Quote Originally Posted by Kap'n Cook View Post
Posts like this are the reason we will be having a thread split. Confusion as to what build we are discussing and cross posting only adds to the confusion. Seth and I will work on getting it out hopefully this week or next.

Jasper I think you should do more research before making blanket statements about Shortcake's success in large tournaments.

4 Recruiters was and still is the correct number to run. Others might disagree and say they like 3, but I view that as suboptimal. It's like a blue deck running 3 brainstorm.
I think it is worth having a split thread at this point, and I look forward to the new thread that you guys are putting together. I've tried to be as clear as possible about which deck I was talking about when, but particularly when talking about both in almost the same breath it can be difficult to keep track.

I was basing my statement on 'professional' level tournaments on mtgtop8.com. My statement that 'no Shortcake list with 4 Recruiters top 8'd a major event for the three years after LeJay finished in the top 8 of GP Paris 2014' is accurate unless mtgtop8's archive is missing events, assuming the aforementioned criterion. here was Momme Gruppe's top 16 with a Shortcake build (albeit one with only 1 Enlightened Tutor) at GP Prague 2016, but other than that, there were no professional level finishes after Lejay's top 8 at the beginning of 2014.

Admittedly, my use of the word major was ambiguous in the sense that mtgtop8 has another category for major. Counting 'major' events as well, there were two in 2015, and a handful more in 2014, with the specific lists varying widely. I don't think my statement was all that unreasonable or under-researched, but apologies for the ambiguity.

I'm not even necessarily disputing that 4 Recruiters is the correct number, but saying that you view 3 as suboptimal isn't an argument in and of itself. I think that in an SDT-less world, 4 Recruiters is likely better than 3. I'm not sure if the issue is as clear cut when it comes to historical lists, and as it is I don't think we have the data to say for sure. I was just pointing out that 2 and 3 Recruiter lists experienced some degree of success. Additionally, the list in my article was intended as an example, taking into account the priorities that I laid out above, not a definitive 'best' Shortcake list.