Can someone tell me if it's possible to animate dead Akroma, SSS or any creature who can't be the target of spells. Yes? No? Why? What happens?
thanks
“THROUGH me you pass into the city of woe, through me you pass into eternal pain, Through me among the people lost for aye.
Justice the founder of my fabric moved, to rear me was the task of Power divine, Supremest Wisdom, and primeval Love.
Before me things create were none, save things Eternal, and eternal I endure.
All hope abandon, ye who enter here.” - Inferno
Akroma stays in play with animate dead.
Akroma lives due to Animate dead no wbeing an aura. However, SSS dies. There's a difference in protection and cant be the target of spells and abilities.
The rule pertaining to auras and protection basically says "if an aura would attempt to attach itself to a creature with protection from it, it fails and goes to the yard". Animate Dead will return Akroma to play, attempt to attach, and be put into the graveyard before it actually enchanted her, leaving her in play and the Animate Dead in the yard.
I don't think the same rule applies to creatures with Shroud (which is what that ability will be keyworded as of Future Sight), but don't quote me on it.
Originally Posted by Mr Wiggl3s
Wrong. It'll stay attached to the SSS, and it'll fall off and leave Akroma in play. Here's why:
Animate Dead comes into play as an enchantment. Then, a triggered ability brings a creature from the graveyard to play and Animate Dead becomes an aura attached to that creature. The ability targets, but it targets the card, not the creature.
Therefore, Animate Dead will bring Simic Sky Swallower into play and attach to it. State-based effects do not prevent an Aura from being attached to a creature unless the creature has Protection from a quality that Aura has, or some other ability that prevents an Aura from being attached to it. Therefore "Can't be the target of spells or abilities" will not remove an Aura, as it has neither been targeted by a spell nor by an ability.
Also worthy of note, if you destroy the Animate Dead on the Simic Sky Swallower, the SSS goes byebye, as the leaves play trigger of Animate Dead does not target either.
End result: Simic Sky Swallower in play, Animate Dead attached to it.
As for Akroma, this is more complicated.
Animate Dead comes into play. The trigger resolves. Akroma comes into play. Then we hit this little rule snag:
G1.29b - An Aura can enchant only a permanent or player whose properties are indicated by its enchant keyword ability. An Aura attached to an illegal permanent or not attached to a permanent is put into its owner's graveyard. (This is a state-based effect. See Rule 420.) [CompRules 2005/10/01]
If the creature card put into play has Protection from Black (or a similar effect that prevents Animate Dead from legally being attached), then it will fail to become attached and it as per Rule 212.4k, which states that an Aura trying to move onto an illegal permanent will stay where it is. Then the Animate Dead will go to the graveyard as an Aura that is not enchanting anything. This will not destroy the creature because it is not enchanting any creature at the time it leaves play. [D'Angelo 2006/05/09]
Therefore, the Aura never becomes attached to Akroma. As it never becomes attached, the trigger from Animate Dead leaving play doesn't happen, as it was never enchanting a creature to begin with.
End result: Akroma in play, no auras attached. Animate Dead in Graveyard.
EDIT: This question comes up a lot. Can I nominate this for Sticky?
Animate Dead
- Enchantment
When Animate Dead comes into play, if it's in play, it becomes an Aura with enchant creature. Put target creature card from a graveyard into play under your control and attach Animate Dead to it.
Enchanted creature gets -1/-0.
When Animate Dead leaves play, destroy enchanted creature. It can't be regenerated.502.7c A permanent with protection can't be enchanted by Auras that have the stated quality.212.4k If an effect attempts to attach an Aura in play to a permanent or player, that permanent or player must be able to be enchanted by it. If the permanent or player can't be, the Aura doesn't move.420.5d An Aura attached to an illegal permanent or player, or not attached to a permanent or player, is put into its owner's graveyard.402.8 Abilities of all other objects usually function only while that object is in play.When Animate Dead comes into play, its "comes into play" ability triggers. Akroma, Simic Sky Swallower, et al are legal targets for Animate Dead's ability because their abilities do not function in the graveyard.212.4e An Aura spell requires a target, which is restricted by its enchant ability.
When the triggered ability resolves, Animate Dead becomes an Aura, the the targetted creature is put into play, and it attempts to attach to the creature.
In the case of Akroma, protection from black prevents the black aura from attaching (enchanting). When state-based effects are checked, because it is not attached to anything, the Animate Dead will go to the graveyard. Its "leaves play" ability will then trigger, but since it was never attached to anything, it will have no effect. The Akroma in play is unaffected.
In the case of Simic Sky Swallower, Animate Dead attaches with no problems. Auras only target when they are being played as spells, not when an effect is attaching them.
(Bonus: The ", if it's in play," is an intervening-if clause (403.4) which will prevent the "comes into play" ability from doing anything if Animate Dead is not in play when the ability resolves.)
Last edited by cdr; 04-20-2007 at 01:15 PM.
“It's possible. But it involves... {checks archives} Nature's Revolt, Opalescence, two Unstable Shapeshifters (one of which started as a Doppelganger), a Tide, an animated land, a creature with Fading, a Silver Wyvern, some way to get a creature into play in response to stuff, some way to get a land into play in response to stuff (a different land from the animated land), and one heck of a Rube Goldberg timing diagram.”
-David DeLaney
I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of people still think it won't work to Animate Dead Akroma. I don't know if it was a rulings change, or if there was just widespread ignorance of the issue, but, back in the day, many "Official Judges" would rule that Spirit of the Night would die after being Animate Dead-ed. I heard it with my own ears, several times. (I never heard it with anybody else's ears.)Wow, I didn't know that. Some [expletive deleted] told me that Akroma died... I guess it's time to bring back reanimator
Yup, I've heard that many times too long time ago. That made me giving up playing Reanimator.
“THROUGH me you pass into the city of woe, through me you pass into eternal pain, Through me among the people lost for aye.
Justice the founder of my fabric moved, to rear me was the task of Power divine, Supremest Wisdom, and primeval Love.
Before me things create were none, save things Eternal, and eternal I endure.
All hope abandon, ye who enter here.” - Inferno
Depending on how "Back in the day" you mean (For me, Back in the day is Ice Age), it actually used to work that way several years back. Therefore there's a chance your judge was right at the time.
The rules for that have changed three times now since Ige Age. Most of them semm to have been accidental in fixing other rules.
Well the wording on Animate Dead is changing again and the Akroma - Animate Dead "trick" no longer will work.
For online...
They are changing the Oracle wording which effects both online and real life.
Based on that link they're changing the way Eater Of The Dead works too. So I'm curious with the way the new wording is set wouldn't you be be able to equip an Arcane Teachings to it and ping your opponent for 20? The way I read it, since untapping is an activation cost you don't need there to even be a target creature in the graveyard to untap it as it would just cause a fizzle of the effect. Am I wrong about that?
You would need at least one creature in the yard, as you need to have a legal target for the ability in order to activate it.
However, you don't need to let that ability resolve so you can target the same creature in the yard multiple times.
Apparently, they caught that trick too so they wouldn't change the Oracle wording for Eater of the Dead anymore.
The Source: Your Source for "The Source: Your Source for..." cliche.
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