Curse Stompy (Demon Stompy Reborn)

[Clark Kant]

I think its time this deck adopted the Grief/Reanimate/Troll/Rotting Regisaur package.

It dodges a ton of the hate that hits the Karn/Helm/Anvil/Chains/Chalice packages.


//Lands: 18
4 Ancient Tomb
3 City of Traitors
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Swamp
4 Agadeem's Awakening
1 Takenuma, Abandoned Mire

//Acceleration: 7
3 Chrome Mox
4 Dark Ritual

//Creatures: 25
4 Orcish Bowmasters
4 Opposition Agent
4 Grief
3 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse
3 Troll of Khazad
2 Dauthi Voidwalker
2 Rotting Regisaur
2 Shriekmaw
1 Plague Engineer

//Other: 10
4 Reanimate
3 Thoughtseize
2 The One Ring
1 Trinisphere

Thraben U played a similar list recently…

https://youtu.be/j7epZL5jRvg?si=omr4Rgq3LeJBH_6a

Begs the question, why devote a dozen slots to a slow and fragile easily disrupted Helm+Leyline+questionable cards like Palantir to help find these fragile combo pieces? Other combo decks are much faster, we cant race them unless we can disrupt them first.

So why not just fill those leyline helm palantir slots with hate bears, the disruptive (troll, reanimate, grief) combo and rely on undercosted beatsticks like Rotting Regisaur and Reanimated Trolls to close out the game only a turn or two slower than the Helm combo.

That way we are not trying to do two things at once, instead all of our win conditions would double as disruptive elements to stop faster combo decks.

But once youve cut both curses and helm, very little of the original deck remains and this instead looks closer to the original Demon Stompy lists.

[FTW]

The main reason to run the Helm combo is to pickup free wins against graveyard-based decks via maindeck Leyline, not to have the fastest combo. This is even better when fair decks depend on graveyard-based threats (DRC, Murktide, Uro, Emry) and weaker when they don't (Shadow, Bowmasters).

Helm and Curse are also strong choices when the fair meta is defined by Prismatic Ending (bad at interacting with 4+ cmc permanents) instead of Thoughtseize/Grief (good at interacting with slow combo pieces in hand) or Initiative/Monarch subgame (strong vs noncreatures). The recent meta shift makes the HelmLine combo less favorable and regular beatdown better. There are also now more playable black threats.

Is Regisaur necessary?

4 Voidwalker
4 Bowmasters
4 Oppo Agent
4 Grief
4 Troll
3 Sheoldred

4 Thoughtseize
4 Reanimate
4 Agadeem's Awakening
4 Ritual
X Sheoldred's Edict

That's already a strong core. Instead of Regisaur you could have the 4cmc Initiative creature or The One Ring at top end. I still like Shriekmaw as a 2-of. It works well with Reanimate, has a different CMC for Agadeem's Awakening, and Tomb decks can reasonably hardcast it.

[Captain Hammer]

Yes the recent meta shift makes the disrupt + beatdown plan better than the gravehate combo plan.

I have had issues with Voidwalker as a 4 of as my mana base has trouble with the BB cost early turns. So rather than risking multiples stuck in my hand, I prefer it as a 2 of with 2 more ready to bring in from the board against the matchups where graveyard hate matters. Similar logic for the 1 of Plague Engineer for Orcs etc.

Regisaur isnt needed but its very strong. A 7/6 for 2B is so much faster as a clock than a growing 2/2 lifelinker for 4, even with initiative. As a 2 of, its easy to time it after you empty your hand and at that point, theres basically no drawback. The ability to Reanimate discarded Shelodreds etc is also a cute trick.

[FTW]

Do you still need 3 City of Traitors?

Its main role is turn 1 Chalice (cut) and powering out the slow 4-5 cmc pieces. With Chalice cut, 3sphere down to 0-1 copy, the slower stuff cut (Karn, Helm, Leyline, Curses), and a good number of non-Sol turn 1 lines, why run that many Sol Lands?

Ritual, Mox, and Tomb should be enough acceleration for that threat curve. You could cut down to 1 City, go up to 4 Troll + 4 Mox (or another Swamp), and have more black sources.

Your current list is already at 14 turn 1 black sources (11 land + 3 Mox). Cycling Troll + Ritual should put you well into the territory of consistent BB.

[Captain Hammer]

I could potentially go down to 2 city but I think 3 is perfect number. Yes City is worth it, 90% of the spells are accelerated by City. It help cast a turn faster Troll, Shriekmaw, Oppo, Regisaur, Shriekmaw, Shelodred, Plague Engineer, The One Ring and Grief.

The only BB in the deck is Voidwalker, its not worth slowing the mana base down for the sake of playing one creature as a 4 of instead of as a 2 of.

If I had to cut a mana accelerant, I would cut a Chrome Mox before cutting City. Only because Chrome Mox is card disadvantage in a deck with very few ways to recoup card disadvantage.

Chrome Mox has lost me many games vs control decks running Prismatic Ending that 2 for 1 us. Chrome Mox is also useless as a top deck.

[Reeplcheep]

I’ve basically quit magic, but some thoughts on curses. There were two ideas behind the deck: dark ritual can be good in a fairish shell and expensive one card comboes are viable even in a fow/daze format. I feel like I successfully proved these points and a m happy of that accomplishment. However with modern power creep, monoB scam/helmline and initiative are better at those two points now, respectively.

thrabenU did do quite well with a suboptimal build of curses though

[FTW]

Your Curse version was imho the best version of Black Stompy in an earlier meta defined by cards like Oko, Uro, Pyroblast, and Prismatic Ending. Those decks really struggled to answer a resolved 4-5 cmc black enchantment, which made Curses & HelmLine particularly dangerous as the main combos. If they don't have the Force / Daze, you win.

The current meta has moved to Grief, Thoughtseize, Leyline Binding, Force of Vigor - unfortunately much better answers to slow black enchantments.

Spending multiple cards to accelerate a high cmc permanent that is difficult to answer (or at least answer at parity) was rare when you piloted Curses but now it's a pillar of the format (Initiative, Scam). So you did succeed there. The format has some variety instead of endless 1-for-1s.

[FTW]

Is Curses worth bringing back?
(Trying to restart discussion on some of the few threads that were still active here in recent years)

In the current combo-heavy meta, prison seems good. Mtgtop8 has combo at 40% of top 8s. Online it must be more like 50% of the meta. Dumpstering combo seems good as long as Fantasticar is legal.

Thraben U trophied with a suboptimal WB Curses build:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ADlllXQUfE
And also trophied with a suboptimal Stax build.

This more combo-focused HelmLine list Top 8ed a small paper event in Germany:
https://mtgtop8.com/event?e=89184&d=876840&f=LE

This Demon Stompy deck Top8ed a recent MTGO Challenge:
https://mtgtop8.com/event?e=89145&d=876554&f=LE

The top Legacy decks are Car (Vroomsday, TES), UB Tempo, UWx control, Reanimator, RW Energy, AlurenTell, UR Tempo.
Most of these decks are trying to play multiple cheap spells in a turn and really don't like Trinisphere or Curse of Exhaustion. Overwhelming Splendor wrecks Alurentell.


//Starting Core:
//Mana: 27
4 Chrome Mox
4 Dark Ritual
4 Ancient Tomb
3 City of Traitors
4 Fell the Profane
8 Swamp

//Artifacts: 12
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Trinisphere
4 The One Ring



You could try several paths:
1) Helm-Leyline-Karn
2) Curse package
3) All beatdown

I don't think there's room for both Helm & Curses together while staying competitive in the current meta.

//Helm Package (vs Artifact & GY decks): 16 cards
4 Dauthi Voidwalker
4 Karn, the Great Creator
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Beseech the Mirror
1 Helm of Obedience

//Flex Slots: 5
4 Orcish Bowmasters
1 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse

//Karnboard: 6
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Mycosynth Lattice
1 Liquimetal Coating
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Disruptor Flute

Beseech makes the combo consistent. You can Bargain 3sphere to freecast a combo piece if it'll win that turn. You can also Bargain The One Ring into Sheoldred/Karn/Ring to stop losing life.

The beatdown plan is straightforward.
//Beatdown package: 15 cards
4 Orcish Bowmasters
4 Opposition Agent
4 Barrowgoyf
3 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse

//Flex: 6
4 Rotting Regisaur
2 Long Goodbye



//Curse Package (better vs creature combos): 8
4 Curse of Misfortunes
1 Curse of Exhaustion
1 Curse of Death's Hold
1 Cruel Reality
1 Overwhelming Splendor

//Flex Slots: 13
4 Karn, the Great Creator
4 Orcish Bowmasters
4 Barrowgoyf
1 Sheoldred, the Apocalypse


For the curse plan, it's probably better to support it with some form of tutor to consistently find the lock piece you need soon enough. Curse of Misfortunes on its own isn't consistent enough.
Tutor options:

• Beseech the Mirror (Pros: Puts Exhaustion straight into play vs combo; Cons: Puts others in hand & BBB cost)
• Diabolic Intent (Pros: Tutors Curse of Misfortunes or Sphere or SB card to hand for 1B; Cons: Need fodder support)
• Profane Tutor (Pros: Same as Diabolic Intent; Cons: 2 turn delay is slow as a topdeck)
• Heliod's Pilgrim (Pros: Tutors Curse of Misfortunes to hand for 2W & blocks 1/1s; Cons: Need BW manabase)
• Academy Rector (Pros: Puts any curse straight into play; Cons: Needs sac outlet)
• Herald of Amity (Pros: Puts a curse straight into play; Cons: Can't find 1-ofs, so you need to run multiples of more curses = bad topdecks)

BW isn't awful as it gives access to better white removal and hardcasting Curse of Exhaustion, if you're willing to accept the weaker manabase.
Glasswing Grace is funny as a BW dual land that imprints on Mox and is an "Aura" for Herald of Amity.


BW Curses-Pilgrim Prison?

//Tutors: 11
4 Curse of Misfortunes
4 Heliod's Pilgrim
3 Herald of Amity

//Curses: 6
2 Curse of Exhaustion
1 Curse of Death's Hold
1 Cruel Reality
2 Overwhelming Splendor

//Mana: 31
4 Chrome Mox
4 Lotus Petal
4 Dark Ritual
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Marsh Flats
4 Glasswing Grace
4 Scrubland
1 Shadowy Backstreet
1 Swamp
1 Plains

//Support: 11
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Orcish Bowmasters
2 Trinisphere
2 Ghostly Prison

//SB:
3 Curse of Silence
1 Curse of Exhaustion
1 Overwhelming Splendor
1 Replenish


This build is trying to pull of the Curses plan with higher consistency, while disrupting opponent with early resistors.

Some downsides are that it's harder to play the Stompy plan with Curses and still have room for other early interaction. Heliod's Pilgrim into Curse of Misfortunes is also very slow tempo, taking 2 turns to get a relevant lock piece in play. Something that tutors an enchantment to battlefield like Academy Rector is much faster. But that takes different support.

BW Nic-Curses?

//Tutors: 12
4 Curse of Misfortunes
4 Academy Rector
4 Herald of Amity

//Curses/Auras: 8
2 Glasswing Grace
2 Ossification
1 Curse of Exhaustion
1 Curse of Death's Hold
1 Cruel Reality
1 Overwhelming Splendor

//Support: 20
4 Thoughtseize
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Veteran Explorer
3 Erode
3 Witherbloom Charm
2 Orcish Bowmasters

//Lands: 20
3 Forest
2 Swamp
2 Plains
3 Verdant Catacombs
3 Windswept Heath
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Savannah
1 Underground Mortuary
1 Karakas
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Hall of Heliod's Generosity

//SB:
2 Curse of Exhaustion
2 Overwhelming Splendor


Curve:
lands - 22
1 - 15
2 - 7
3 - 0
4 - 9
5 - 5
higher - 2

This might be a better way to play the Curse plan while playing disruption vs fast combo and early creatures.