quick update. 3 tournaments down with the new list. 2 five rounders and a four rounder and i'm at 13-1 losing to four color thresh with 2 mulli's to five in a row in the last round of one of the five rounders. FML that matchup is soo winnable.
Could you give us a not-quick update? I love tournament reports more than anything, except maybe elspeth. I love her a lot.Originally Posted by mossivo1986
I feel your pain joel. I went 1-1-1 against 3 rounds of 4c thresh at 5k boston and wanted someone to just kill me. It's a match up we normally don't lose to but sometimes shit happens.
Co-Founder of Team Awesome - I heard Randy Buehler say a while back that good players give themselves the most number of turns to find the answer.
The Source on MTGO - Predator8785 and RockOut
I went into this metagame this weekend:
Participants
Jeff - Team America
Chris - UWb Wishstill
Teddy - Deadguy
Dan - Pox
Drew - Imperial Painter
Silas - GB LD
Brian - NLS
David - RGb Aggro Loam
Joey - RGb Zoo
Lil' Chris - Belcher
Kim - Geddon Stax
Tray - Homebrew screw-the-aggro-decks-and-destroy-ANT.dec
So there were Team America, Deadguy, Pox, Painter, GB Land-D, Aggro Loam, Stax as Land-D decks, that's 7/12 decks with LD as a strategy. I obviously SBed wrong that day thinking it wasn't going to be LD heavy since the Stax player was new to our place, and I thought Jeff was going to play Elf Survival, and Dan something like Coatl Gro or Zoo. I should have boarded 2 Teferi's Response, and Maindecked 2 more for such a meta.
I ultimately went: 1-2, 2-0, 1-2 against Team America, GB LD, Pox. A play mistake during my 3rd game against Team America was pathing Goyf when I knew he had Tombstalker and FOW in hand. I had 2 FOWs in hand and we knew each other's hand via opposing Extirpates. I was afraid to drop to 4 life, but realized my mistake IMMEDIATELY (albeit too late to take back the move). Had I taken the 4 damage from Goyf dropping to 4, I could have saved FOW against Tombstalker with another FOW protection from his FOW, while Pathing the Goyf later and recovering with Wish-> Pulse. So in light of my mistake last minute, I just prayed he didn't draw a blue card to pitch to FOW, allowing me to stabilize and possibly win, but Legacy punished me for making a play mistake, which I'm glad I lost the game since now I learn.
Here's advice to those who want to pick up Landstill. Your life is your gambling table. Don't be afraid to drop it but be afraid if you don't weigh out your FUTURE options. Landstill is a complicated deck that plans forward, so don't be intimidated by the current position, since you have the card quality and tutoring capabilities of grabbing answers for the future.
I was just unfortunate to play against so many LD decks this weekend. It's survivable, but it's not favorable MU. Top helped my matches all day, but it wasn't easy recovering against opposing Crucible + Waste. There was a point where I could almost Wish->Extirpate Wastelands but couldn't pull it off because of the pressure my manabase was against, and he always kept Wastelands in play after nuking my lands.
Also, Eternal Dragon has been good to me as the 24th landslot. And I made the mistake to play 2 Islands, 1 Plains as my basics. Should have played 1 Island, 2 Plains for the Dragon and all the WW requirements of the deck. It was a last minute change.
Not so quick update:
tournament 1.
R1: Me vs: Merfolk:
G1: Removal is a wonderfull tool. Unfortunately I don't have it. He runs me over quickly. Not such a good start
Side in: +3 P2E, +3 EE.
G2: 17 removal post sideboard does it's job. Send pleanty of folk Farming and Exiling, finishing them off with double EP. Thank god for sideboards.
G3: He takes a slow slow slow hand; while I keep a fast aggressive removal heavy draw. eot t3 vendillion to draw the daze or see what he's up to. It lands I remove a stifle. t4 Land elspeth and begin the landstill hazing with 6/4 flying death machine. EP and a path seal the game.
2:1
R2: Me vs: Burn
g1: I win the toss, cunning wish eot for pulse= GG
g2: Rinse repeat with FOW on Blast. = GG with pulse.
R3: Arm Stax:
g1: He runs me over with teh arm nuts.
+3 negate
+1 COW
g2: He lands dustbowl along with lots of lands, and trinisphere. I play around it countering ever little stupid thing he plays that relivent ala crucible and ala stax and geddon. I eventually get jace online and he resolves a geddon. Jace does what jace does and I keep making land drops and stopping crucible. Finally I get online and land an elspeth for which he is upset four turns later when I kick the final and play my other one. Also landed disk and was really disgusting to kill all of his board position.
g3: He plays challice, trinisphere, crucible. I eot clique nabbing geddon (whew) followed by elspeth. He conceits soon after.
(Vendillion clique is pretty sick I hear, don't take my word for it though.)
R4: Me vs: UWb Fetchland tendrills
g1: Multiple forces off the top plus a counterspell and a wish for negate beats this scrub.
+3 negate
+1 Pate
g2: Him, eot Tutor for Nauseam, me pate tutor= he runs out of gas and I get to build up my counter suit.
(Very weak pilot)
R5: Me versus Merfolk:
g1: I go for the inevitability game swapping removal for creatures and decrees as removal spells. Eventually 20 cards down I get elspeth and it lands. I then switch over to overprotective mode for elspeth against two mutavaults. I drop disk a turn before elspeth goes off and he swings head first into two soldiers and a path. I hear indestructable disk is pretty sick.
g2: Virtually the same as r2 g2 as I just overrun him with removal. This time Annual is not enough of a tempo play to stop me. Sorry blue krosan grip: you loose.
Thank you mana drain.
Tourney #2
r1: Me vs: Dragon Stompy:
g1: I draw disk in the opener with 3 lands. I draw fourth land in time. Quick note: Disk> Dragon Stompy.
+3 Negate
g2: Virtually the exact same thing.
R2: Me Versus 3c aggro Loam:
g1: I kill creatures, I play humiliy, I wish for relc, I wish for pate, I win game.
+1 cruc
+1 relic
+3 path
G2: More removal and an additional relic + a way to randomly fight wastelock. didnt see crucible but basicly I stop him land an elspeth followed by a decree for 2 and win from there. DD or B Wish was never drawn from him.
R3: Can't remember right now
R4: Same thing < I think it could have been a bye. I was drinking pretty hard by this point.
R5: Me versus 4c thresh.
g1: Mull - 5. Procede to be run over by bob
+3 path
+3 EP
+1 Relic
g2: Mull - 5. Procede to get run over by goyf + Goose. Disheartening.
Other tourney was a local one. I four-0'd it. I beat 4c aggro loam, u/g/r thresh, recursion, and had a bye. Shitty prizes.
GG
Team America should be a bye for us. We run more removal than they do run creatures, and we can actually counter some of their creatures. Just fetch for a basic plains (personally, I run 3 islands, 2 plains, they can't do much against basics, just snare the sinkhole) and sit on your sword/paths until they lose gas. Its easy. So far I'm 6-0 against Team America decks. I don't see the point of boarding extirpate there. You're most likely going to "exile" their creatures and unless you get early wasteland+pate, they wouldn't have anything worthy in graveyard except for the FoW.
Eva green and Pox are much tougher, since they run a fair amount of discard to supplement LD strategy and sometimes Crucible (must counter). We don't like discard. Yet its still winnable with a chain of standstills.
I believe we actually have hard times against TA if they donīt screw around. Their LD package is strong and so are theyīre beaters which are often covered by TS.
Well,
I went to two tournaments this weekend going 0-1 drop because of the worst metagame for LS ever (was like 1 quinn, 1 dredge,1 CAL,1loam,1burn etc.)
The next day we went to a biggger tournament but I failed again :/
Hereīs a short summary of what happens if fortune decides to kick your ass:
Round 1 Elves Dice: ME!!
G1: He beats me down to 1, I recur EE like 10 times and finally go for 2 Angels via DoJ to finish him off.
+3EP 1+E.Tutor +3 Path +2 Perish
G2: Opening 7: 3 Lands, 2 Perish 1 Plage 1 Path. I Win.
Round 2 Tempo Thresh /b Dice: not me.
G1: I go down to 6 cards and keep the following:
1 Island, 1 SDT,1 BS, 2 Wish 1 Snare
Iīm pretty sure it was right to keep because top means usually gg and five cards always suck with this deck.
Long story short: I fail at finding more lands and loose to one Goyf.
+2 Perish +3 PtE
G2: I get a normal draw with two removals and crush him.
G3: 0/7 Swords+screw->One Goyf is enough again.
Round 3 ANT Dice: not me
I loose game 1, get a bunch of counters and my 1-off Pate->victory in game 2+3. Had zero SB cards for this MU.
Round 4 Ugw Faerie Sur Dice:not me
This round was so hilarious. I just got the best draw since ever. I counter nearly everything and still have xX removals left. He never had a real chance.
Round 5 Goyfsligh Dice: not me
G1: He screws at one Taiga but is still able to land 4 Nacatls. I eventually kill some of them, chump the last via Elspeth Tokens and wish for Pulse.
+3 PtE +1 BEB +2 Ajani +1 Perish
G2: I Keep: 2 Island, 1 PLains, 1 Tundra, 2 BS 1 Top<- Should Iīve mulled?
I fail to draw any spells and die with 4 lands in play and 3 in hand.
G3: First hand is nearly the same as in g2 so I try to mull this time.
I get two Ajanis and Pulse, but with Island Dust Bowl Tundra I canīt cast more than 1 brainstorm before dying.
Round 6 Gbw random rock Dice: Not Me
G1: I thoughtseizes all my Spells and then goes for Confi,Confi,Confi where I go for landlandlandlandgg.
G2: I keep a two lander because of top. I die with one land in play after he gripped my Top and vindicated a land.
3-3 -.-
To sum up:
I had to play against 4 friends in 6 rounds, lost even the very good matchups and casted like 1 or 2 Standstills in the whole tournament. BUT! I nearly always had all three factories in play :) I think Iīm gonna play Goyfsligh for a while now, my deck hates me (or maybe just wants new sleeves :P)
Cheers,
NQN
DCI: 68 10 43 34
On next tournament I'm trying this, and I'd like some advice.
4 Mishra's Factory
1 Mutavault
4 Flooded Strand
4 Tundra
9 Island
3 Plains
(25 lands)
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Sower of Temptation
2 Trinket Mage
(6 creatures)
2 Elspeth, The Knight Errant
(2 planeswalkers)
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Counterspell
2 Moat
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Spell Snare
4 Standstill
4 Swords to Plowshares
(27 other spells)
Sideboard
4 Meddling Mage
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Pithing Needle
2 Dispeller's Capsule
2 Path to Exile
2 Threads of Disloyalty
1 Nevinyrral's Disk
It's another concept of the deck, maybe more agressive who knows.
Manabase: 25 lands is overkill, you need 23 at most, 2 more fetches and Academy Ruins (just wins with Explosives).
Creatures: ditch Sower, seriously. It sucks there. What are you running Trinket Mage for (only Explosives)? If you really want to run it, you have to add some grabbable maindeck 'meat' for it. E. g. Pithing needle, Sensei's Divining Top, Relic of Progenitus. Otherwise, it sucks, you better off running additional Explosives.
Spells: Needs more removal.
And for god's sake, play wasteland.
Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity - Seneca, Roman dramatist
Co-Founder of Team Awesome - I heard Randy Buehler say a while back that good players give themselves the most number of turns to find the answer.
The Source on MTGO - Predator8785 and RockOut
johanessen, I had some questions about your list.
Firstly, what's your meta like? What decks do you usually see at a given tournament?
Are the trinket mages only to fetch the engineered explosives and some sideboard material? How have you found it? It seems to me like a really, really bad tutor, especially considering that with your two moats (I amwith envy about that, I promise you) they won't be able to attack most of the time. If you end up keeping them, I'd put in singleton copies of artifact lands. Just a thought.
On the subject of engineered explosives, I'm concerned about your restriction to two colors. I played elves the other day, and being able to EE at 3 was absolutely CRITICAL.
How have you found the vendillion cliques? Mossivo is a strong proponent, but I haven't found time to test them and I'm curious what you thought. What matchups do you want them/don't want them?
Given your high island count--which I think is a choice, guys, it makes him less vulnerable to wasteland/color screw in exchange for not being able to handle other deck's manlands--have you considered vedalken shackles? It looks to me like it might be very strong here.
Originally Trinket Mage slot was Kira, but i found Trinket mage very good against aggro, zoo and tribal decks because it's a blocker plus ee tutor, and post side helps to get the bullets.
Kira was good because of flying and protect the vendilion and the sower wich are weak against removal.
It's maybe a better option?
About EE@2 it could be an option to add u-sea or scrubland to get the third color, I'll try it.
It is NOT an option.
It is MANDATORY!!!
EE@3 is awesome!
Plus to that, you can play those black classics, like extirpate, engineered plague, the abyss, .....
A renown deckbuilder wrote me:
Enjoy, and spread the word that I didn't meant for this to be simply "cool", but rather prove that choosing the right card means using the card that best fulfills its purpose, not the card that is accepted as "strongest"/"best"...
THIS IS WHAT MAGIC SHOULD BE !!!!
Hmm The Abyss+Kira sounds sexy, but i'm not used to like that card.
If I add black in mana base, I suppose i'm adding Extirpates and Plagues on sideboard, remove trinket mage for wishes and one enlightened tutor in sideboard. It's a very valid option too. But my last thoughts on plagues are not very good.
I would say that TA is a 55/45, 60/40 MU in our favor. It's not a bye because they can sometimes draw the nuts and screw you out of colored mana forever. It's difficult to play against, but once you secure your lands against TA, they become the easiest deck to beat, especially post Path to up to 6 StP effects.
However, my friend had boarded in Extirpates and used them against StP, therefore removing quite a ton of my answers to their threat-light density. I believe that Extirpate against Landstill is a good card for TA since they can discard and pate out the StP and relevant answers we have against them. Overall, it's a fun MU, and not a bye, but should be in our favor. The TA player can argue that it's in their favor, but it all ends up in whether TA can disrupt our manabase before we land our bombs and answer theirs.
The Abyss is too slow for Legacy at this point and there are too many commonly played cards that avoid it, Phyrexian Dreadnought, Nimble Mongoose, Mishra's Factory and Mutavault being the obvious ones before you get into rogue decks still playing Gigapede and Masticore and other holdovers from days gone by.
As a solution it also has the problem that by the time you're likely to get it in play the opponent has a reasonable chance to have drawn their grips or wipeaways and it doesn't save you.
Moat has the advantage that it totally shuts down most opponents when it lands and so the speed vs risk factor plays a little bit better in your favor. Drawing The Abyss when you are facing an aggro opponent with multiple creatures on the board only delays the result by a short while as they lose creatures one by one.
I tried to make a deck to exploit The Abyss using Nimble Mongoose, Phyrexian Dreadnought and Gigapede alongside Mishra's Factories, and I found that the creatures themselves won games but The Abyss was just too slow to help when it was needed. Was nice win-more when it landed but that was all it was.
Moat seems really counter-synergistic with 5 grounded manlands, and Trinket Mages. I'd probably play 1 Enlightened Tutor, and an additional removal spell in the places of the Mages. A land could probably afford to be dropped for another removal spell as well (2x PTE or Wrath).
If you end up dropping Sower and Mage, I'd probably go with the standard Decrees of Justice and Humility(ies) over Moat at that point, since the manlands rule the ground with Humility on board, and the Decree and Elspeth Tokens become gigantic CA machines.
Somewhat off topic...
Also I wouldn't attach oneself to a 3rd color splash necessarily having to be Black. When the deck was running Vindicates in the main, and almost always 3-4 Extripates and Engineered Plagues in the board, Black made the most sense. With the printings of Path to Exile and Relic of Progenitus, Landstill has gained access to a few more very powerful cards that can fill the holes against agro (Tribal and otherwise) and Graveyard strategies.
If you can supplement the decks Removal and GY hate in the primary colors already, then maybe a different color could help fill other needs. I haven't really explored it too much, but Green obviously offers Krosan Grip, Seed Spark (as Wish target?), Nantuko Monastary, and Life from the Loam. Red could give Red Blasts, Fire//Ice and 'Clasm effects.
Either of these may prove to be strictly worse than Black (as was the case prior to SoA block), but it seems like a possibility that they'd be better in some metas.
TPDMC
Mossivo1986 : Mind listing a list? Or point out a what page it is? :)
Robert
With the new changes, here is the list.
4 Mishra's Factory
1 Mutavault
4 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
4 Tundra
1 Underground Sea
1 Scrubland
3 Island
2 Plains
1 Academy Ruins
(25 lands)
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Sower of Temptation
(4 creatures)
2 Elspeth, The Knight Errant
(2 planeswalkers)
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Counterspell
2 Cunning Wish
2 Moat
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Spell Snare
4 Standstill
4 Swords to Plowshares
(29 other spells)
Sideboard
4 Meddling Mage
4 Extirpate
2 Hydroblast
2 Path to Exile
1 Pulse of the fields
1 Dismantling Blow
1 Enlightened Tutor
How do you see now
Yes... this are my feelings right now. But games take too long, with moat you can still have those flyers to end game faster, which is a problem in Landstill
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