[Deck] Burn

[scrow213]

I guess that depends what your meta really is. What decks do you see a lot of?

[Pltnmngl]

I'm part of a pretty young community. Not many non-basics around here. Pretty hodge-podge.

[scrow213]

I'm part of a pretty young community. Not many non-basics around here. Pretty hodge-podge.

Well do you see a lot of high-caliber decks, or any of the "Decks to Beat" or is it all just random homebrew.dec?

[ScatmanX]

Goblins
Eva Green
Combo
The Rock
Merfolk
MonoU
Faeries
the mighty queen
sui black
Arent gratly affected by PoP...

[bowvamp]

Umm, what's the mighty queen? I'm pretty sure that eva green, some builds of goblins, some builds of mermen, and the rock run a fair amount of non-basics. I would suggest running 4 PoP in pretty much any meta as this is my favorite card in burn, but if your meta is tribal/combo, run another deck!

[jjjoness']

the mighty queen -> probably Quinn.
In this meta I would play PoP in the side, since it's still good against some decks. Also you should play at least 4 boardsweepers in the main, I'd prefer 4 Flamebreak. This is really nuts against Gobs, Merfolk and Faeries. Actually your meta is pretty nice for burn, no Chalice.dec, no Counterbalance.dec and a lot of controldecks that autolose to burn.

[Pltnmngl]

Well do you see a lot of high-caliber decks, or any of the "Decks to Beat" or is it all just random homebrew.dec?

Mostly home-brew with a little goblins sprinkled in there.

[scrow213]

Mostly home-brew with a little goblins sprinkled in there.

I guess it is hard to say without knowing what these decks are running. Flamebreak or Volcanic Fallout(?) seem like they make good choices, depending on what creatures you see (Goblins, Bob, Mongoose, Kird Ape etc). But like I said, without knowing what the decks are or how they operate, it is hard to say what would really work.

[bowvamp]

Since it's home-brew + goblins, I have come up with a radical new idea. Run this:

4 Flamebreak
4 Pyroclasm
4 Rough/Tumble
4 Lava Spike
4 Fireblast
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Magma Jet
22 Mountain

Play around with this, it is great against the random hombebrew (normally revolves around creatures) and goblins. Rough/Tumble is a pyroclasm for decks that are bad against pyroclasm, and an answer to any of the angels/dragons/other flying guys you may see.

[bowvamp]

Hmm, well if you insist (I doubt they'd be dead for long in his meta)
-4 Rough/Tumble
+4 Cave-In

[Jason]

I played in a 29-person GP Trial tournament on Saturday in Madison, WI and decided to go with the most non-interactive deck I could with my card pool - Burn.

I have had this deck built for quite some time and haven't had a chance to play it any tournaments and I did zero play testing before the tournament, so I'm certain I did not perform as well as I could have.

Here is the deck I played:

17 Snow-Covered Mountain
3 Barbarian Ring
3 Browbeat
4 Chain Lightning
4 Fireblast
2 Flame Rift
3 Flamebreak
2 Incinerate
4 Magma Jet
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Fireblast
4 Rift Bolt
2 Smash to Smithereens

Sideboard
3 Mogg Fanatic
4 Pyrostatic Pillar
3 Sirocco
2 Smash to Smithereens
3 Sulfuric Vortex

Round 1 - Affinity
Game 1, I lost the die roll so my opponent played first. He led out with Disciple of the Vault and Ornithopter. I shot him 3 to the face on my turn 1. His turn 2 went City of Brass Disciple and Worker and poke for 1. My turn 2, I double bolted him. So he was at 10 and I was at 19. He attacked and casts Atog and plays Frogmite. I didn't kill him my next turn as I and he goes nuts with Atog and Fling. I should have won game 1, but I miscounted damage and went for Browbeat instead of just winning, so we went to game 2.

I brought in 2 Smash to Smithereens and took out 2 Browbeat. This game was very similar to the first - a race. Only this time he didn't get out Atog or Ravager and a turn 3 Flamebreak wrecked his day. Unfortunately the Flamebreak didn't kill the Ornithopter which the next turn, my opponent top-decked Cranial Plating and swung in for something like 8. I ended up throwing a Magma Jet at the Ornithopter the next turn and burned him out by turn 6.

Game 3 was exactly the same, except he had no Ornithopter this time. Turn 3 Flamebreak and turn 4 Fireblast for the win.

1-0-0

Round 2 - RG Vial Goblins
Game 1, he led with Goblin Lackey. I burned him for 3. Turn 2, he brought in Warchief through Lackey. He played a Piledriver and passed turn. I passed my turn 2, saving a Magma Jet for the Piledriver (I wasn't expecting to throw burn at creatures so much!). Next turn I burned him for near-lethal and found a Fireblast for the win by turn 6.

Game 2, he led out with a Goblin Lackey. I burned him for 3. He attacked with Lackey and brought in Kiki-Jiki (?). My turn 2, I passed turn. He played Pyrostatic Pillar and I responded with double Lightning Bolt to his face. He attacked and brought in Siege Gang with Lackey. My turn 3, I played Flamebreak (shot myself for 5...blasted Pillar) and wiped his board. He played another Pyrostatic Pillar and I couldn't find anything except Flame Rift for the next two turns, so I just waited until Fireblast came along for the win.

2-0-0

Round 3 - TES/ANT (I can't tell the difference)
Game 1, he won the roll. He plays land and says go. I play Lava Spike. He untaps, plays a land and wins through LED/Infernal Tutor/IGG.

Game 2, I board in 4 Pyrostatic Pillar and take out 3 Browbeat and a Smash to Smithereens (I believe). I mulligan to six and end up keeping a hand of:
2 Mountain
1 Chain Lightning
1 Fireblast
1 Pyrostatic Pillar
1 Magma Jet
Turn 1, I play Chain Lightning for 3. He draws, plays a land, double rituals Ad Nauseum and wins that turn. Super.

2-1-0

Round 4 - Aggro Loam
Game 1, let's just say Price of Progress wins games.

Game 2, I stupidly sideboard out the 2 Smash to Smithereens for 2 Sulfuric Vortex. He plays Zuran Orb and has the Loam engine going. I can't win and he burns me out with Seismic Assault.

Game 3, I bring back in 4 Smash to Smithereens and take out the 2 Sulfuric Vortex, 1 Browbeat and 1 Flamebreak. I lead out with 3 to the face. He cycles. My turn two, I pass turn. His turn 2, he plays Chalice at 1 and I end-of-turn Smash it. My turn 3, I again pass the turn. He plays a land, cycles and plays Life from the Loam. I end-of-turn play Price of Progress for 6. My turn, play Price of Progress for 6, Lightning Bolt for 3 and Fireblast for 4. He showed me he was trying to slow-roll a Zuran Orb and I say "Thank you for that".

3-1-0

Round 5 - RU CounterBalance-Top featuring Progenitus via Show and Tell
We drew into the top 8, but played it out for fun. Counterbalance + Top equals bad news for Burn (but I knew that going in). Game 1, he had Counterbalance and no top and I burned him out; he actually attempted to counter a Flame Rift with Progenitus on one of the blind Counterbalance. Game 2, he had CBT going and I was going to drop Sulfuric Vortex on turn 3, but he dropped Show and Tell into Progenitus on his turn 3 instead. Game 3, he had Counterbalance and no top, but with Brainstorm and Telling Time (what?!) he was able to stop me and Progenitus ended up smashing face for the win. I did indeed join the Facebook group for people who have been killed by Progenitus.

3-1-1

Top 8
RG Vial Goblins (not the same person)
Game 1, he had the nuts. Turn 1, Vial. Turn 2 double Lackey. Turn 3, Vial in Piledriver and play Warchief. His Lackey hit Ringleader and another Piledriver. I couldn't hit the third mana for Flamebreak so his creatures turned sideways at my face for the win.

Game 2, I boarded in 2 Mogg Fanatic and 1 Smash to Smithereens and took out 3 Browbeat. Turn 3 Flamebreak and turn 4 double Fireblast took him down.

Game 3, he led out with turn 1 Vial. I played Chain Lightning. His turn, he played a Piledriver. My turn, I passed turn. He put Lackey into play with Vial. His turn 3, he played Port swung for 4 and put Ringleader into play with Lackey and found Matron. He passed the turn to which I cast Magma Jet. My turn 3, he Ported me which I responded with Lightning Bolt from the land getting tapped. I should have played Mogg Fanatic that turn, but I instead stupidly played Flame Rift, putting him at 7 (he fetched once). I had a Fireblast in hand yet too. He put nothing into play with Vial. His turn 4, he put a counter on Vial, played Matron, found Warchief, put it in play and played another Lackey and swung for the fences. I cast Fireblast on Piledriver as a last-ditch effort but he ended up winning the next turn anyway. I believe I could have taken him to a draw if I would have played the Fanatic, but I didn't. After the match, he did tell me he actually tested against Burn (to which I was thoroughly shocked...who tests against Burn? Honestly)

If I would have won, I believe I would have ended up playing Goblins the next round in the top 8 (piloted by a significantly worse player than this one) and possibly 42 Land in the finals, so I am sort of upset I didn't win, as 42 Land seems like a bye for Burn. I didn't stay after I lost, so I'm not 100% sure that is correct. The top 8 consisted of myself with Burn, 2x Goblins decks, 42 Land, TES/ANT (the same one I lost to in the Swiss), CBT Progenitus, and two decks I'm unsure of.

What I learned: Browbeat is less than optimal in these types of tournaments. I would have been better suited to cut them and add 2x Shard Volley and 1x Flamebreak. I was never really short land, where Shard Volley was going to cripple me. And that 3 damage could have really helped. Plus, for the aggressive matches, I really did need the board sweeper. I didn't run Volcanic Fallout mostly because I didn't have any, but if I did, I don't know if I would have played it anyway - the 3 damage was significant in at least one game as it pulled the opponent down closer to lethal. It was a good time, and I figured I'd let people know Burn is still a viable deck to be scared of.

[bowvamp]

first off, I'm seeing a sudden resurgence of browbeat. Come on guys, it's a 3 mana spell. That means in order to be worth it's salt it gotsa do 9 damage. That or have a boardsweeping effect.

Next, I have been pleasantly surprised by how good fulminator mage is in this deck. He is my lategame clock that has a good sac effect. Some use fanatic, I use fulminator. He is used in the same slot as blood moon was. Anyone else have any testing done recently?

Also to the above poster my recommended changes to your list:
as you said cut the browbeat.
+1 mountain. (it'll make you more consistent)
+2 take a tangent cards. (you need to venture into unknown territory, I know this from experience)
-2 Incinerate (there is better, but even that's not good)
+2 more tangent cards.
-2 StS (better in the board)
+2 take a tangents(they're good for ju!)

[Pltnmngl]

Tell me someone tried this at Chicago. Please?

[Pltnmngl]

What do you guys think about this?

3 Sulfuric Vortex
2 Pyrostatic Pillar

4 Rift Bolt
4 Lava Spike
4 Flame Rift
4 Flamebreak

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Fireblast
4 Chain Lightning
4 Incinerate
4 Magma Jet

19 Mountain

4 Price of Progress
3 Pithing Needle
2 Smash to Smithereens
2 Shattering Spree
2 Pyrostatic Pillar
2 Cursed Scroll

My goal was to maximize resource advantage (both life, permanent and virtual card advantage) while minimizing player interaction and keeping on a slight budget.

[Tacosnape]

For reference, I've been tinkering around with the white splash. Helix is always nice in races. Ethersworn Canonist helps against combo, and Jotun Grunt is fantastic against Goyf, Survival, or anything that just boarded out all its creature removal.

4 Wooded Foothills
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Plateau
4 Mountain
2 Chrome Mox

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt

4 Lightning Helix
4 Incinerate
4 Price of Progress
4 Magma Jet
3 Flame Rift

4 Fireblast
3 Flamebreak

SB:
4 Ethersworn Canonist
4 Jotun Grunt
4 Vexing Shusher
3 Smash to Smithereens

[NecroYawgmoth]

White-Splash is a nice idea, but I dislike the Chrome Moxes

...what about Oblivion Ring instead of Incinerate...

...it helps in the Damagerace as it removes Goyfs or such big Threats (it also removes CoP:Red)

YawG

[Paradigm Shift]

If you go white splash for targeted removal, try Path to Exile. It's the perfect StP for Burn.

On that note, don't go white for removal.

[bigbear102]

For reference, I've been tinkering around with the white splash. Helix is always nice in races. Ethersworn Canonist helps against combo, and Jotun Grunt is fantastic against Goyf, Survival, or anything that just boarded out all its creature removal.

4 Wooded Foothills
4 Bloodstained Mire
4 Plateau
4 Mountain
2 Chrome Mox

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt

4 Lightning Helix
4 Incinerate
4 Price of Progress
4 Magma Jet
3 Flame Rift

4 Fireblast
3 Flamebreak

SB:
4 Ethersworn Canonist
4 Jotun Grunt
4 Vexing Shusher
3 Smash to Smithereens

Taking a deck that has no real CA and adding Chrome Mox probably isn't a great idea. Post board it gets better, but I don't think it's worth it. Lotus Petal would almost be better in that slot, as after your 2nd land you don't really want to see any more. That is also why I have gone from Flamebreak to Pyroclasm. There are a lot fewer Mongeese running around and more Faeries/Elves.

I also like the white splash in this deck, it gives you a much better SB against the tough matches. Jotun Grunt is also playable MD, but that takes away the surprise factor.

[Garban]

Hi all! ^^

White splash? I think that´s a bad idea. It is nice to play with a solid mana base and in any case, i would prefer green splash for Krosan grip. And i would also prefer to play RG sligh in that case, because if you get a worse mana base, i think it´s better to run creatures. So I think this deck is and must continue being monored.


Path to Exile, Jotun grunt? You should win before Tarmo scares you. Relic is great against decks that run Tarmo like Canadian or Team America and you can “recover” that card. In my opinion, cards that don´t make damage like pyroclasm or path to exile… are really bad in this deck. I think you should run volcanic fallout instead. On the other hand I find my opponents usually don´t take out STP in g2, g3 so it´s not easy to surprise with any creature

About Ethersworn Canonist… countetop is very problematic but it should also prevent us for many combo decks. But if i waited for many countertop and combo decks… i wouldn´t play burn… xD Any case, you can run Pyrostatic Pillar


I would like to know about the deck´s history. Surely you would find it strange there, but, is there any relation with the deck builder Seth Burn and the name of this deck? This deck bornes with the introduction of legacy, right? Any reference old list?

[rufus]

I would like to know about the deck´s history. Surely you would find it strange there, but, is there any relation with the deck builder Seth Burn and the name of this deck? This deck bornes with the introduction of legacy, right? Any reference old list?

The original burn deck is something like:
20xMountain
40xLightning Bolt
(Traditionally this is referred to as the lightning bolt deck.)
It effectively predates organized competitive constructed play.

Although it's actually weak compared to other decks possible with the card pool of that era, it was a popular example of the sort of deck that necessitated the 'four card rule' because it is much easier to assemble than 25 Lotus, 25 Timetwister, 10 Lightning Bolt.

I recall taking 2nd in a (relatively small) Type 1.5 tournament with a bauble burn deck after defeating a Necropotence deck and a Turbo-Stasis (Howling Mine & Arcane Denial) deck in the late 90's.

Notably, burn has always been a second tier deck.