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Thread: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

  1. #21

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Fox View Post
    Results please. Sounds a lot like this thought process:
    1- Ancient Tomb + Dreadnought + Mimic
    2- zero protection, zero interaction, zero manipulation
    3- must play Chalice to have a chance
    4- must topdeck a Cavern on Dreadnought, or have the mana come together for Scroll of Fate (you probably didn't add) or Eater of Daze
    5- it's okay now because Urza's Saga will be like more Caverns to get in Dreadnought through Chalice
    6- sure hope they don't Wasteland this card that has to sit there for 2 of the opponent's turns.

    ^Modern style deck construction. Linear. Easy to disrupt. No play to it. Dies to Surgical/easy to reduce to enablers only.

    If you're going to claim linear Stiflenought is *the* build, like at least have Uro covering your bets [even though you're weak to Surgical and playing the biggest Surgical lightning rod in the format]. Do we need to have the discussion about playing Teferi without Scroll of Fate too? Simply because Oko is banned does not mean that regressing to poor play patterns [sorc speed, summoning sick, phased-in Noughts] is progress.
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  2. #22
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    So a 2011 deck and an event with 24 players in 2017 is it? Tell you what, top8 a showcase (on hard mode - Oko, Dreadhorde, Astrolabe legal). I mean as deeply flawed mantra that "Decay is good against Dreadnought" is, that first event precedes the release of Return to Ravnica.

  3. #23

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    How much of your homework do I have to do for you, sheesh.

  4. #24

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    I do quite like the standstill/retrofitter idea
    It can also pick up a few random goodies like gy hate, pithing needle etc, maybe even Ivory Tower
    Aether Spellbomb can answer an opponent's creature that resolved before your standstill etc
    Some interesting options

  5. #25
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Fox View Post
    Just so we're all on the same page, Urza's Saga is a manland for Dreadstill. Also you all are so effing lucky it can't wish out a Portable Hole.
    It pushes the limits to how many colorless lands you play. I play mono-blue Dreadstill and it still feels like a 2-color deck because of Wasteland/Factory. I agree this is a new tool for it, but either some number of the colorless lands have to go or we have to re-evaluate whether a splash color is feasible with so many colorless lands. I suppose it could take up some number of spell slots, but we already play 22 lands (typically) so the most we would want is maybe 24.
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by kombatkiwi View Post
    I do quite like the standstill/retrofitter idea
    It can also pick up a few random goodies like gy hate, pithing needle etc, maybe even Ivory Tower
    Aether Spellbomb can answer an opponent's creature that resolved before your standstill etc
    Some interesting options
    Wait, did you mention Aether Spellbomb? I like where you're at. I have always loved the spellbombs!
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  7. #27
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    It pushes the limits to how many colorless lands you play. I play mono-blue Dreadstill and it still feels like a 2-color deck because of Wasteland/Factory. I agree this is a new tool for it, but either some number of the colorless lands have to go or we have to re-evaluate whether a splash color is feasible with so many colorless lands. I suppose it could take up some number of spell slots, but we already play 22 lands (typically) so the most we would want is maybe 24.
    What we've been looking for in UR Dreadstill for years is a 2x Manland that can replace 3x Factory. This is the first manland to show promise. This is not getting added to a stack of Wastelands and Factories, it's 3 Factory slots to 2x manland 1x basic.

  8. #28
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Right, so you have to give up Factory. As much as I love Factory, I agree completely. You can't have both, not in a 2-color list. I might try some amount in mono-blue, simply because I have more colorless ways to utilize the actual mana. This new land plays more like a spell anyways due to the sacrifice.
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    Right, so you have to give up Factory. As much as I love Factory, I agree completely. You can't have both, not in a 2-color list. I might try some amount in mono-blue, simply because I have more colorless ways to utilize the actual mana. This new land plays more like a spell anyways due to the sacrifice.
    It's not like Factories didn't already die (particularly when animated), that's an assumption the deck accounts for. I would classify it as exceedingly rare to get 2 attacks out of a Factory without it dying, while this Land is more likely to make 2 attackers before it dies [through Rish Port on the last age turn]. It also will very quickly murder enemy Karn/Lattice; they would need to jank out harder and also have Bridge...but even then, a 6/6 Lattice is looking pretty small.

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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Could Brainstone (LOVE IT) or the Lion's Eye Diamond Lion be useful in Doomsday and such?

    Lion seems like it'd be an auto-include in stuff like Bomberman. [EDIT: I'm and idort]
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  11. #31

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce View Post
    Could Brainstone (LOVE IT) or the Lion's Eye Diamond Lion be useful in Doomsday and such?

    Lion seems like it'd be an auto-include in stuff like Bomberman.
    Brainstone is worse in most situations than scroll rack, which sees no play.

    Lion doesn’t have haste and can’t be recurred with salvagers

  12. #32

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronald Deuce View Post
    Could Brainstone (LOVE IT) or the Lion's Eye Diamond Lion be useful in Doomsday and such?

    Lion seems like it'd be an auto-include in stuff like Bomberman. [EDIT: I'm and idort]
    I think they might see play in modern. Especially when you can Lurrus up your Brainstone.

  13. #33
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Fox View Post
    It's not like Factories didn't already die (particularly when animated), that's an assumption the deck accounts for. I would classify it as exceedingly rare to get 2 attacks out of a Factory without it dying, while this Land is more likely to make 2 attackers before it dies [through Rish Port on the last age turn]. It also will very quickly murder enemy Karn/Lattice; they would need to jank out harder and also have Bridge...but even then, a 6/6 Lattice is looking pretty small.
    Yeah, I was just keeping in the confines of deck contruction with a reasonable mana base in mind, not actual gameplay. Urza's Legacy could very well be much better than Factory, but without results it's still too early to tell.
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  14. #34
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Why is it necessary for Diamond Lion to include "Activate only as an instant."?

  15. #35

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew View Post
    Why is it necessary for Diamond Lion to include "Activate only as an instant."?
    That is the current oracle text of Lion's Eye Diamond. You need that to stop you from using it to cast a spell from your hand normally.

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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace/Homebrew View Post
    Why is it necessary for Diamond Lion to include "Activate only as an instant."?
    Presumably for the same reason LED has that restriction. Without it, you can use it to cast things that are in your hand when you activate it. Then again, maybe I'm missing something, or maybe Wizards just wants to make Legacy players associate it with the real deal.
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  17. #37
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    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    I'm clearly not a rules aficionado, but isn't that redundant? Doesn't the colon after "Sacrifice, discard your hand" mean that is a cost that has to be met before you get the mana?

  18. #38

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    I guess you can put something on the stack, pay the mana for it (eg crack a black lotus) but not a LED because you still in the process of putting it on the stack and dont have priority to do something like an instant.

    It basically just means LED needs you to have priortiy!
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  19. #39

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Quote Originally Posted by HdH_Cthulhu View Post
    I guess you can put something on the stack, pay the mana for it (eg crack a black lotus) but not a LED because you still in the process of putting it on the stack and dont have priority to do something like an instant.

    It basically just means LED needs you to have priortiy!
    Yes, mana abilities can usually be activated in special timing windows that ask you to pay mana, e.g.
    - In the middle of the process of casting a spell
    - Paying for the tax of something like Ghostly Prison
    Instants cannot be cast in these times because you don't have priority
    Ergo activating LED/Diamond Lion can't be done in these times either
    As was already pointed out the most important balance-related consideration is that it doesn't allow you to begin the process of casting a spell by moving it from your hand to the stack and then using LED to pay the mana for it
    You would have to activate the LED before beginning the process of casting the spell, thereby discarding your hand first and making you unable to cast the spell you were intending

  20. #40

    Re: Modern Horizons 2 Previews

    Hex Parasite doesn't quite work the way you'd want it it to with Urza's Saga, but it's a cute interaction anyway.

    Hmm... Its "mana cost" not "converted mana cost." That means the III ability won't fetch artifact lands, right? Just getting an extra mana for free in two turns would be pretty strong.

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