[Deck] Food Chain - Evoke Abuse

[Syco_Tr0pic]

He probably meant Brainfreeze. You guys are too fast at flaming, I think.

[GreenOne]

He probably meant Brainfreeze. You guys are too fast at flaming, I think.

Not flaming, it was just funny..

[Willoe]

...

Anyway, anybody thought about a phage/inner-flame acolyte as a kill condition? Phage is tutorable with Fierce Empath, and Inner-flame acolyte is tutorable with imperial recruiter! If you got a recruiter in hand and a fierce empath, you simple chain the recruiters and at the end of the chain, tutor for acolyte. Empath tutors for phage, eight mana is saved up, play and kill with phage. Is it consistent enough as a another win condition?

[Elfrago]

...

Anyway, anybody thought about a phage/inner-flame acolyte as a kill condition? Phage is tutorable with Fierce Empath, and Inner-flame acolyte is tutorable with imperial recruiter! If you got a recruiter in hand and a fierce empath, you simple chain the recruiters and at the end of the chain, tutor for acolyte. Empath tutors for phage, eight mana is saved up, play and kill with phage. Is it consistent enough as a another win condition?

And then get Phage eated by a goyf...

Or chump-blocked by a 1/1 dude...

[rufus]

He probably meant Brainfreeze. You guys are too fast at flaming, I think.

Actually, I meant Brainfart, but that's still in R&D - you guys aren't supposed to know about it.
I also had root maze instead of food chain. :<

After Happy Gilmore's post I figured I had digressed too far anyway.

[Oros, the Avenger]

I test this list right know (and i know it isn't perfect ;) )

Lands // 22
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Wasteland
4 City of Brass
3 Gemstone Mine
3 Tendo Ice Bridge

Creatures // 22
1 Myojin of Seeing Winds
4 Imperial Recruiter
4 Mulldrifter
4 Raven Familiar
3 Court Hussar
1 Fierce Empath
4 Cloud of Faeries
1 Maga, Traitor to Mortals
1 Cloudthresher

Spells // 16
4 Food Chain
4 Trinisphere
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond

Sideboard
4 Sword of Fire and Ice
4 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Sword of Light and Shadow
4 Shriekmaw

The Cloudthresher is tutorable if i need to, gives +3 mana and we need 2 less mana for the Maga kill.

[Happy Gilmore]

Imperial Recruiter may be very good but I couldn't advocate any deck that runs a $75 uncommon. Only a hand full of player have them or have the assets to get them. Designing the deck so its playable is important not simply to create the most powerful deck possible.

[rufus]

Imperial Recruiter may be very good but I couldn't advocate any deck that runs a $75 uncommon. Only a hand full of player have them or have the assets to get them. Designing the deck so its playable is important not simply to create the most powerful deck possible.

Well, there's the goblin option...

Goblin Matron
Goblin Ringleader
Changeling Berserker
Boggart Mob

Along with some of the usual suspects might work out well.

[Oros, the Avenger]

How would the "Goblin Option" look like?

[TeenieBopper]

How would the "Goblin Option" look like?

4 Wasteland
2 Ancient tomb
6 fetch
8 mountain
4 ESG

4 Food Chain

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Skirk Prospector
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
3 Siege Gang Commander
4 Goblin Recrui... oh wai....

[Bovinious]

4 Wasteland
2 Ancient tomb
6 fetch
8 mountain
4 ESG

4 Food Chain

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Skirk Prospector
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
3 Siege Gang Commander
4 Goblin Recrui... oh wai....

I LOL'D, then sighed, I miss that deck...

And also I think SSG would be a good inclusion as well :)

[rufus]

How would the "Goblin Option" look like?

Ideally, it would be 'champion the tutor' - the Ringleader and Matron's abilities are 'comes into play' triggers so they interact well with Champion.

Goblin Matron
Goblin Ringleader
Changeling Berserker
Changeling Titan
Goblin Warchief
Goblin Lackey

Food Chain
Thorn of Amethyst
Trinisphere
Chalice of the Void

Wooded Foothills
Taiga
Chrome Mox
Ancient Tomb
City of Traitors

[Wallace]

Whats this decks plan if you can't resolve a Food Chain?

[raharu]

Cry in the corner or start the prayer to tutor up another one

[94teen]

Well, the goblin option goes beatdown. The other ones...try to draw another Food Chain.

I like the goblin option, and I think I'm going to start building that. Looks like a blast to play.

[Di]

Imperial Recruiter may be very good but I couldn't advocate any deck that runs a $75 uncommon. Only a hand full of player have them or have the assets to get them. Designing the deck so its playable is important not simply to create the most powerful deck possible.

That is absolutely ridiculous. The fact that you purposely intend to play a build of a deck that is strictly inferior is absolutely absurd simply due to the price. If you can't build an optimal version of a deck, then pick a different deck. Would you not run Tarmogoyf if it was a $100 card? And replace it with Werebear in every single deck it is in? No. Because you would get crushed. Think of the Threshold mirror, exact copies, except one person uses Werebear over Tarmogoyf. Do you believe that person has a good chance of winning?

However, there were some (supposed) exceptions a while back. In 1.5, it was possible to replace Mana Drain with Counterspell in Landstill and find some replacement such as Buried Alive for Bazaar in Dragon. However, hardly anyone ran those builds and if they did you would never see them in a top8 because they were strictly inferior and thus couldn't compete. If you want a combo deck to compete, especially a deck like this, you need to have the absolute optimal build. Otherwise you'll get blown away, unless there somehow happens to be a miracle card that functions better than Imperial Recruiter. If there is, then by all means spread the word, because otherwise I don't think it's worth the putting the effort in because although I feel the deck has potential, Imperial Recruiter is what makes it work.

[greenmage]

That is absolutely ridiculous. The fact that you purposely intend to play a build of a deck that is strictly inferior is absolutely absurd simply due to the price. If you can't build an optimal version of a deck, then pick a different deck. Would you not run Tarmogoyf if it was a $100 card? And replace it with Werebear in every single deck it is in? No. Because you would get crushed. Think of the Threshold mirror, exact copies, except one person uses Werebear over Tarmogoyf. Do you believe that person has a good chance of winning?

However, there were some (supposed) exceptions a while back. In 1.5, it was possible to replace Mana Drain with Counterspell in Landstill and find some replacement such as Buried Alive for Bazaar in Dragon. However, hardly anyone ran those builds and if they did you would never see them in a top8 because they were strictly inferior and thus couldn't compete. If you want a combo deck to compete, especially a deck like this, you need to have the absolute optimal build. Otherwise you'll get blown away, unless there somehow happens to be a miracle card that functions better than Imperial Recruiter. If there is, then by all means spread the word, because otherwise I don't think it's worth the putting the effort in because although I feel the deck has potential, Imperial Recruiter is what makes it work.

I'd say it depends on what you seek.
If you seek winning as often as possible you are correct.
If you rather play for the fun factor and only need a decent deck for your meta there's nothing wrong with replacements.

[Oros, the Avenger]

I think the problem of the Deck is that even with the Recruter, you have problems reaching the 23 mana(sometimes less) mana for the kill. I tried out the Golem-Tendrils kill, but you need 2 Golems if you dont play with Doubling Cube, thats quite too much. Then, maybe you should run Enlightened Tutor, so you got a first turn Tutor for Food Chain. I think i try a list with Cube-Golem-Tendrils kill, but there you also need 10 spells, thats quiet a lot.

[Willoe]

the problem is, we got to wait until morningtide to see if it gets any win-now creature or more evokers with good abilities. An example could be of a card that was an autoinclude in the deck:

7BB (a high cmc)
6/6
creature - elemental
when CARDNAME comes into play, you may search your library for a card and put it in your hand. Then shuffle your library.
Evoke 2BB (or 3BB, this doesn't matter)

that would be very good for the deck. The problem is, that evoke is such a new mechanic and in legacy, a max of two of them are playable. Mulldrifter and Shriekmaw.

I know this isn't a fictional card thread, but I think morningtide will bring us what's needed for the deck. If an evokeable version of imperial recruiter becomes printed, I'm a happy man! :) Until then, we can rely on at least two inconsistent kills:
maga (requires around 20 mana, depends on whether the opponent has lost life due to fetches, tombs, thoughtseizes or something)

the grozoth toolbox: fetches a hell lot of cards, but none of the cards have haste except for spirit of the night. You got to wait another turn, and that gives the opponent a turn for finding that Damnation. Although the bringers can give a nice mana boost (+5 mana advantage) or provide as a nice clock with a good ability.

other wierd kills: golem tendrils or coal stoker grapeshot are possible, but since grapeshot isn't a creature, it's hard to play and tutor for. The same is true for tendrils kill.

So what I'm saying is: we got to wait for morningtide to see what it delivers. Efficent creature tutors is what the deck needs! Until then, keep on the development!

[Oros, the Avenger]

I tested the Golem-Cube-Tendrils option and i think its a little more consinstent. I dont run 3spheres or Chalice, so i have enough slots to run Enlightened Tutor. Tendrils can easily picked up during combo.The cube is quiet easy to cast, but may slow the combo down a turn. But you dont need the cube to kill, i run 3 Golems, so i can also easily play 2 of them for Tendrils. Its quiet hard to reach lethal storm, because sometimes you have all pieces for the kill AND enough mana, but only a storm counter of 6 or 7. Also, i dont run Recruters in my list, because i needed the slots for other things. I will test a little more and then post my list.