thoughts on this card?
It might be a win more card.
pretty vanilla unless you already done damage.
So my own guess is no.
Knollspine Dragon
Red Rare 5RR Creature - Dragon 7/5
Flying
When Knollspine Dragon comes into play, you may discard your hand and draw cards equal to the damage dealt to target opponent this turn.
My fave decks to run:
Death & Taxes
Aggro Loam
Mono Blue Control
Enchantress
My thoughts... read the page before your post... We already commented on this card on the last page.
General consensus is very decent and seriusly test worthy unlike another card that was being disscussed.
yet another first place win here at GE. pretty unusual wins though,
Round 1: Jerry with Belcher
2-1.
Round 2: Mini Scherer with BW creature control.
very easy 2-0
Round 3: ACE with RG Loam with countryside crusher
and easy 2-0
Round 4: Matt with Ichorid Combo
a very hard fought 2-0, he just didnt draw into the nuts game 1 and two extirpates sealed game 2.
another undefeated win ... more people need to play this in tournaments and post results. ^_^
Id like to milk that oreo... split it in half...and lick all that sweet sweet candy off. mmmmm... oreos....
I think that this latest tourney shows that the deck can win against combo. Jerry is a VERY competent Belcher player and I am a very competent Ichorid player. I mean after side boarding re-animator has a pretty decent match up versus combo. I agree more people need to play the deck in tourneys every where, and they need to post results. I plan on going with Rod to Pro-Tour Hollywood and will definitely run this deck in the Legacy side event.
Would be nice to see some well written description of the games, instead of only the results, so we know what your opponent did and what you could do to respond, on some decisive game actions.
Keep moon-walking.
Yeah would be nice, you can check the Ichorid thread for a description of the last round against me if you want.Originally Posted by Jaiminho
Match ups:
Landstill
Belcher
Angel Stompy
Dragon Stompy
Vial Goblins
Pretty much auto win. very close to a bye. If the opposing goblin deck has a white splash it still in your favor.
MVP: Bogardan Hellkite
Side: Repeal for the crypts?
Ichorid
UG*(b/r/w) Threshold
Also, here is (IMO) the basic, must have parts of the deck
Code:Rod's Reanimator Spells: 4x Reanimate 4x Exhume 4x Careful Study 4x Brainstorm Enchantments 4x Animate Dead Creatures: 4x Putrid Imp 2x Oona's Prowler 4x Bogardan Hellkite 1x Simic Sky Swallower 1x Sundering Titan 1x Akroma, Angel of Wrath 1x Phantom Nishoba Lands: 3x Bloodstained Mire 3x Polluted Delta 4x Underground Sea 4x Swamp 1x Island Total: 49
Last edited by Mr Wiggl3s; 04-20-2008 at 01:29 PM.
Why is Dark Ritual not a staple in this deck? I mean, turn 1 you can play a combination of;
Ritual --> Putrid Imp or Oona's Prowler (or Zombie Infestation if you would play that, or even Therapy yourself) and use the remaining mana for either Reanimate, Exhume or Animate Dead (depending on how much mana the discard effect has cost you). Assuming you had a fatty in hand as well.
That is a cardcombination of
1 Ritual
1 Discard effect (multiple options!)
1 Renanimate effect (multiple options!)
1 Fatty (multiple options!)
Looks very doable to me. It's also nice on turn 2. Ritual, Intuition, Reanimate. Allowing turn 1 to do stuff like Brainstorm, Thoughtseize, Imp, Study.
dark Ritual only feeds these combinations:Why is Dark Ritual not a staple in this deck? I mean, turn 1 you can play a combination of;
Ritual --> Putrid Imp or Oona's Prowler (or Zombie Infestation if you would play that, or even Therapy yourself) and use the remaining mana for either Reanimate, Exhume or Animate Dead (depending on how much mana the discard effect has cost you). Assuming you had a fatty in hand as well.
That is a cardcombination of
1 Ritual
1 Discard effect (multiple options!)
1 Renanimate effect (multiple options!)
1 Fatty (multiple options!)
Looks very doable to me. It's also nice on turn 2. Ritual, Intuition, Reanimate. Allowing turn 1 to do stuff like Brainstorm, Thoughtseize, Imp, Study.
Imp + Animate Dead/Exhume
Oona's Prowler + Reanimate
Imp + Reanimate
Imp is in my deck played as a 4 of. I play with 3 Prowlers. Chances are to get one of those seven cards in my opening hand ALONG with a Dark Ritual, very small. After turn 1, they're useless, as you don't want to trade card disadvantage for tempo. The deck also gets a lot of card disadvantage which trades into tempo by reanimating a huge creature, I don't think we need any more. Dark Ritual has been tested, and the only place where it would do would be in monoblack reanimator, which is another thing. Oh, and monoblack reanimator sucks arse. Just so you know it.
Like you say yourself, it requires four cards to reanimate a creature turn 1 and swing on turn 2. Compare that to a four card combo that does not necessarily win you the game.
So Dark Ritual = Speed but large losses because of even more card disadvantage. Don't play it. Play Rodgon666's list. The only thing you should ever change is # of Intuition, # of Oona's Prowler and which fatties you should play. But you don't have to change that, it works fine right now.
"You're English is terrible and inconsistent."
-DownSyndromeKarl
I'd seriously like some explanation for this and real playtesting results.
Current Goblin lists have Warren weirding for your fat guys and gempalms/fanatics for your discard-outlets. This combined with therapy/thoughtseize/leylines from the SB makes it hard to believe for this matchup to be a "bye".
I have yet to play against a goblin deck that ran all of what you just suggested would kill this deck.
As for the possibility of those cards... yes they are all options but they are not generally all together as your post seemed (to me) to imply. I'll takle each of your arguments one at a time.
For the Warren's Weirding we have little midgets that are just fine biting it such as imp and prowler if you are compitent enough to play around the weirding. If as you suggest they run that with gemplam and fanatics take into account the odds of them having weirding and either fanatic or gempalm. If we assume 4 weirding and 6 in some combination of fanatic and gempalm then if you work out the math the odds of them having both of those and us not having double midget and fatty then you will notice that those odds are very very low particulary if you wana take think about them having weirding in hand and ripping a gempalm which buys us another free turn unless its after turn 4 at which point we have gotten at least dome decent return off our cards.
As for the sideboard arguement the therapy/thoughtseize is not really that good against us due to the high level of redundancy we have. My specific build runs 15 grave outlets (counting intuition as a 3 of), 12 reanimation spells, and between 8-10 fatties. Our levels of redundancy far out do the goblin players.
As for the leyline unless they get it in their opening hand we are usually able to get a nice bit of pressure on them before it even shows up making it pointless. IF they get it in their opening grip then we have to beat with imps and prowlers until we hit repeal mana.
The gob decks i play against are red/white splash, i haven't played any r/b gob decks...
Our discard outlets are just that, outlets, they are just here as a chunk blocker or discarding.
Basically, they wont be able to keep up due to the Hellkites, among the others. If they do run Warren, animate dead the killed Hellkite for 5 more damage spread out.
Im thinking about running this setup:
Comments?Code:// Lands 4 [TE] Swamp 1 [PT] Island 3 [ON] Bloodstained Mire 3 [ON] Polluted Delta 2 [RAV] Watery Grave 4 [U] Underground Sea // Creatures 4 [LRW] Oona's Prowler 4 [TO] Putrid Imp 4 [TSP] Bogardan Hellkite 2 [LE] Akroma, Angel of Wrath 1 [DIS] Tidespout Tyrant 1 [DIS] Simic Sky Swallower 1 [FD] Bringer of the Blue Dawn 1 [JU] Phantom Nishoba // Spells 4 [US] Exhume 4 [TE] Reanimate 4 [4E] Animate Dead 4 [5E] Brainstorm 4 [OD] Careful Study 3 [TE] Intuition 2 [LRW] Ponder
And anyone notice how Nishomba is the ultimate Jitte stopper?
To say that the Goblins matchup is a joke... Now THAT is a joke!
All say "ooh, I'll beat Goblins any day". Fuck no, you don't. Goblins is still a very, very competitive deck, did anyone notice that it's a DTB?
I have no problems with people that say their goblins matchups are favorable, but to call a DTB matchup a joke... Priceless.
Even though you can reanimate your hellkites, goblins will - and does it frequent according to my testing against the deck - kick your butt if they remove your critter. When you reanimate, you have three possibiliets:
Reanimate it and lose 8 life which eventually will cost you the game.
Animate-Dead it a 4/5, and therefore it becomes a five turn clock and then virtually giving the goblins player a timewalk.
Exhuming it only to see a SGC or a Matron enter play. Even though you can kill it, you will most likely lose from their CiP abilties.
All in all, Goblins isn't a joke.
With W or G splash, the matchup might be very close, but with B splash, they gain Earwig Squad to remove your silver bullets and Warren Wierding, a tutor target to smash your dudes with while they smash you.
So no, the goblins matchup is NOT a joke. It's a matchup that - like EVERY other deck - shouldn't be taken too unserious or even underestimated.
Just my 2 cents.
"You're English is terrible and inconsistent."
-DownSyndromeKarl
AFAIK, DTB status doesn't make any statement whatsoever about a deck's relative power level vs. any and all challengers.I have no problems with people that say their goblins matchups are favorable, but to call a DTB matchup a joke... Priceless.
I think it's safe to say that most Goblin players would rather not see a turn two Phantom Nishoba. If Goblins are a significant part of a metagame, Reanimator has far better sideboard cards against it than Goblins has against Reanimator.
I was talking about most people's current feelings about their matchups against goblins. Is it only me who thinks that people are too arrogant when calling the top decks of legacy as jokes?
And so sorry if I misexplained myself, but you got to agree that it's too lame to call goblins a joke unless your deck is certainly anti goblins. And it isn't.
Regarding DTB Status: It proves a lot if you know (and I bet you do) what DTB status really means. It's not just random jank that becomes DTB's.
Phantom Nishoba? It's a good creature and all that, but do it frequently see play every game against goblins? (I think you can answer that question yourself)
If you want to strengthen your goblins (or other aggro matchup) you should arrange your creature base like this: 4 Bogardan Hellkite 4 Phantom Nishoba, 1 Akroma, Angel of Wrath, 1 Garza Zol, Plague Queen. It's the creature base that I like the most. No STP dodging is compensated by massive lifegain, 1 random bikini chick that dodges all other removal and 1 random card engine, and 4 burn creatures. I think that is pretty solid.
Please explain to me what AFAIK means. I don't like too long abbrevations, and especially not if they're flamebait/flaming. But since I don't know what has been abbrevated, I can't tell (obv.).
"You're English is terrible and inconsistent."
-DownSyndromeKarl
AFAIK = As far as I know
It's a deck that certainly doesn't have too much trouble casting Engineered Plague for starters and has a mana base that doesn't fold to wasteland/port too easily.it's too lame to call goblins a joke unless your deck is certainly anti goblins. And it isn't.
Hellkite puts Goblins in the position of having a ringleader or else and it's not going to be able to cast one and while guarding against reanimator (by pinning down land, etc.). If I were playing goblins myself, I'd prefer to run into a lot of decks before I met up with this one. :shrug:
Thanks! :D
And it's a deck that draws Engineered Plague consistently, and a deck that resolves it at turn 3. The problem with E-plague is that it's rarely enough. And both W and G splash can deal with it by using grip or disenchant. Heck, even the seals will do.
It's true that the Hellkite and the Nishoba causes several problems for the goblins player, but who's the actual aggressor in this match? Reanimator has very, very powerful threats but hardly any answers. Goblins beat you by swarming you with incredible tempo advantage. With the recent lists, goblins has become a lot stronger. Warren Wierding is a just powerful answer as reanimator's threats are. Sure, reanimator can just sacrifice an imp, but that imp can easily be burned away by other targets, namely Sharpshooter and Incinerator.
I'm not saying that reanimator does not have any chance, trust me, it has - a big one in fact - to beat goblins. It's just a match that should be taken very serious if you want to win. Simply because goblins is a good deck. Reanimator's a good deck too, and the two deck's - solely in my experience - matchup very even.
Also, goblins with white splash can use Mirror Entity (matron target) to deal with damage. Since the entity can be vialed in too, you can get a nasty surprise by watching the small green men grow to say 4/4's. Just so you know it
"You're English is terrible and inconsistent."
-DownSyndromeKarl
how often is a ringleader going to be in the GY in turn two?... hahaha...
the big difference in power is not relative. you might be playing the deck wrong or the list you play isnt really optimal. a turn 2 critter on your side will disrupt the goblin player in more ways than just killing their dudes. after a 5/5 hits play and already dealt dmage to them, or a 7/10 destroyed their lands, or 7/7 lifegainer hits play they have to go on the defensive. if i get a titan turn two, you are losing your lands, specially in any of the 2 color builds. then tell me... how does a goblin deck win without lands?
Warren Weirding does not mean i loose any more than i loose to decks with 4 swords and and 4 innocent bloods and 4 diabolic edicts. it just means you have to play a good strategy, if you know wha your going against you should know what to keep and what to mull. my deck overpowers goblins, not alot of decks can deal with a consistent disruption of their strategies while geting beat down by fatties. sorry but it just doesnt happen. if you spend your first turns waiting to use warren weirdings on my creautures youll just get fucked up by their abilities, or the weinies and a jitte.
and i dont feel like and arrogant bastard when i say its pretty much a bye and they are a joke. maybe their not a joke matchup versus most decks but it is against this deck.
just like this deck i a joke versus quick combo 75% of the time.
and yeah ive tested alot, our rescent little deck tests came up with that out of 12 game 4 preside and 8 post side against the listed BR gobos, reanimator won 7 with one going to goblins by a close margin. all the others were just easy.
sorry if your offended by that man, it just is what it is. hahahaha
There are not one, but actually two different shift keys on the keyboard. One is next to the "z" the other next to the "/." Start using them or keep on getting warnings. - Bardo
Last edited by Bardo; 04-20-2008 at 09:23 PM.
Id like to milk that oreo... split it in half...and lick all that sweet sweet candy off. mmmmm... oreos....
The 10 creatures that the reanimator deck reanimates wrecks goblins.
Phanthom gives life.
Akroma becomes a clock + piledriver killer
Hellkites just clear the board
Blue dawn gives as much tempo to you as a ringleader to them
SSSwallower isn't as good as Akroma but at least is a beater they can't block
Titan kills their lands
If the reanimator deck was entering a tournament where the meta was 80%+ goblins, I would consider adding a Thunder Dragon. Thunder Dragon used to be a backbreaker against goblins before goblins became the non-dominant deck in tournaments.
You know that nightmare where your running but you just can't get away...
I think you'll need to be more specific in your wins and a little more clear on what your opponents were playing in their decks. A deck that could be considered "b/w creature control" should easily knock off your reanimated dudes, especially when we have no idea what defensive tools your using to combat them. Lord knows you can win with a good top-deck, but I'd be interested to know exactly what you were playing.
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