A friend of mine and I have been testing with Phan's list for the past month or so, and though you have to acknowledge Eldrazi, Marit Lage, and Reanimator fatties with sideboard material, we're largely keeping it straight UR Landstill, or Lamstill. Though in actuality, it's URb Lamstill.
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Standstill
1 Engineered Explosives
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Sudden Shock
3 Spell Pierce
3 Stifle
2 Spell Snare
2 Counterspell
2 Jace, The Mind Sculptor
1 Bloodstained Mire
2 Faerie Conclave
1 Flooded Strand
2 Island
4 Mishra's Factory
1 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Underground Sea
3 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
Sideboard
3 Relic of Progenitus
2 Pyroclasm
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Pithing Needle
1 Izzet Staticaster
1 Diabolic Edict
1 Echoing Truth
1 Flusterstorm
1 Pyroblast
1 Smash to Smithereens
1 Roast
Originally, we just wanted to add one more blue dual besides Volcanic Island in order to get the option to cast EE for 3, but then noticed the black would serve well in a much needed spot devoted to killing big creatures indirectly, and Diabolic Edict is still by far the best option in the game for that purpose. Might go up to 2 on that, not sure yet.
One thing I really like about Phan's list is that the abundance of red really helps close out the game. Your opponent might trade "Land, go" turns with you once you've landed a Standstill, then wait to break it at you end-of-turn, thereby necessitating the waste of at least 1 card if you FoW your opponent's spell, 2 if you single-spell counter it, or 3 if you have nothing. With the 4 Bolt/3 SS setup that Phan created, you just point extra cards to your opponent's dome. Additionally, it also makes Snapcaster Mage much more aggressive when you want to switch to attacking to close out the game.
The Eldrazi and Burn matches seem tough. I hope the Roast/Edict recent additions will help the Eldrazi one, Burn... meh, who plans for that?
If you want opinions or thoughts about this archetype, I would definitely start out he reading the past 5-10 pages in this thread, and if you still have more questions, feel free to post them.
And as much as I like discussing standstill in all forms, I think that the U/R deck you describe has its own thread right?
Keep standing still! :)
What do you think of Fatal Push for this archetype in place of StP?
How much room for removal did you have after Decay; specifically removal that doesn't damage players or PWs? You run Fatal Push and your turn 1 threat plays probably has to start approaching 8 copies (on top of 3-4 Factory)...and you have a positive feedback mechanism that says you need more Decays to backup that gameplan (Chalice and CB). StP going above 2-4 or 3 cmc (Push and Decay respectively) is much more in line with a gameplan of backing off over-saturation of threats at 1 cmc. Fatal Push will create a better deck (insofar as it has clearer priorities and streamlining), but that doesn't really matter against highly uninteractive cards forcing you to run [and draw] Decay. Drawing 3 bonus cards doesn't matter if they'll never resolve; this problem continues to plague all Standstill color combinations.
I'm working more from LandStillManiac's build as I explore this archetype and if you switch out the 3 StP for Fatal Push you only need white for Verdict and Elspeth which are one ofs.
This depends on your build but there's nothing close to saturation. You need a way to remove their t1 play and AD does not do that any of the time. Main deck should almost always try to play Standstill t2. Assume you play Deathrite, this makes t2 - fatal push, Standstill. Seems really good for this deck.
I think at that point it is reasonable to consider cutting White altogether. I know that his initial rational behind White was to get access to StP and Push seems like it could do a reasonable impression of it to allow for a simpler, most streamlined mana-base. While not perfect, there are other Black sweepers that could be run, and Garruk could do a bad Elspeth impression (sort of).
I'll let LSM come back at comment though, he is a better Landstill player than I'll ever be, but I'm sure he is considering the options.
"The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
—Kaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order
White isn't very needed IMHO. Wasn't really before, and with push, I see no need to stretch the already very stretched manabase.
I think that how many pushes you want to run is very deck list dependant, but 3-4 is likely correct, along with 3-4 Decay. 8 Spot removal isn't at all terrible in a deck with a lot of card draw.
I might give Fatal Push a try this Tuesday at the old weekly. Just replacing the Disfigure slots.
4 Deathrite Shaman
1 Vendilion Clique
4 Force of Will
2 Spell Snare
2 Fatal Push
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Pernicious Deed
4 Brainstorm
4 Standstill
3 Liliana of the Veil
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
3 Thoughtseize
1 Life from the Loam
3 Underground Sea
2 Bayou
2 Tropical Island
4 Polluted Delta
4 Misty Rainforest
2 Creeping Tar Pit
3 Mishra's Factory
3 Wasteland
Sideboard (15)
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Fatal Push
1 Life from the Loam
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Hydroblast
1 Blue Elemental Blast
1 Grim Flayer
1 Tasigur, the Golden Fang
1 Tarmogoyf
2 Flusterstorm
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Golgari Charm
1 Krosan Grip
Hope someone can lend me the Lili's!
Not sure if this is the right thread but its the most active so I thought I'd post my list here.
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Cloud of Faeries
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Stand Still
4 FoW
4 Mana Leak
4 Counterspell
4 Ratchet Bomb
2 JTMS
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Faerie Conclave
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
6 Island
I'm thinking about testing Thing in the Ice and Baral, Chief of Compliance in the Cloud Faerie slot but I really like the tempo play of turn 1 delver turn 2 flip, play faerie, and standstill with FoW backup. It basically forces the opponent to crack standstill right away.
Ratchet bomb is playing the role of Pernicious and the nice thing is a flipped delver dodges it pretty well.
What do ya'll think? And again, my apologies if this is the wrong thread!
Perhaps not quite the right thread, but I'm not sure if there is a Mono U Standstill thread.
A couple of things:
Conclave ETB tapped so you can't use it to cast a T2 Standstill.
Delver's flipped CMC is still 1, not 0 like it used to be, so it doesn't dodge Ratchet Bomb as well as it did.
Delver blindflipped into Standstill is one of the most evil plays in Magic. It's quite unfair. Especially if you manage to draw into a Fow with your three cards.
Good luck with your deck, let us know how it plays out?
pandaman, how did the games went on Tuesday?
Don't know if you guys noticed, but the Brainstorm Show people posted their take on BUGstill a week ago. Pretty similar to the list I've been playing and posting about here, but a bit updated compared to mine as I haven't touched it for a couple of months.
Link: http://www.thebrainstormshow.com/pod...ood-in-legacy/
Hey guys,
Glad to have found this thread on here. I changed my initial list a bit. I won Legacy FNM on Friday and did not lose a match, albeit all of my matches were either Delver, Deathblade, or Miracles. I'm still testing the Lumbering Falls but feel great about the other 59 cards in my maindeck. I tested a Yahenni's Expertise in the SB, and unfortunately it was not great... If anyone is interested in audio content on the deck I'm thinking about recording my thoughts on the archetype and will post it to thebrainstormshow.com on Monday afternoon.
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Snapcaster Mage
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Brainstorm
3 Fatal Push
2 Counterspell
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Standstill
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Maelstrom Pulse
4 Force of Will
2 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
1 Bayou
1 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Island
3 Mishra’s Factory
2 Creeping Tar Pit
1 Lumbering Falls
3 Verdant Catacombs
4 Polluted Delta
2 Misty Rainforest
SB
1 Flusterstorm
2 Thoughtseize
1 Duress
3 Surgical Extraction
2 Diabolic Edict
2 Pithing Needle
1 Null Rod
1 Darkblast
1 True-name Nemesis
1 Tombstalker
*Edited with current list*
Last edited by Patrunkenphat7; 01-29-2017 at 09:05 PM.
Hey,
Nice list, I've been playing almost the same main deck config for quite long.
Few comments based on my past experience:
- I favor turn 1 removal, so I played 2x Disfigure & 2x Dismember MD (with 3 Abrupt Decays). This would be 4 Fatal Pushes now probably.
- I only played 1 Creeping Tar Pit, but the ETB still screwed me some games.. I would say 3 tapped lands are way too many
- I stopped playing a single Forest (worked in colorless mode most of the time) and swithed it for a second Island MD.
- I used to play 1 Toxic Deluge main with a second copy in the SB, but moved all to SB since it was dead vs everything but Elves, D&T (or Empty the Warrens). Could be correct now with the uprise of TNN.
My reference list:
--- creatures [11] ---
4 Deathrite Shaman
2 Snapcaster Mage
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Baleful Strix
1 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
--- instants [19] ---
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Fatal Push
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Counterspell
2 Spell Snare
--- enchantments [5] ---
4 Standstill
1 Sylvan Library
--- planeswalkers [2] ---
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
--- lands [23] ---
4 Mishra's Factory
1 Creeping Tar Pit
3 Wasteland
3 Polluted Delta
3 Misty Rainforest
1 Verdant Catacombs
2 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
1 Bayou
2 Island
1 Swamp
--- sideboard ---
3 Surgical Extraction
2 Baleful Strix
2 Thoughtseize
2 Flusterstorm
2 Pithing Needle
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Crucible of Worlds
- Library over performed.. you should give it a try (well maybe with Leo's everywhere is not as good anymore)
- Strixes are a response to our Eldrazi infested meta :-)
Yeah hi guys, nice to see you in the thread - and I'm always interested in more content Patrunkenphat7, so get that party started already. :P
Crush - Nice to see more people adopt the SB Crucible + GQ plan. how has it been for you?
I like both your lists - they are quite similar to where I started out - though maybe some of my thoughts on the deck can provide some topics for discussion:
I did play 2 Jace at first, but cut them due to them being a bit clunky and I had a lot of CA anyways. Also tried Leovold when he was first released but did not like 3-cmc tap-out stuff in such a reactive shell. But the meta has changed somewhat now - so it might be correct to try him (and Jace too) out again.
I also agree with ETB-tapped lands, I think 1 is about maximum in this fast format - which one is somewhat debatable. I would never go below 4 mishra's though. But it's a bit meta dependent.
I also started out with 3 basics, then went down to 2, then 0. 0 has been good, though blood moon is somewhat tricky to play around at times.
Another interesting discussion is how reactive we want to be - standstill favours reactive stuff - but the general power level of the tap-out cards are a bit higher.
Anyhow, enough of my babbling for now! :)
@Leovold: I wouldn't go up to two, since I was not thrilled to see it against fast creature decks. It did however single-handedly won me 2 matches in a tournament (vs GQ lands - a match were I think we struggle a lot.. he drew me like 12 cards) and another one I can't remember. Probably 0-1 MD / 1-2 SB is the best mix.
@GQ+Crucible - I played Crucible MD, but again it was too slow to pull its weight against Eldrazi and such.. I could cutting the whole package in the future.
@Jace & basic lands - I think it all boils down to play style. If you want to play more of a tempo deck, then these are sub par.. otherwise they are quite important if you want to be able to play draw/go vs Delver decks, where you want to interaction early game and still hit your critical land count in time.. from my experience mana development is the trickiest part of playing this deck :-)
Lam Phan is back with another Landstill build.
25 LANDS
2 Creeping Tar Pit
1 Dust Bowl
1 Flooded Strand
1 Marsh Flats
4 Mishra's Factory
1 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
3 Snow-Covered Island
1 Snow-Covered Swamp
3 Underground Sea
4 Wasteland
5 CREATURES
4 Snapcaster Mage
1 True-Name Nemesis
26 INSTANTS and SORC.
4 Brainstorm
2 Counterspell
2 Diabolic Edict
4 Fatal Push
4 Force of Will
4 Gitaxian Probe
3 Spell Pierce
3 Spell Snare
4 OTHER SPELLS
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
3 Standstill
SIDEBOARD
1 Damnation
1 Dread of Night
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Engineered Plague
3 Flusterstorm
1 Pithing Needle
3 Relic of Progenitus
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Toxic Deluge
1 True-Name Nemesis
http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=14546&d=287272&f=LE
I like this a lot and played it at a 30 man event yesterday, I made the Top 8 but lost a very very grindy game 3 to the Reid Duke BUG deck.
A couple of thoughts on the list before and after playing it.
I was worried about Truename Nemesis and Monastry Mentor when I first saw the list. The sideboard has a good 5 cards to bring in when you are going to face these.
TNN - Current meta decks are hoping to get this out on turn 2 with a mana dork, so fatal push hands are very good here to slow them down where you can hopefully either counterspell or FOW the TNN. Otherwise it is going to be a very hard game.
I didn't play vs mentor properly. It came out of the board from a TinFins player but I had already landed a EPlague on Monk and a Dread of Night so it wasn't an issue. (the hardcast Griselbrand was however...) I can however see both Mentor and CB being real issues for this deck and both must counter spells.
After playing the event I was really happy with the deck. The Dust Bowl suprised me with how good it was, especially in long games vs the BUG decks with shaky manabases. However our manabase is also not great because of the number of colourless lands and many times I felt unable to fully utilise the counters I had in my hand because of mana issues.
This brings me to the two things I would change
4 Gitaxian probe felt odd. They encourage you to keep slightly dodgy hands and seem to be there to try and shore up the slightly weak mana.
I would cut the Dust Bowl and the True Name Nemesis from the Main and add another Blue Fetch and an Island.
I would then cut the 4 probes now our mana is better and add the fourth Standstill and 3 interactive cards that you think would be good in your meta. I will be trying 3 Stifle. This is because the decks I seem to face are weak to screwing with their mana base and I won games yesterday by Fatal pushing their manadork and wasting their land. It is also a tempo card in a Standstill build that is quite tempo orientated once we have taken out the TNN and DustBowl. You may want a sweeper to steal Game ones against decks like DNT or BUG Reid.
I wanted the 4th Standstill quite often. Sometimes I would have control of the board but need the extra cards. Other times I had to loose it to FOW or a Thought seize. It was often the card I most wanted to draw.
The sideboard felt very good.
The stand out cards were
1 Damnation
1 Dread of Night
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Engineered Plague
1 Toxic Deluge
E plague on Merfolk is great against all of these TNN decks. I would keep these cards in all metas as they certainly shore up the poor game one matchups like Death and Taxes, and help consolidate against Miracles.
The rest of the board felt fine and mostly down to personal taste. I might swap the TNN for a Vendillion Clique as Eldrazi is less of an issue right now and flash seems good in this deck. I would have a second Pithing needle to help with stopping annoying Deathrites making all of your Standstills unplayable.
Overall I loved the deck. You should all test it and see what you think.
Sibelius
P.S. Fatal push is good, but often just a Disfigure. With fewer Goyf Decks it didn't shine as much as I thought it would.
Also remember you have to trigger revolt to kill a Leovold!
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