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Thread: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

  1. #261

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    I'm going to be honest, if we have to beat quad-Wastes it's better to start the season over from scratch because that alone is going to ban so many strategies.

  2. #262

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Is it better to make illegal decks score 0 and everyone gets 6 against them, or just not count them as entries? Do two illegal decks go 0-0, 2-2, or, 3-3 against one another?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie View Post
    I'm going to be honest, if we have to beat quad-Wastes it's better to start the season over from scratch because that alone is going to ban so many strategies.
    The change in ban strategy and the change in target decks has certainly made this season quite chaotic. We probably think that the same rules from the start but also requiring all decks to beat 4x Wastes would have led to a more interesting and less draw-heavy season, and it might have, but I'm not entirely convinced. I'm happy to embrace the chaos.

    Quote Originally Posted by BirdsOfParadise View Post

    As dte said, it was drawland again, but I've actually enjoyed the rounds where we figure out how to make a deck that cannot win, then try to figure out how we can still lose to another deck that cannot win. In all my time playing MtG I've never until now explored the deck-building space around Word of Command and painlands. The counter to the Hint of Insanity deck might have been something like Veldt, Helix Pinnacle, Beacon of Destruction, Beacon of Destruction. To me this meta doesn't actually seem lacking. I wonder if, instead of requiring a goldish by adding 4x wastes as a target deck, it would work to make it harder to not goldfish by requiring players to defeat multiple decks from the previous round. If we'd had to beat the Teferi's Imp deck and the 2x Word of Command deck this round, there would have been fewer decks that couldn't goldfish, but that door would still be open for someone with a really ingenious idea.
    I like this. You must beat both of the bottom decks.

  3. #263
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    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    +1 to beating both decks, I think that narrows things down significantly

  4. #264

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    There's a reason that the traditional Backbuild hand-to-beat is typically all blank cards with no characteristics. (Even that doesn't really spare the traditional arguing over what has to be beat, which is why Backbuild is awful.) Having to beat Wastes is an entirely different Backbuild format, because that alone excludes like 90% of the traditional strategies. I'm not convinced that 10% of Backbuild is that good of a stand alone format.

  5. #265

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Clearly there are many ways to play Backbuild, each presenting its own kinds of puzzles. I’ve been having fun so far and I’m sure it will continue being fun no matter what rules set dte chooses going forward.

  6. #266

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    The rules chage every week so really we're playing 10 different Backbuild formats.

  7. #267
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    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    When I checked the banlist this week, I was surprised that Helix Pinnacle unbanned itself. I also didn't get why the whole target deck was temporarily banned week 1 (to prevent imitating it) but not this week (allowing imitation). I noticed and played Dreadship Reef (and considered Word of Command), but others may have thought they couldn't play those cards at all. I would prefer more consistency with the rules and bans.

    I think we should have a good discussion about it once, then keep the same rules for the remaining format. We could just make the season short so it doesn't get stale.

    Edit: If we are making changes, I prefer beating both target decks to beating 4x Wastes.

  8. #268

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    The rules chage every week so really we're playing 10 different Backbuild formats.
    Whose Backbuild is it Anyway?

  9. #269

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Quote Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie View Post
    Whose Backbuild is it Anyway?
    But unironically.

  10. #270
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    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Here are the scores, and the banlists.
    Please vote on your favourite system!

    So, scores for the round:
    2,2 FourDogsinaHorseSuit
    2,3 Dooey
    2,0 Reeplcheep
    0,3 alphastryk
    3,2 Wrath of Pie
    2,0 RoosterCocoa
    2,0 GoblinSmashmaster
    3,2 BirdsOfParadise
    3,2 Silkster
    2,2 Symbi
    1,8 FTW
    1,4 Asthereal

    And general season ranking:
    1. Silkster 10,4
    2. BirdsOfParadise 10,3
    3. Wrath of Pie 10,2
    4. RoosterCocoa 9,2
    5. Dooey 7,8
    6. Symbi 7,7
    7. FTW 6,6
    8. dte (TO) 6,6
    9. Reeplcheep 6,2
    10. jfb1337 5,2
    11. alphastryk 5
    12. GoblinSmashmaster 4,3
    13. FourDogsinaHorseSuit 4,2
    14. Raketenudo 2,9
    15. Asthereal 2,7

    The race on top is still neck and neck!

    next target decks:
    Academy Ruins Dreadship Reef Mindslaver Demonic Pact
    City of Brass Dreadship Reef Aura Flux Teferi's Imp

    With my system, there would be no bans (I do not see any banworthy card in the top decks). So same banlist as R3, except helix is back on:
    Rainbow Vale
    Lotus Petal
    Forbidden Orchard
    Flailing Soldier
    Flailing Ogre
    Heartless Summoning
    Flailing Manticore
    rhystic cave
    Saproling Cluster
    Helix pinnacle

    And with the other system:
    Boseiju, who shelters all
    Ancient Tomb
    City of Brass
    Cognivore
    Dreadship Reef
    Hint of Insanity
    Guiltfeeder
    Ivory Mask
    Flailing Soldier
    Rainbow Vale
    Roiling Vortex
    One with Nothing
    Archangel's Light
    Forbidden Orchard
    Timberland Ruins
    Heartless Summoning
    Flailing Ogre
    Phage the Untouchable
    Lotus Petal
    Blinkmoth Infusion
    rhystic cave
    Mana Crypt
    Mox Emerald
    Saproling Cluster
    Street Wraith
    Arcane Signet
    drifter il-dal
    final fortune
    summoner's pact

  11. #271

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    So do i need to beat both targets and wastes.dek?
    Both targets?
    One target and wastes.dek?

  12. #272
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    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    So do i need to beat both targets and wastes.dek?
    Both targets?
    One target and wastes.dek?
    One of the targets plus wastes.
    Having to beat two non-wastes targets was the most hated option.

    And I would imagine their would be much more problems like the one Jfb and me ran into, not the best feeling ;)

    But please vote on the banlists!

  13. #273
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    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Quote Originally Posted by dte View Post
    One of the targets plus wastes.
    Having to beat two non-wastes targets was the most hated option.
    Ah too bad. I preferred beating 2 non-Wastes targets. 4x Wastes is too stronk. I guess everyone was sick of decks that can't win.

    I prefer the short banlist but with temporary ban on the week's target decks (so you can't just imitate one, e.g. Mindslaver lock the Mindslaver deck that was already designed to lose the mirror).
    Last edited by FTW; 09-01-2022 at 03:22 PM.

  14. #274

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    I prefer dte's ban list.

    Slight preference for not temp-banning the cards in the target decks, as I think that mimicry of the target decks is an interesting aspect of the meta... but either way is OK with me!

  15. #275

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Honestly, we should go with this plus Flailing Manticore (it can still be built to beat quad-Wastes, and lies in wait for future rounds). Otherwise, we'll still be drawing almost everything the rest of the way. (Also, I want to troll a future round with Jinxed Choker.)

  16. #276

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Folks should vote on bans so we can start the round, I wanna know what’s legal.

  17. #277

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    The other system and temp banning the cards in the DTB.

  18. #278

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    I want to use a card on the long banned list so let's use the short one more round

  19. #279

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    I would like to temp ban the cards in the DTB and abstain from voting on the bans.

  20. #280

    Re: 4CBS13: a 4-cards blind backbuild bannathon season

    Short list and no banned Goblins!

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