some napkin math for the remaining matches, it looks like I can safely lock in the bannings for the last round. Out are:
    Ancient Spring
    Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar
    Cabal Therapist
    Chronomaton
    Containment Priest
    Fury
    Solitude
    Tidehollow Sculler

    I'll cough up a deck and open the last round for the season shortly.


    EDIT and now the correct ones: pending definitive results, looks like these are our standings for the season, going into the final round:
    1. dte: 50,5
    2. silkster: 47,5
    3. PJim: 47,2
    4. alphastryk: 44,5
    5. maxx!: 43,2
    6. FTW: 43,2
    7. Serguei: 42,2
    8. GoblinSmashmaster: 41,6
    9. RoosterCocoa: 37,1
    10. mattamort: 34,9
    11. Wrath of Pie: 31,9
    12. Tylert: 29,6
    13. Reeplcheep: 28,3
    14. Asthereal (TO): 24,9
    15. jhhdk: 21,7
    16. Phasmoid: 17,1
    17. H: 10
    18. shiftyhomunculus: 3,1

    That's a 2,2 (EDIT: nope, 3 points!) point lead for dte, which is (still) a lot, but not a lot a lot.
    I'll be opening the round in a minute. Let's get the finale going!
    Last edited by Asthereal; 10-13-2021 at 01:04 PM.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  2. #5422
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    THE FINAL ROUND OF SEASON 10: DEVIANT LEGACY BANNATHON has started.

    This round we play Sphere of Resistance: All spells cost one additional generic mana to cast.

    I have PM'ed myself my deck for round 15, so you can start sending me your decks.

    DEADLINE: Wednesday the 13th of October at 11:00AM Central European Time.
    (That's my time zone. Pacific Time it'll probably be something like Tuesday night a bit past midnight, so keep that in mind.)

    PLEASE NOTE:
    The way you send your deck to me matters. Please send it in the way described below, so it doesn't cost me an hour of editing before I can post all the decks.
    Please send your deck as follows: Mountain, Cathedral of War, Cathedral of War, Goblin Guide.
    So with card tags around each card, and not above eachother, and with your Username and 4CB S10R15 in the topic.
    Don't forget to keep an eye on the banned list. You'll find it in the second post of the thread, or in our Google Spreadsheet.

    After the deadline has passed, I will post all decks on the forum here, and you can start puzzling out your scores.
    If you have any questions, please read the first two posts of this thread first. If you can't find the answer there, drop a message here. We'll answer a.s.a.p.

    Happy deck building!
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  3. #5423

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    I've been a bit busy the past week and haven't had time to calculate my results from this round, but at a glance I don't see any disagreements. I'll try to calculate my scores for this last round and the final round this week.

  4. #5424

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    I was really excited for the previous round. It turns out it really was too good to be true. I also missed the fact that Priest doesn't stop evoke (although I recognized this while composing a deck), and together that gave me basically a clean sweep. Then I posted my "success" and went to read the other posts and was very disappointed. I'm glad I wasn't first on the season and had already given up hope of it or I would have been completely demoralized for such a dumb mistake. In any case, I'm hoping for some good diversity this next round. I've got a few ideas, but I can never tell whether they're good.

    If people are still interested in a Season 11, I'd like to repropose Creatures-and-Lands-only Banathon. All the truly broken stuff is non-creature, and all the general good stuff should be gone in about 2-4 weeks and then we'll get all kinds of silly brawls. At least, that's how I imagine it. (I was previously on the fence about the additional rules of: creatures attack each turn; creatures can't block; combat damage can't be prevented, but on revision that all seems unnecessary.)

  5. #5425

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by silkster View Post
    I was really excited for the previous round. It turns out it really was too good to be true. I also missed the fact that Priest doesn't stop evoke (although I recognized this while composing a deck), and together that gave me basically a clean sweep. Then I posted my "success" and went to read the other posts and was very disappointed. I'm glad I wasn't first on the season and had already given up hope of it or I would have been completely demoralized for such a dumb mistake. In any case, I'm hoping for some good diversity this next round. I've got a few ideas, but I can never tell whether they're good.

    If people are still interested in a Season 11, I'd like to repropose Creatures-and-Lands-only Banathon. All the truly broken stuff is non-creature, and all the general good stuff should be gone in about 2-4 weeks and then we'll get all kinds of silly brawls. At least, that's how I imagine it. (I was previously on the fence about the additional rules of: creatures attack each turn; creatures can't block; combat damage can't be prevented, but on revision that all seems unnecessary.)
    I thought I was clever with Chronomaton, but turns out Therapist + Priest + free removal still crushes that plan on the draw via forcing me to play Chronomaton into the removal spell and losing to Therapist beats. I tried, though.

    I am pretty sure that there is way more than 2-4 rounds for the general good stuff, because there is a lot of general good stuff that is highly contextual.

  6. #5426
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Deadline has passed, but I'm missing a few: PJim and alphastryk, by the looks of it.
    Also, I spotted a banned card in one of the entries. I notified the player and will give you guys a bit of extra time while I do work stuff.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  7. #5427

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Sorry, had a rough week. Asthereal - the total scores above are the same as after week 13, you've not added the new scores on.

    6. PJim: Cabal Therapist, Containment Priest, Lightning Skelemental, Fury
    All thought I put into submitting this assumed Fury has flash. As such, it's probably not great. Skelemental probably isn't the right red card.

    vs

    1. Asthereal (TO): Cabal Therapist, Tidehollow Sculler, Fire Imp, Ashen Rider / 3-3
    2. alphastryk: Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar, Cabal Therapist, Containment Priest, Fury / 3-3
    3. Wrath of Pie: Ancient Spring, Chronomaton, Tidehollow Sculler, Containment Priest / 1-4
    4. jhhdk: Mangara of Corondor, Karakas, Burning-tree Emissary, Ghostly Prison / 4-1
    5. dte: Forest, metamorphosis, skyshroud cutter, Aeve, Progenitor Ooze / 4-1, Disagreement. See below.
    7. GoblinSmashmaster: Mogg Fanatic, Restoration Angel, Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, Fury / Edit: 2-2
    8. FTW: Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar, Cabal Therapist, Containment Priest, Pyrokinesis / 3-3
    9. silkster: Asmoranomardicadaistinaculdacar, Fourth Bridge Prowler, Containment Priest, Grist, the Hunger Tide/Swamp / 4-1
    10. RoosterCocoa: Cabal Therapist, Containment Priest, Solitude, Solitude / 3-3
    11. maxx!: Cursecatcher, Mogg Fanatic, Containment Priest, Fury / Edit: 4-1, still a disagreement.
    12. Reeplcheep: Impulsive Pilferer, Swamp, Culling the Weak, Angrath, The Flame Chained / 3-3.

    40 points, fortunately leaving me just out of the top 3 if my results hold. (Not that I imagine Skelemental is seeing much play this week.)

    vs dte, me OTP:
    Vial->1 Therapist | Goes off (2/2, 3/3, 4/4)
    Vial->2 Pass | Attack with all, Priest vials in: 3/3 trades for both, 14-20 (any attack that allows the Priest to trade is roughly equivalent)
    Vial->3 Pass | Pass (trading for the Skelemental is clearly bad)
    Vial->4 Pass | 7-20
    Vial->5 Fury (kill 4/4)

    Leaving it at 7-20 with a 3/3 double striker just about winning the race vs a 2/2.

    Alternatively:
    Vial->1 Therapist | Goes off (2/2, 3/3, 4/4)
    Vial->2 Pass | Pass (Attacking with just the 4/4 is equivalent, Priest vials in and chump blocks)
    Vial->3 Pass | Pass (trading for the Skelemental is still bad)
    Vial->4 Pass | 11-20
    Vial->5 Fury (kill 4/4)

    Leaving it 11-20, with a 3/3 double striker and a 1/1 vs a 3/3 and a 2/2. Attack for 6, 7, 7 wins fast enough, so you can't just attack in response to a Fury attack. Any held back blocker doesn't help as Fury can keep swinging, and Therapist gets used as a chump blocker.
    Last edited by PJim; 10-13-2021 at 12:17 PM.

  8. #5428
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by PJim View Post
    6. PJim: Cabal Therapist, Containment Priest, Lightning Skelemental, Fury
    All thought I put into submitting this assumed Fury has flash. As such, it's probably not great. Skelemental probably isn't the right red card.
    You can't play Lightning Skelemental if you played Containment Priest. That's what makes the card awkward. In most MUs it's just a red card to pitch to Fury.

    Quote Originally Posted by PJim View Post
    7. GoblinSmashmaster: Mogg Fanatic, Restoration Angel, Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker, Fury / 6-0, Disagreement. I see FTW's clever play for why alpha vs Goblin is 2-2, but Lightning Skelemental's discard changes things as he can't hold off until vial @ 4. I think alpha's original lines hold otherwise, so 6-0.
    There's no window to use Skelemental's discard.
    If you make Containment Priest, GS can hold off until Vial @ 4 because you can't play Skelemental while Priest is out. Then GS plays Fury + Resto Angel in the same turn, killing Priest, with empty hand before you can Skelemental back. Nothing to discard and 6 damage isn't enough. You can only use Fury to draw like alpha.

    If you skip Containment Priest and go straight for Skelemental to attack the hand, you don't actually have a threat on board (no 3/3 Asmo like alpha). Cabal Therapist died to Fanatic. Skelemental kills itself. So GS just has to discard Angel + Kiki to Skelemental and keep Fury in hand. If you ever play your Fury first to have a threat, GS makes Fury back to win. So instead you both stare with Vial @ 5. DD again.


    Quote Originally Posted by PJim View Post
    11. maxx!: Cursecatcher, Mogg Fanatic, Containment Priest, Fury / 6-0, Disagreement. OTP I win easy. OTD, I open Therapist, if maxx played Fanatic, he can't Fury, if he doesn't, Therapist will steal Fury. There's nothing to stop my Fury from killing his Priest (and any other creatures in play), and nothing to kill my Priest.
    OTP you win with Cabal Therapist preventing Fury, then Priest locking him out

    OTD Containment Priest.dec can do no worse than draw the "mirror" going first
    T1 M Fanatic
    T1 P Cabal Therapist (dies to Fanatic)

    T2 M Vial @ 2. Pass. Now if you ever make any creatures with Vial, maxx! can "counter" by making Containment Priest in response, exiling your card.
    T2 P Vial @ 2. Stare with same threat.

    If you play your Containment Priest, maxx! counters with his. Then to avoid losing you must evoke Fury to kill it and have no threat left, dying to maxx's Vialed in Fury. Loss.
    If you go up to 3 (skip Priest) and play Skelemental, maxx! counters with Priest and then you can't evoke Fury. Loss.
    If you go up to 5 for Fury, same thing. Loss.
    So you're better off doing nothing and drawing.

    WD 4-1?

  9. #5429

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    When vial is on 2 or 3, there is no reason for me to attack. You cannot win if you vial in a priest. So it is one fury vs a 3/3 and a 2/2 (Fury EtB taking the 4/4) with lower starting life.

  10. #5430
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Edit: Nevermind, I see the confusion. Fury costs 5.
    With Vial @ 4, there is a window for dte to attack and get ahead in life.

    Quote Originally Posted by dte View Post
    When vial is on 2 or 3, there is no reason for me to attack. You cannot win if you vial in a priest. So it is one fury vs a 3/3 and a 2/2 (Fury EtB taking the 4/4) with lower starting life.

    Quote Originally Posted by PJim View Post
    6. PJim: Cabal Therapist, Containment Priest, Lightning Skelemental, Fury
    All thought I put into submitting this assumed Fury has flash. As such, it's probably not great. Skelemental probably isn't the right red card.

    5. dte: Forest, metamorphosis, skyshroud cutter, Aeve, Progenitor Ooze / 4-1, Disagreement. See below.
    Alternatively:
    Vial->1 Therapist | Goes off (2/2, 3/3, 4/4)
    Vial->2 Pass | Pass (Attacking with just the 4/4 is equivalent, Priest vials in and chump blocks)
    Vial->3 Pass | Pass (trading for the Skelemental is still bad)
    Vial->4 Fury (kill 4/4)

    Leaving it 20-20, with a 3/3 double striker and a 1/1 vs a 3/3 and a 2/2. I can attack with Fury and win.

  11. #5431

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Edit: FTW caught the error.

    So with Fury costing 5, instead we have:

    vs dte, me OTP:
    Vial->1 Therapist | Goes off (2/2, 3/3, 4/4)
    Vial->2 Pass | Attack with all, Priest vials in: 3/3 trades for both, 14-20 (any attack that allows the Priest to trade is roughly equivalent)
    Vial->3 Pass | Pass (trading for the Skelemental is clearly bad)
    Vial->4 Pass | 7-20
    Vial->5 Fury (kill 4/4)

    Leaving it at 7-20 with a 3/3 double striker just about winning the race vs a 2/2. (Or 9-20 with an additional 1/1 for me and a 3/3 for dte, making the same result)

    Alternatively:
    Vial->1 Therapist | Goes off (2/2, 3/3, 4/4)
    Vial->2 Pass | Pass (Attacking with just the 4/4 is equivalent, Priest vials in and chump blocks)
    Vial->3 Pass | Pass (trading for the Skelemental is still bad)
    Vial->4 Pass | 11-20
    Vial->5 Fury (kill 4/4)

    Leaving it 11-20, with a 3/3 double striker and a 1/1 vs a 3/3 and a 2/2. Attack for 6, 7, 7 wins fast enough, so you can't just attack in response to a Fury attack. Any held back blocker doesn't help as Fury can keep swinging, and Therapist can be used as a chump blocker.

    So I think it's still 4-1 unless I'm missing something else.

  12. #5432

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by PJim View Post
    Alternatively:
    Vial->1 Therapist | Goes off (2/2, 3/3, 4/4)
    Vial->2 Pass | Pass (Attacking with just the 4/4 is equivalent, Priest vials in and chump blocks)
    Vial->3 Pass | Pass (trading for the Skelemental is still bad)
    Vial->4 Pass | 11-20
    Vial->5 Fury (kill 4/4)

    Leaving it 11-20, with a 3/3 double striker and a 1/1 vs a 3/3 and a 2/2. Attack for 6, 7, 7 wins fast enough, so you can't just attack in response to a Fury attack. Any held back blocker doesn't help as Fury can keep swinging, and Therapist can be used as a chump blocker.

    So I think it's still 4-1 unless I'm missing something else.
    In your system it should be a draw, you attack first with fury alone (or I block therapist), 11-14, I attack with both --> 6-14, then:
    - if you attack with both it is 6-7, I attack with a 3/3 alone --> 3-7, then if you attack with both you lose, if you attack with Fury alone I go to 1, and you have to chump the 3/3, so it is a draw as you cannot attack into a 2/2 blocker.
    - if you attack with Fury alone, it is 6-8, I can attack with both to put you to 1-8 --> draw.

    But the 4-1 for you is still valid I think, as by my account it should be 16-20 on T4 when you are on the play.

  13. #5433

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    I don't know why you'd only do 4 damage to me unless I'm chump blocking with Therapist sooner, but I also hadn't considered that I may as well now swing with Skelemental on my turn 4, so the race is much easier. 4-1 must be the result.

  14. #5434
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by dte View Post
    But the 4-1 for you is still valid I think, as by my account it should be 16-20 on T4 when you are on the play.
    Why 16-20?

    PJim OTP
    T1 Therapist / 4/4 + 3/3 + 2/2
    T2 Vial @ 2, no attacks / Don't suicide into Priest (If Therapist attacks, you block & kill then attack back with 4/4 + 3/3, forcing through 3 damage without Priest able to kill anything)
    T3 Vial @ 3, no attacks / Don't suicide into Skelemental
    T4 Vial @ 4, no attacks / Attack with all for 9
    11-20

    If Therapist chumps the 4/4, life totals are 15-20 with the 1/1 gone. PJim can save 4 life but then needs 4 Fury attacks to kill, while your 3/3+2/2 only need 3 attacks, so Fury can't race.

    If Vial stays at 2-3 -> No one attacks or plays anything -> Draw

    Edit: If Skelemental attacks for 6 on T3, 4/4 + 3/3 + 2/2 attack back for 9 [11-14]. After turn 4 it's [2-14] and PJim can't even draw because dte could swarm around Fury to win.

  15. #5435
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by PJim View Post
    Asthereal - the total scores above are the same as after week 13, you've not added the new scores on.
    Not sure what happened, but you're right. Fixed it, and now dte is even further ahead. Anyway, should be correct now.

    Received a legalized deck and PJim's entry. I'll make some food and post decks afterwards.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  16. #5436

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Edit: If Skelemental attacks for 6 on T3, 4/4 + 3/3 + 2/2 attack back for 9 [11-14]. After turn 4 it's [2-14] and PJim can't even draw because dte could swarm around Fury to win.
    I'm not attacking with it on turn 3, I'm dropping it on turn 4 before ticking vial up.

  17. #5437
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    Deadline has passed, but I'm missing a few: PJim and alphastryk, by the looks of it.
    Also, I spotted a banned card in one of the entries. I notified the player and will give you guys a bit of extra time while I do work stuff.
    I totally missed the timing on this one, will submit something in a moment

  18. #5438

    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    Not sure what happened, but you're right. Fixed it, and now dte is even further ahead. Anyway, should be correct now.

    Received a legalized deck and PJim's entry. I'll make some food and post decks afterwards.
    Luckily, we banned Oko, otherwise the food would be an elk (along with every creature and artifact).

  19. #5439
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie View Post
    Luckily, we banned Oko, otherwise the food would be an elk (along with every creature and artifact).
    Disappointing. If you Elked my food, it would be tastier.

  20. #5440
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    Re: 4 Card Blind

    Quote Originally Posted by FTW View Post
    Disappointing. If you Elked my food, it would be tastier.
    My food will take a while to get here, and I just received the last deck, so let's go!


    DECKS FOR THE FINAL ROUND OF SEASON 10: Deviant Legacy Bannathon

    This round we play Sphere of Resistance: All spells cost one additional generic mana to cast.

    The entries:
    1. Asthereal (TO): Mishra’s Factory, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, Quicksand, Sinkhole
    2. Wrath of Pie: Urza's Factory, Icatian Store, Rishadan Port, Maze of Ith
    3. GoblinSmashmaster: Sandstone Needle, Goblin Lackey, Flame Slash, Morophon, the Boundless
    4. Reeplcheep: Dust Bowl, Dunes of the Dead, Thran Turbine, Retrofitter Foundry
    5. dte: Geier Reach Sanitarium, sandstone needle, Stronghold Gambit, Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    6. silkster: Sandstone Needle, Dunes of the Dead, Hangarback Walker, Cleansing Wildfire
    7. RoosterCocoa: Remote Farm, Remote Farm, Brimaz, King of Oreskos, Brutal Cathar
    8. maxx!: Treetop Village, Gruul Turf, Sandstone Needle, Dust Bowl
    9. FTW: Stomping Ground, Skyshroud Cutter, Gods' Eye, Gate to the Reikai, Crack the Earth
    10. jhhdk: Leyline of Abundance, Havenwood Battleground, Llanowar mentor, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
    11. PJim: Forest, Forest, Lush Growth, Thallid
    12. alphastryk: Westvale Abbey,Sand Silos,Sand Silos,Dust Bowl

    Please post your scores and cross-check with the opponents.
    You can also enter your scores in the Google Spreadsheet for the season which you can find here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

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