View Poll Results: Would you be upset if WOTC allows proxies for reserve list cards at sanctioned events

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  • Yes I would be upset

    5 10.87%
  • No I would not be upset

    41 89.13%
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Thread: Would you be upset if WOTC allows proxies for reserve list cards at sanctioned event?

  1. #41
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    Re: Would you be upset if WOTC allows proxies for reserve list cards at sanctioned ev

    Quote Originally Posted by kinda View Post
    So you went from trying it out with proxies to dumping ~$4k or more from the sound of it into legacy? The number of people willing to do this when they could play other much cheaper formats or other games I'm sure is very low.
    I won't deny that I have a problem :D

    That said, there's no reason to assume it's necessary to go whole hog, anyway: Some of the best-performing decks don't require many (or any) RL cards. Taking a quick look at mtgtop8, it looks like Death and Taxes is cheaper than comparably-performing decks in Modern like Death's Shadow, Burn, and 4C.

    People get intimidated by the price tag to build decks like 3-5-color Delver or Lands, but there's plenty of play to decks that don't require that level of investment. Even if we assume my poor financial decisions are a major stretch for newcomers, for about the price you quoted, I picked up the tools to build Storm, pre-Claws TES, Dredge, manaless Dredge, both flavors of Reanimator, Burn, Charbelcher, and POops! All Spells. Hell, I could probably put together Snow if I were to throw down for a couple neo-Forces, though that deck isn't really my style.

    Legacy's expensive. I lucked into picking up most of my RL staples before they spiked a few years back (LEDs for $80 a pop). But it's disingenuous to say that people will either play with proxies or not play at all when there's definitely a path for people to get into the format. Recent printings have really helped in that regard, which is one (one) reason I don't support banning a number of cards. I risk opening a can of worms by bringing that up, but it gets tiresome to hear people argue that we need to ban things that make the format accessible. And seriously speaking, even if people don't buy in, who cares? "I had to suffer it so other people should, too," is a bad argument, and it's been used pretty much forever to pass the buck.

    Quote Originally Posted by kinda View Post
    Not if people begin to sell their collections to buy cars or houses etc. then begin using proxies.
    Is the problem you see there that it would devalue RL cards? Because then, that would just make it easier to buy into Legacy anyway.

    This may be an unpopular opinion, but I don't treat my cards as an investment except for armchair purposes. I'm certainly not complaining that my cardboard is worth more than its weight in gold, but I have no illusions that Wizards won't go back on its word (which, frankly, it's done already; they just don't talk about it). The RL is an artificial bubble, and investing in such things is a bad plan unless you have other reasons to spend the money.
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  2. #42

    Re: Would you be upset if WOTC allows proxies for reserve list cards at sanctioned ev

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce View Post
    I won't deny that I have a problem :D

    That said, there's no reason to assume it's necessary to go whole hog, anyway: Some of the best-performing decks don't require many (or any) RL cards. Taking a quick look at mtgtop8, it looks like Death and Taxes is cheaper than comparably-performing decks in Modern like Death's Shadow, Burn, and 4C.

    People get intimidated by the price tag to build decks like 3-5-color Delver or Lands, but there's plenty of play to decks that don't require that level of investment. Even if we assume my poor financial decisions are a major stretch for newcomers, for about the price you quoted, I picked up the tools to build Storm, pre-Claws TES, Dredge, manaless Dredge, both flavors of Reanimator, Burn, Charbelcher, and POops! All Spells. Hell, I could probably put together Snow if I were to throw down for a couple neo-Forces, though that deck isn't really my style.

    Legacy's expensive. I lucked into picking up most of my RL staples before they spiked a few years back (LEDs for $80 a pop). But it's disingenuous to say that people will either play with proxies or not play at all when there's definitely a path for people to get into the format. Recent printings have really helped in that regard, which is one (one) reason I don't support banning a number of cards. I risk opening a can of worms by bringing that up, but it gets tiresome to hear people argue that we need to ban things that make the format accessible. And seriously speaking, even if people don't buy in, who cares? "I had to suffer it so other people should, too," is a bad argument, and it's been used pretty much forever to pass the buck.



    Is the problem you see there that it would devalue RL cards? Because then, that would just make it easier to buy into Legacy anyway.

    This may be an unpopular opinion, but I don't treat my cards as an investment except for armchair purposes. I'm certainly not complaining that my cardboard is worth more than its weight in gold, but I have no illusions that Wizards won't go back on its word (which, frankly, it's done already; they just don't talk about it). The RL is an artificial bubble, and investing in such things is a bad plan unless you have other reasons to spend the money.
    Quick question, are you also still waiting for the great pumpkin it did you finally pick it in once December hit?

  3. #43

    Re: Would you be upset if WOTC allows proxies for reserve list cards at sanctioned ev

    At this point, buying into RL cards is just setting yourself up to take the fall in the giant Ponzi scheme that is the RL.

    Ignoring this pandemic thing, RL based formats can only make you lose.
    You lose by buying in to mostly ridiculous prices.
    You lose by not finding people to play with anymore since people stop playing because life and the price wall keeps new people from coming in.
    You lose when selling out since nobody but traders is buying those cards and then to bad conditions for you.

    I sold most of my RL pool about 2 years ago since I wanted to at least cash out while it was possible.

    From my fairly limited experience most of these cards just cycle between different traders.
    Prices are never going to drop significantly until the bust, since supply is too limited and controlled.
    Private collectors also struggle with selling "below what a card is "worth" ".
    You either have to go to a trader with a discount to get anything or wait forever to find someone willing to pay.
    With dwindling player bases the chance for that is growing ever slimmer.
    And at some point traders also won't buy them anymore because they can't sell them as well.
    Why should you buy a tabernacle for thousands if you can buy bulk and get your guaranteed profit instead of sitting on an expensive card for months?

    Legacy has been more of a community format anyway instead of being super competitive.
    I'd rather have proxy events with 30 people than normal with the same 10 dudes I've played with for the last 10 years.

  4. #44

    Re: Would you be upset if WOTC allows proxies for reserve list cards at sanctioned ev

    I just want to play without having to loan out my duals and other RL cards to my buddies. It's not that I don't trust my buddies, but accidents happen. I was fortunate the card one of my buddies dropped on the floor and then got stepped on was just a Force of Will and not something RL... it didn't bend, but there was some dirt on the floor that caused a little imprint through it.

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