[Deck] Solitaire (Enchantress)

[honz]

I'm not a big fan of energy field. pre-board it is a decent card, since you can keep it in play w/o wheel. Despite that, most decks have some number of EE/deed, thoughtsieze, waste, sinkhole, grindstone in the maindeck. Postboard, it just becomes worse. The wheel combo is cute, but it just makes replenish useless. Wheel is also pretty bad against most decks not running ichorid. I would run worship or 3rd-4th solitary confinement over energy field. Also, i would never run less than 4 elephant grass.

Words of Wind is just wasted space in my mind. It is almost never going to be relevant unless you activate it 3-4 times a turn. If you can do that, you should already be winning. Words can be very useful with just one activation, destroying mage/confidant/piledriver/a million other things.

[waSP]

I really can't figure out whether you all are serious with the arguments you're bringing out against Words of Wind. Maybe you're playing in metagames where you don't have to play against Counterbalance every third round? Because that has been my tournament experience for the past 6 months.

What are the matchups you're trying to win with the GWr (GWu?) builds? What matchups are weaker than they should be? What matchups are weaker than they could be? What is the role of a card like Sterling Grove game 1 when there is little Enchantment hate (and what little there is is untargeted)?

My answer to these questions is as follows:
I'm trying to beat decks with Counterbalance and random decks and aggro decks.
I'm weaker than I should be against decks like Gro and Merfolk.
I'm weaker than I could be against very fast aggro decks with enchantment removal.
Sterling Grove is an expensive Enlightened Tutor that decreases the power of my deck game 1, but lets me get by with sloppier play.


What questions are you asking yourself when building this deck?


(a note since you guys don't run Wheels main--there is no negative synergy with Replenish, you don't cast the early Wheel unless it's going to get countered and good control players will counter it unless they have a very solid answer to it)

[GreenOne]

What are the matchups you're trying to win with the GWr (GWu?) builds?

Every non-combo matchup. I want Control and Aggrocontrol matches to be quite good/positive, and aggro matches to be bye.

What matchups are weaker than they should be?

Some control decks like ITF and sometimes the decks that are packing Trygon Predator MD.

What matchups are weaker than they could be?

Straight burn and sometimes GoyfSligh.

What is the role of a card like Sterling Grove game 1 when there is little Enchantment hate (and what little there is is untargeted)?

Targeted enchantment hate exhist, even if not in mass. Think of Trygon Predator, Vindicate, Krosan Grip, Wipe Away, Rushing River for example.
Other than that, it's an enchantment and can tutor for almost every card in the deck but Replenish, lands and Argothian. This actually gives the deck versatility, being able to tutor off Moat or Confinament when is needed, and O.Ring when you need removal and Enchantress when your engine got hindered.
This actually makes him a better candidate than Eladamri Call due to synergy with the deck, protection MD, and overall better as a tutor (Call is basically Argothian #5-6 where Grove is like 4 copies more of every enchantment).

[AcidFiend]

I guess I'll get more insight into facing a CB Meta this weekend at a local tournament; word around the campfire is there'll be lots of CounterTop net deckers.

What should I side in (and out)? I'm thinking O-Rings could take out CB (CC=3 harder to counter for them). Bring in 3rd Replenish.

Has anyone tried Multani's Presence? You still draw a card as you play an Enchantment from Enchantress effects, and if they counter you draw another. Could be an option.

[GreenOne]

Why waste slots on Multani's Presence when you can just play Choke against every blue deck, and it's a beating even when they have no CB out?

I'd strongly suggest the 3rd Replenish in the maindeck: is just a bomb against CB, counterspells, discard and Deed/EE, so almost everything in the format that's not a bye (aggro) or a matchloss (combo).

[AcidFiend]

Yeah, problem is I can't get my hands on a 3rd Replenish yet, for main or sideboard ><

True Choke is awesome. But is siding in 2 chokes enough?

[Gibbie_X]

2 Chokes and 3 Replenishes is more than enough for CounterTop. The will waste any and all main Counters for your engine. With the Enegry Field or Confinement, Predator is null void. Elephant Grass is going to be the one to push to get down fast. You will get a card drawing ability down fast, and be able to race them with card advantage. We really have the advantage over CounterTop, I think.

[GreenOne]

This is my deck:
// Lands
4 [ON] Windswept Heath
1 [B] Savannah
2 [US] Serra's Sanctum
3 [MM] Plains (1)
10 [ON] Forest (1)
1 [U] Taiga

// Creatures
4 [US] Argothian Enchantress

// Spells
4 [VI] Elephant Grass
4 [DIS] Utopia Sprawl
4 [IN] Sterling Grove
4 [ON] Enchantress's Presence
2 [LRW] Oblivion Ring
2 [JU] Solitary Confinement
1 [LG] Moat
3 [UD] Replenish
3 [IA] Wild Growth
1 [OD] Karmic Justice
2 [OD] Ground Seal
1 [SHM] Runed Halo
2 [US] Exploration
1 [CFX] Sigil of the Empty Throne
1 [ON] Words of War

// Sideboard
SB: 1 [LRW] Oblivion Ring
SB: 2 [OD] Karmic Justice
SB: 2 [SHM] Runed Halo
SB: 2 [WL] Aura of Silence
SB: 1 [7E] Sacred Ground
SB: 1 [DIS] Dovescape
SB: 1 [4E] Circle of Protection: Red
SB: 3 [TE] Choke
SB: 1 [SHM] Wheel of Sun and Moon
SB: 1 [8E] Blood Moon

And my SB strategy against UGx Counterbalance thresh is usually
-2 Exploration -2 Ground Seal -1 Confinament (-2/3 Elepant Grass if I expect Predator or they play only <9 creatures)
+3 Choke +1 Karmic Justice +1 Blood Moon (+1 O.Ring +1 Karmic +0/1 Halo)

Making the deck post SB:

Must Counters: 17
4 [US] Argothian Enchantress
4 [ON] Enchantress's Presence
1 [LG] Moat
3 [UD] Replenish
1 [CFX] Sigil of the Empty Throne
3 [TE] Choke
1 [8E] Blood Moon
Likely to get countered (removal+utility): 7
2/3 [LRW] Oblivion Ring
2/3 [OD] Karmic Justice
1/2 [SHM] Runed Halo

Reasoning is simple: you don't need explorations and Confinament when you'll likely get your engine countered, and elephant grass doesn't slow them down much unless there's a Choke on the board, they'll just pay 2 and attack wit goyf alone putting us in a 4-5 turns clock anyway. You're basically siding out a lot of 1 and 2cc enchantments for 3 cc ones, making their CB even more laughable.
Having about 20 must counters (and 4 tutors) is usually too much for them to handle.

[Black Mass]

Is'nt anyone playing Gaea's Touch anymore? I like the Idea of a free spell that can really boost your tempo. You get to draw cards (if there's an enchantress), you get to play an extra forest and you can sac it to play more enchantments.
I put it on the same pedestal as exploration.

[4eak]

@ Black Mass

Is'nt anyone playing Gaea's Touch anymore?

I never devote more than 2 slots to Exploration, but if I did want more of that sort of effect, why would I play Gaea's Touch instead of Exploration for slot 3?

Sure, it sacs, but other than that it is strictly worse than Exploration.

• The casting cost sucks, and it isn't turn 1 playable, which is part of the reason we like exploration.
• It's limited to dropping basic forest, which is awful in a deck that is usually drawing into a landbase that is at least 35% non-basic.
• Exploration allows us to mid-combo drop Serra's Sanctum and explode, this card does not.
• The "free-ness" of the spell is cool, but unnecessary. I'd much have have the consistency, versatility and cheapness of Exploration.

In the end, I'd rather play another Wild Growth or Serra's Sanctum if I was interested in strengthening the mana-base.




peace,
4eak

[Jaiminho]

The casting cost sucks, and it isn't turn 1 playable, which is part of the reason we like exploration.

Turn 1 Exploration is only useful when you get to have a 3rd land on turn 2. With 6-8 auras + 0-3 ESG + 0-3 Moxen (playing 6 auras + 3 Moxen here), you should have that area covered up. The GG casting cost is the only drawback it has, not for being 2cc, but for costing GG. In a white heavy deck (as in trying to drop early Runed Halo consistently), this could be an issue, but isn't otherwise.

It's limited to dropping basic forest, which is awful in a deck that is usually drawing into a landbase that is at least 35% non-basic.

Playing lands other than basic forests first is a good way to avoid this. If you are actually aiming at netting tempo at your early turns (0 or 1 enchantress effects on the board), you are not using this card properly (neither Touch or Exploration are good at that). It's usefulness is for increasing your speed when already having an engine online, so you get to win faster, thus giving your opponent less time to find answers or draw due to time.

Exploration allows us to mid-combo drop Serra's Sanctum and explode, this card does not.

Why not? You shouldn't ever drop a land as your first action for the main phase. Do what you have to do with your current resources, get enough cards from your library, drop Serra's Sanctum and then drop a basic forest. It's simple as that.

The "free-ness" of the spell is cool, but unnecessary. I'd much have have the consistency, versatility and cheapness of Exploration.

The fact that it's free is not only cool, but extremely useful. It's free card draw with a bonus of an extra forest if you explode it on the same turn, but it's also a huge GG bonus when you have Sanctum and need to drop more enchantments than the number of forests on your board will allow you to, which happens quite often, specially when you are using all that white mana to power up damage through Words of War.

In the end, I'd rather play another Wild Growth or Serra's Sanctum if I was interested in strengthening the mana-base.

Gaea's Touch doesn't strengthen the mana base. It serves the same purpose as Exploration in boosting your game mid-combo.

[4eak]

@ Jaiminho

Playing lands other than basic forests first is a good way to avoid this.

This just isn't always possible. There will be plenty of times where you'll only have non-basics in hand (even after a required land drop to continue in the combo). Exploration is head and shoulders better in this respect, even when you are playing correctly.

If you are actually aiming at netting tempo at your early turns (0 or 1 enchantress effects on the board), you are not using this card properly (neither Touch or Exploration are good at that).

I've found exploration useful from turn 1 all the way to last turn of the game. It is a versatile card, and I've used it plenty of times on turn 1. It is certainly strongest in mid-combo to the last couple turns; most enchantments in the deck will be.

Do what you have to do with your current resources, get enough cards from your library, drop Serra's Sanctum and then drop a basic forest. It's simple as that.

No, it isn't that simple. There are still many circumstances where Exploration will be able to drop land where Gaea's Touch doesn't.

The fact that it's free is not only cool, but extremely useful. It's free card draw with a bonus of an extra forest if you explode it on the same turn, but it's also a huge GG bonus when you have Sanctum and need to drop more enchantments than the number of forests on your board will allow you to, which happens quite often, specially when you are using all that white mana to power up damage through Words of War

Best case scenario on the same turn: you gain from the forest you layed. The card can sometimes beg you to wait another turn where Exploration doesn't. Given the non-basics in the deck, I'd much rather have the guaranteed ability to drop a land this turn, often adding non-basic ///Sanctum where Gaea's could not. The cost and conditional land play of Gaea's is not worth the benefit of being able to sac.

Gaea's Touch doesn't strengthen the mana base. It serves the same purpose as Exploration in boosting your game mid-combo.

Exploration's purpose is "boosting your [mana base] mid-combo". If these cards aren't about strengthening your mana base, then why not just run any old enchantment? This has everything to do with improving the mana base.

It is honestly hard to beat the single cost of Exploration given the effect. I almost always prefer to be topdecking or combing into Exploration instead of Gaea's Touch.





peace,
4eak

[waSP]

GreenOne:
If I were you, this what I would do with that sideboard playing against CB:
-4 Elephant Grass
-2 Exploration
-2/3 Wild Growth
-1 Words of War (unless you think they're playing Meddling Mage)

+3 Choke
+1 Blood Moon
+2 Karmic Justice
+1 Oblivion Ring
+1 Aura of Silence
+0/1 Wheel of Sun and Moon (if they're playing black to protect Replenish)
+1 Dovescape

Your early plays should be to draw out counter so you can resolve the engine.

And I would probably bring the Wheel in regardless (do any CB decks run Extirpate?), but I have a very different playstyle than you guys. My intuition in the control matchup is a lot different. The CB player's biggest (and really only) threat to you is Counterbalance. If you can keep it off the board, you'll win the matchup most of the time. You're goal is to be aggro for the first 3 turns and the control from there on out.

[GreenOne]

Why should I bring in Wheel? I really don't get it.
Aura of silence is obvously not needed when the only enchantments they got is CB, which is chaff against us especially post SB.

Wild Growth on the other hand are a must. Your deck post sb curves @3 and you really want to have all the mana sources to start dropping your threats and to not stop at 2 or 3 mana.

I really don't get the sb strategy you're suggesting. Please explain more.

[waSP]

Aura of Silence is good against Top as well. But the only way they're going to win is if they can get a creature into play and counter enough 'important' spells (so, O. Rings, Confinements, Moat, Runed Halo and Replenish .. and maybe WoW/Sigil). Their goal is to deal you 20 damage and ignore everything else. In most matchups, they are trying to control the board.

The only way they're going to be able to counter all of those spells is with Counterbalance revealing Trygon/Sower. So you'll need ways to deal with CB so that you can control the board.

There are many, many times when Choke is not a must-counter. Ditto Blood Moon. You only bring those in if you believe your opponent will counter them. Otherwise you're better off with Elephant Grass.

[Dr.AgOn]

If I were you, this what I would do with that sideboard playing against CB:
-4 Elephant Grass
-2 Exploration
-2/3 Wild Growth
-1 Words of War (unless you think they're playing Meddling Mage)

+3 Choke
+1 Blood Moon
+2 Karmic Justice
+1 Oblivion Ring
+1 Aura of Silence
+0/1 Wheel of Sun and Moon (if they're playing black to protect Replenish)
+1 Dovescape

WTF??? learn 2 play, dude.

Words of War is not there to handle creatures! It's our win condition.
Boarding this way, your only win cons would be dovescape and sigil. what do you do against EE & Ruins? (unless you play ground seals)
AoS sucks in this MU. Do u really intend on boarding Wheel to protect Replenish targets from Extirpate?? *confused* Read the card.
Blood Moon sucks, cause most Thresh and Dreadstill builds play basics, it's decent against Landstill and Baseruption but Choke is waaayyyy better here. Blood Moon and Choke don't interact well, it hinders you too and red is harder to find anyways.
I wouldn't play Dovescape either, but that's just me.^^ How about boarding in the third Replenish instead?
And I really have to agree with GreenOne about the Wild Growths, if you're playing some. The help you get to three mana by turn 2 which is a major priority! I really recommend checking your mana base postboard! Oblivion Ring for example, is quite unnecessary, because you can win even with a Counterbalance and Top in play, you can build up your board and gain control of the game even with a trygon predator attacking each turn and you can draw cards if your spells are countered, so where's the big deal? Or is it just me? xD
Try playing more proactive. You don't always need a solution for a problem. By taking preventive actions a problem doesn't develop at all.

I'd like to thank AcidFiend for your comments. I agree 100%
Nice decklist GreenOne. It really looks solid, except for a few cards in the board, but that depends on play style and meta then again^^

Regarding the Touch / Exploration matter: In the first turns you can play anything with Touch as fast as with Exploration. They're really equal, but Touch never lasted more than one turn on my board in mid-game, so exploration is better with sanctum in the early game. With Touch I often didn't have a forest to drop with only 45% of lands being forests and 2 mana are hard to cast when comboing, cause more and more lands get tapped and by the time you draw into touch, you mostly just have 1 mana left. Exploration would help here xD

c ya and keep writing,
Dr.AgOn

[waSP]

@ Dr.Agon:
I was talking about GreenOne's sideboard and strategies against UGx decks.

Firstly, I wasn't even trying to troll you. Anyway, Wheel of Sun and Moon protects Replenish (your ability to cast the second and third Replenishes) from Extirpate (it is the last enchantment you would play before casting Replenish).

Secondly, you don't need a lot of win conditions in this matchup. Once you get to a point where Words of War would win you the game, it's not that important that Words of War wins you the game. Sigil/Dovescape will do WoW's job just as well, while giving you a shot at stealing a game you shouldn't probably win.

And thirdly, I agree with the minor consensus about Exploration. You should only run Gaea's Touch if you're running a combo-ish version.

[Dr.AgOn]

no, exploration combos better, cause of the mana costs but whatever.

and Thresh/Landstill is an equal MU. you can easily win it.

[HdH_Cthulhu]

Wow the Wheel of Sun and Moon SB plan is the most situational thing i ever heard of.

It requires such an obscure gamestate, i mean come on:
you cast lots of enchantmens, they all get destroyd/or countered, then you drop Wheel of Sun and Moon and now this card makes only sense if they could counter your replenish (otherwise you just win) and they have an extirpate in hand (and didnt played it in response to your replenish)and you have a second replenish ready.
If this gamestate doesnt occure it just hinders your own replenish!!!

[waSP]

It's counterintuitive, but I've played against a lot (A LOT) of very, very good control players. Playing the Wheel is right. The control players agree. You're free to disagree with me.

@Dr.Agon, UGx matchups should be around 70-80% (which has been my result, excepting Gro).