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Thread: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

  1. #81

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    1. silkster: Gruul Turf, Keldon Megaliths, The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, Boseiju, Who Endures

    I can't interact with this. LL 0-6, 0 total

    2. Wrath of Pie: Sunken Ruins, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Pyroblast, Loxodon Smiter

    Orim's chant, then short. WW 6-0, 6 total

    3. Asthereal: Savage Summoning, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Pyroblast, Vendetta

    If you cast savage summoning I have Orim's chant and if you cast Lavinia without savage I have pyroblast. I can, on my turn, cast Orim's chant. You must then respond with savage + Lavinia or you will get shorted. Then I let the stack resolve and play dryad arbor (which you can't kill as you're silenced). I then blast Lavinia as dryad arbor is a land so I can get around the restriction, then short. WW 6-0, 12 total

    4. Symbi: Orim's Chant, Mana Short, Pyroblast, Dryad Arbor

    That's me!

    5. GoblinSmashmaster: Black Lotus, Timetwister, Regrowth, Empty the Warrens

    Short, blast timetwister, and chant in response to regrowth and you never have the mana to cast empty. WW 6-0, 18 total

    6. jfb1337: Black Lotus, Sire of Insanity, Orim's Chant, Void Snare

    Mana short (and void snare does nothing). WW 6-0, 24 total

    7. FourDogsInaHorseSuit: Dovin's Veto, Sudden Edict, Old-Growth Dryad, Leyline of Sanctity

    I can't beat leyline. LL 0-6, 24 total

    8. Reeplcheep: Chancellor of the Annex, Mesmeric Fiend, Solitude, Spell Queller

    Short, pay for chancellor, blast queller, get stopped by solitude. DD 2-2, 26 total

    9. Dooey: Force of Will, Snapback, Pyroblast, Painter's Servant

    Chant forces force. I then blast force and short while protected by silence. WW 6-0, 32 total

    10. RoosterCocoa: Cavern of Souls, Leyline of Sanctity, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Otawara, Soaring City

    Dryad arbor lets me blast Lavinia while it is on the battlefield. If you bounce Lavinia with Otawara, you must use your starting blue for that, then you must have used your starting white to cast Lavinia and you won't have the mana to recast Lavinia. WW 6-0, 38 total

    11. dte: Black Lotus, Dovin's Veto, Pyroblast, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries

    I cast Orim's chant. If you veto, I have pyroblast for Jace. If you don't veto, I short you. WW 6-0, 44 total

    12. FTW: Black Lotus, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Spell Queller, Pyroblast

    Chant forces queller, then I blast it and short protected by chant. WW 6-0, 50 total

  2. #82

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by Reeplcheep View Post
    8. Reeplcheep: Chancellor of the Annex, Mesmeric Fiend, Solitude, Spell Queller

    4. Symbi: Orim's Chant, Mana Short, Pyroblast, Dryad Arbor
    You have to choose between blasting my Queller or shorting me. 2/3 Beats 1/1 and 1/1 beats nothing either way. WW 6-0
    Objection! I have the mana to do both, even with the chancellor tax.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoblinSmashmaster View Post

    4. Symbi: Orim's Chant, Mana Short, Pyroblast, Dryad Arbor
    Goblin smash! 6-0

    5. GoblinSmashmaster: Black Lotus, Timetwister, Regrowth, Empty the Warrens
    That's me still on Goblin combo!
    Objection! You never have the mana to cast empty because of short and chant in response to regrowth.

  3. #83
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    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by GoblinSmashmaster View Post
    4. Symbi: Orim's Chant, Mana Short, Pyroblast, Dryad Arbor
    Goblin smash! 6-0
    Disagreement. I think Symbi is right.

    After Mana Short you can still go Lotus -> Regrowth -> Lotus -> Empty for 8 goblins, dodging Pyroblast. But Orim's Chant in response to Regrowth stops you. You have to pass the turn, lose 1 mana, then next turn all you can do is Lotus -> Twister into Pyroblast. LL 0-6

  4. #84

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by dte View Post
    I did not realize the deadline was one hour earlier for me, but l guess it is these few weeks on which North America is still in Summer and Europe thinks it is Winter already.
    It's just this one week. Our daylight time change is this coming Saturday.




    I thought the exact opposite, that everyone would play it, and how to beat it and the decks that beat it. But then I decided to take the same advise as FTW:

    2. Wrath of Pie: Sunken Ruins, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Pyroblast, Loxodon Smiter
    6-0. Pyroblast your jace, veto your pyroblast, do not care about the elephant.
    It was at this moment that I realized that Jace doesn't have to wait a turn to win.

    I dont get it, Bosejiu the leyline and win?

    4 dogs seem to agree with this line
    Oh, duh. I was so disappointed that Boseiju wasn't looking the things I thought it would that I forgot it was useful here. And I was so set on playing Boseiju that I didn't think of Otawara.

  5. #85
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    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by dte View Post
    3. Asthereal: Savage Summoning, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Pyroblast, Vendetta
    6-0. Pyroblast Lavi, veto pyroblast.
    18
    I was trying to figure out how you win while I lose. I think you lose too.

    You cannot Pyroblast Lavi on the stack (uncounterable) or on the battlefield (Lavi ability). After T0 Lavi, you can never play Lotus or Jace. LL 0-6?
    I can only interact because of Spell Queller, but my Queller dies to Pyroblast or Vendetta.

  6. #86

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    Do you all have a list of best combos you're using?
    This is the second time it looks like you all knew something I didn't.
    I'm not sure what combos you're referring to. Do you just mean Jace, Wielder of Mysteries himself? A good place to start is ban lists from other seasons, which you can find in post 2 of Asthereal's thread.
    Last edited by silkster; 11-02-2022 at 12:27 PM.

  7. #87

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    10. RoosterCocoa: Cavern of Souls, Leyline of Sanctity, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Otawara, Soaring City

    1. silkster: Gruul Turf, Keldon Megaliths, The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, Boseiju, Who Endures
    Two lands beats Tabernacle. WW

    2. Wrath of Pie: Sunken Ruins, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Pyroblast, Loxodon Smiter
    OTP I get Lavinia into play. However, pytting your Sunken Ruins into play allows you to cast Pyroblast, so you kill it, leaving you with the 4 nonred mana floating. I then bounce whichever threat you play. With your Sunken Ruins, you can get to 6 mana over 2 turns, which means you can't cast anything past your first threat since everything but double Loxodon costs too much, and you can't get double green or white. OTD you play one threat, I bounce it, and then you play your other which I can't beat. DL

    3. Asthereal: Savage Summoning, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Pyroblast, Vendetta
    I bounce your Lavinia and play mine. WW

    4. Symbi: Orim's Chant, Mana Short, Pyroblast, Dryad Arbor
    Dryad Arbor lets you kill Lavinia with Pyroblast, and I can't do anything useful with Otawara. LL

    5. GoblinSmashmaster: Black Lotus, Timetwister, Regrowth, Empty the Warrens
    OTP you can't do anything with Lavinia in play, OTD I can't beat your goblins. WL

    6. jfb1337: Black Lotus, Sire of Insanity, Orim's Chant, Void Snare
    I can bounce Sire of Insanity if you play it and you can't play it twice, Orim's Chant does nothing because of my Leyline, and you can't cast Void Snare to bounce Lavinia. WW

    7. FourDogsInaHorseSuit: Dovin's Veto, Sudden Edict, Old-Growth Dryad, Leyline of Sanctity
    I bounce your Dryad and then you can't beat Lavinia. WW

    8. Reeplcheep: Chancellor of the Annex, Mesmeric Fiend, Solitude, Spell Queller
    My leyline means that Mesmeric Fiend can't take anything from me, and you can't evoke Solitude with Lavinia in play. I play Lavinia, paying for Chancellor. If you Spell Queller Lavinia, then I bounce Spell Queller with Otawara, getting Lavinia back, and then you don't have the colors to recast it. Lavinia then races your Mesmeric Fiend. WW

    9. Dooey: Force of Will, Snapback, Pyroblast, Painter's Servant
    You can't use your noncreature spells, but Lavinia can't get past Painter's Servant. DD

    11. dte: Black Lotus, Dovin's Veto, Pyroblast, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries
    If you play Jace, I bounce it with Otawara, and you can't cast anything once Lavinia is in play. WW

    12. FTW: Black Lotus, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Spell Queller, Pyroblast
    OTP you play Jace, I bounce it, and then you play Spell Queller which outraces Lavinia. OTD I start by playing Lavinia, and you Spell Queller it. I can bounce it, but then the recast Lavinia is not uncounterable anymore, so you can Pyroblast it and win with Jace. LL

    14W 3D 5L = 45

    A very good result considering I forgot that Jace and Spell Queller existed when coming up with the list. I chose Otawara since I really wanted an uncounterable way to beat both creature and artifact wincons, and got lucky that it hits planeswalkers too.

  8. #88
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    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    Do you all have a list of best combos you're using?
    This is the second time it looks like you all knew something I didn't.
    Just experience from past seasons. Many of us have played together a while. Others probably played elsewhere (Reddit?).

    Every season Thassa/Lab Man either start banned or define round 1. Black Lotus and Chancellor of the Annex also dominate early. The starting WBURG mana adds a twist to alter viability of threats and answers, shaking up the format. Jace gets easier to cast so 4-mana Thassa is still good. Some WBURG hate strategies came up in a past Deviant season (Lavinia, Mana Short, Tabernacle), so they were known tech.

    Past seasons and banlists are publicly available... if you have the patience to go through the old thread.
    Last edited by FTW; 11-02-2022 at 10:14 AM.

  9. #89

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    I played CB well before Reddit was even really a thing, back when the classic Lotus/Balance/Rack was even dumber than it is now. Didn't help that people thought Dodecapod did things against it (it didn't).

  10. #90
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    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by dte View Post
    You can't counter Lavi, as I Savage Summon her, and after she resolves, you can't cast Pyroblast anymore, so that won't work.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  11. #91
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    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Asthereal's results for round 2:

    1. silkster: Gruul Turf, Keldon Megaliths, The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, Boseiju, Who Endures LL
    I gave up this matchup.
    2. Wrath of Pie: Sunken Ruins, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Pyroblast, Loxodon Smiter DD
    Uh.. Ruins allows you to cast Pyro on Lavi, then I get to Pyro your Jace or Vendetta your Smiter. Either way we draw.
    3. Asthereal: Savage Summoning, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Pyroblast, Vendetta <- me
    Many different ideas again, this time I was in time to realize that my original deck was again sorcery speed, and would be bad, so I chose this instead. Vulnerable, but very fast.
    4. Symbi: Orim's Chant, Mana Short, Pyroblast, Dryad Arbor LL
    EDIT: Actually I was wrong here. If you start with Mana Short, I can Pyroblast it, which you can't do anything about and doesn't help you. You have to keep Chant up and use it well. If you allow me Summoning in Lavi and then play Arbor to allow yourself to Pyroblast-destroy my Lavi, you open yourself up to Vendetta on Arbor, but if you take any other route, you die. So you need Chant to protect Arbor from Vendetta AND Mana Short from Pyroblast, or you lose/draw, depending.
    OTD I have to wait, as you casting Chant in response to Summoning is bad. On your main phase, you Chant, I respond by Summoning in Lavi. Chant resolves, I can't cast stuff anymore this turn. You now play Arbor, which allows you to cast Pyroblast (you have a land now), which you do in order to destroy my Lavi. This opens up your final play: Mana Short, in order to get rid of my black mana. You have to do all this in your turn, as I have no answer now (Chant), so OTD I lose anyway.
    OTP if you Mana Short on my upkeep, I Pyroblast it. If you Chant, I respond by Summoning in Lavi. You can't play Arbor yet, as it is my turn, so neither helps you just yet. You wait. I go to my main phase. You still wait. Main phase I can't cast Summoning, as you'll respond by casting Chant, and after that resolves you can safely go for Mana Short. But I can try to cast Lavi as is. You respond by first casting Chant, and then countering Lavi with Pyroblast. Then you use Mana Short to drop my final mana and prevent Vendetta again. Arbor would still win. So I have to wait. But if I pass, we get the line OTD. So yeah, I still lose both, but not because of what I posted earlier.
    5. GoblinSmashmaster: Black Lotus, Timetwister, Regrowth, Empty the Warrens WW
    First upkeep I make Lavi and you can't cast the business.
    6. jfb1337: Black Lotus, Sire of Insanity, Orim's Chant, Void Snare WL
    You can use Chant to respond to Summoning, but OTP I can just cast Lavi normally and win. OTD though, you get to have Sire and just win.
    7. FourDogsInaHorseSuit: Dovin's Veto, Sudden Edict, Old-Growth Dryad, Leyline of Sanctity WW
    First upkeep I uncounterably make Lavi and you can't cast things.
    8. Reeplcheep: Chancellor of the Annex, Mesmeric Fiend, Solitude, Spell Queller WW
    I can pay extra B for Chancellor and Pyroblast-counter Queller, but Lavi only stops noncreature stuff, and so you get to Solitude Lavi and then cast a 1/1 to kill me.
    EDIT: Actually, you spend no mana to cast Solitude, so that gets countered, and my 3/3 beats the 1/1 Fiend. That's lucky.
    9. Dooey: Force of Will, Snapback, Pyroblast, Painter's Servant WW
    First upkeep I uncounterably make Lavi and you can't cast things.
    10. RoosterCocoa: Cavern of Souls, Leyline of Sanctity, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Otawara, Soaring City LL
    You can bounce Lavi, and make your own which I can't counter and afterwards can't destroy as I have no lands.
    11. dte: Black Lotus, Dovin's Veto, Pyroblast, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries WW
    First upkeep I uncounterably make Lavi and you can't cast your relevant things.
    12. FTW: Black Lotus, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Spell Queller, Pyroblast WW
    First upkeep I make Lavi, which you can try to Queller, but I can Pyroblast-counter, so you don't get to use the shenanigans. After Lavi enters the battlefield, you can't cast things anymore.

    Total: 41 points
    Last edited by Asthereal; 11-02-2022 at 10:20 AM.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  12. #92

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Several matchups of mine were wrong since I forgot I donít have the colours to hardcast solitude. Iíll go back and fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    Do you all have a list of best combos you're using?
    This is the second time it looks like you all knew something I didn't.
    This is the link to the previously banned cards:
    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    Banlist

  13. #93

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    2. Wrath of Pie: Sunken Ruins, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Pyroblast, Loxodon Smiter DD
    Uh.. Ruins allows you to cast Pyro on Lavi, then I get to Pyro your Jace or Vendetta your Smiter. Either way we draw.
    Curse my lack of mana again!

    (Loxodon Smiter let me down, no one played discard other than jfb1337 to make it look good.)

  14. #94
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    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by Wrath of Pie View Post
    Curse my lack of mana again!

    (Loxodon Smiter let me down, no one played discard other than jfb1337 to make it look good.)
    Yeah, sad days: you're a mana short. Ruins plus WG casts Smiter, R casts Pyro, and now you have UB left, but you need one more (plus the use of Ruins) to cast Jace.
    As to the discard: I had discard sent in, but realized it was sorcery speed again, and I didn't feel like that would do me any good just yet. You'd have murdered that deck.

    Thing about the one mana is: if you solve it with Basking Rootwalla, you run into the issue that you now perhaps draw against discard decks, who'd have Walla as wincon and you now trade instead of just beat.
    I guess you needed a cheaper second wincon than Jace. Dryad Arbor plus Lab Man would have been extremely funny here, but the Lab dude got the axe last round. Also, it's too slow against Jace..
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  15. #95

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    Asthereal's results for round 2:

    6. jfb1337: Black Lotus, Sire of Insanity, Orim's Chant, Void Snare WL
    You can use Chant to respond to Summoning, but OTP I can just cast Lavi normally and win. OTD though, you get to have Sire and just win.
    7. FourDogsInaHorseSuit: Dovin's Veto, Sudden Edict, Old-Growth Dryad, Leyline of Sanctity WW
    First upkeep I uncounterably make Lavi and you can't cast things.
    Lavinia stops neither Lotus into Sire nor Old-Growth Dryads. Ah, but Vendetta catches the Dryads and Lavinia protects the Vendetta from the Veto.

  16. #96

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by silkster View Post
    Lavinia stops neither Lotus into Sire nor Old-Growth Dryads.
    Objection! Lavinia will counter Lotus as no mana will be spent to cast it. You are correct about Dryads, however. Edit: Lavinia being unable to stop dryads doesn't matter.

  17. #97
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    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by Symbi View Post
    Objection! Lavinia will counter Lotus as no mana will be spent to cast it. You are correct about Dryads, however. Edit: Lavinia being unable to stop dryads doesn't matter.
    Yeah, Lavinia is incredible in this format. I forgot who came up with her during the Deviant Legacy seasons, but that was an amazing find.
    Join the 4 Card Blind competition!

  18. #98

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by Asthereal View Post
    Yeah, Lavinia is incredible in this format. I forgot who came up with her during the Deviant Legacy seasons, but that was an amazing find.
    Oh, the second cause stopping Lotus, not even because it was cheated out. Cute.

    I remember finding Lavinia and then deciding against it (probably mistakenly). It was dte who found Lavinia and had the wisdom to play it.

    I put in scores for jfb1337, and I highlighted the cards that will be banned. Tabernacle and Boseiju survive by a margin of ε.

    It looks like the newly banned cards will be:

    Black Lotus
    Cavern of Souls
    Dovin's Veto
    Dryad Arbor
    Jace, Wielder of Mysteries
    Lavinia, Azorius Renegade
    Leyline of Sanctity
    Mana Short
    Orim's Chant
    Otawara, Soaring City
    Pyroblast
    Savage Summoning
    Spell Queller
    Vendetta

    For now, I've updated just the spreadsheet. You should be able to start planning your decks now. I'll lock in the bans likely in about 32 hours.

    Looks like Symbi and dte are already starting to separate from the pack. I'm just barely holding onto third. For two weeks now, as I see the decks rolling in, I've looked at Symbi's entry and I just see WW and wonder what Symbi was thinking being so vulnerable to exactly what I'm doing. Well, it seems I've managed to target the best deck each week. Maybe one of these days I'll actually play it instead.

  19. #99

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Sorry I'm late with my scores; been a bit busy.

    6. jfb1337: Black Lotus, Sire of Insanity, Orim's Chant, Void Snare


    1. silkster: Gruul Turf, Keldon Megaliths, The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, Boseiju, Who Endures
    WD - I can sire, but OTD it dies to tabby.

    2. Wrath of Pie: Sunken Ruins, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Pyroblast, Loxodon Smiter
    DD - Smiter trades with sire

    3. Asthereal: Savage Summoning, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Pyroblast, Vendetta
    WL - OTP I play lotus, then chant; you lavinia in response (else any earlier and a chant in response to summoning); but 6/4 beats 2/2. OTD I can't stop lavinia.

    4. Symbi: Orim's Chant, Mana Short, Pyroblast, Dryad Arbor
    LL - You mana short me

    5. GoblinSmashmaster: Black Lotus, Timetwister, Regrowth, Empty the Warrens
    WW - Chant stops your combo and I win

    7. FourDogsInaHorseSuit: Dovin's Veto, Sudden Edict, Old-Growth Dryad, Leyline of Sanctity
    LL - Can't chant due to leyline; you edict the sire and veto the void snare

    8. Reeplcheep: Chancellor of the Annex, Mesmeric Fiend, Solitude, Spell Queller
    LL - I don't have the mana to do everything. You'll always end up with queller in play and sire solituded

    9. Dooey: Force of Will, Snapback, Pyroblast, Painter's Servant
    WW - OTP I chant then sire. OTD you play painter, then I void snare it, chant, and sire; you don't have enough interaction to stop it all.

    10. RoosterCocoa: Cavern of Souls, Leyline of Sanctity, Lavinia, Azorius Renegade, Otawara, Soaring City
    LL - Otawara bounces sire and you can play lavinia.

    11. dte: Black Lotus, Dovin's Veto, Pyroblast, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries
    WL - OTP I chant then sire. OTD I can't stop jace.

    12. FTW: Black Lotus, Jace, Wielder of Mysteries, Spell Queller, Pyroblast
    WL - OTP I chant then sire. OTD I can't stop jace.

    Total: 8W3D = 27
    Looks to be in agreement with everyone else.

  20. #100

    Re: 4 Card Blind: The Silkster Seasons

    Quote Originally Posted by jfb1337 View Post
    Looks to be in agreement with everyone else.
    Great! I've updated the banlist in the spreadsheet and in the second post. I'm not opening the round yet, but your can start your brewing.

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