[Deck] Dream Halls

[Brushwagg]

@Gravehate: If they remove the GY then thats really no problem. CU is going to draw you 3 cards. Nucklavee is there because you can bring it back with the CU over and over.

On the topic of tutoring, one thing I don't like and that seems to be everywhere is Mystical Tutor. I don't see many cases where it can be better that Conflux. If it's to tutor into vault into DH, then that's costing two cards and two turns, which will rarely be good enough

No Mystical isn't as good as Conflux. However Mystical is castable in the early turns and can get you stuff you need before the combo. EX Echoing Truth, Duress/Cabal Therapy, LDV, Conflux (if that's what you need to win) etc... I would love it if Mystical brought the card to hand, but it doesn't.

[Maveric78f]

About gravehate, I've exlain one gazillion times that we could bounce any permanent before starting playing any important that you don't want to see removed. I also explained that you could thoughtseize your opponent and then make him discard 3 with CU before playing those cards. Most of the time, you can even do both! So grave hate is actually not a problem. Even better, it's something that looks relevant but that is not, meaning that a lot of players will SB in grave hate although it's useless. (Well extirpate is very good against this deck when coupled with targetted discard and/or grips)

[Brushwagg]

Brainstorm helps a ton with discard.

[Puzzle]

About gravehate, I've exlain one gazillion times that we could bounce any permanent before starting playing any important that you don't want to see removed. I also explained that you could thoughtseize your opponent and then make him discard 3 with CU before playing those cards. Most of the time, you can even do both! So grave hate is actually not a problem. Even better, it's something that looks relevant but that is not, meaning that a lot of players will SB in grave hate although it's useless. (Well extirpate is very good against this deck when coupled with targetted discard and/or grips)

There are indeed solutions to graveyard hate.
My point is that they take more slots than the Prismatic Omen kill, which can just ignore the problem altogether.

[Brushwagg]

If you play 4x CU then you shouldn't have the problem either. It tkaes a couple of extra slots but the only card I'm worried about then is Extirpate (and I'm not that worried about).

The decks I'm worried about are the fast aggro. I'm currently playing this SB:

2x Sower of Temptation (probably going to change)
3x Firespout
2x Pithing Needle
2x Tormod's Crypt (probably going to 3x)
4x Pyroblast
2x Energy Feild (testing this one out)

[Elfer]

If there's any concern over being extirpated after resolving DH, maybe stick a singleton thought hemo in the sideboard? That way even if they have a magic hand with multiple extirpates you still wouldn't lose.

[anonymos]

I'm not a big fan of Energy Field in pretty much anything. It's useless once Dream Halls resolves and is pretty bad before as well, because you can't search for anything with it in play, so it's pretty much useless.

[Shanghi Knights]

I haven't ran into any problems regarding this yet but It be best to ask before anyone gives me shit and i don't have an answer.

Dreams halls ability is a static may ability correct? Or is it a triggered ability that can be stifled?

[Dark_Shakuras]

I haven't ran into any problems regarding this yet but It be best to ask before anyone gives me shit and i don't have an answer.

Dreams halls ability is a static may ability correct? Or is it a triggered ability that can be stifled?

Can't be stifled.

[Chaz_the_hunter]

Why isn't everyone just figure out a way to go infinite so that even if they try to screw you, you can still win anyways....

Why not try this
Conflux x2-4 (Dependent on your search/draw engine)
Cruel x1
Nucklevee x1
Sadistic Hypnotist x1

Play this in a U/b shell with discard and you CAN (not want to but its possible) play every odd part of the combo. It actually goes infinite and dumps your opponent's grip real quick.

Conflux gets Conflux, Cruel, Nucklevee, Hypno.
Play Sadistic Hypnotist off of Conflux
Play Nucklevee off of random card getting back Conflux and ponder/BS/Counter/whatever (Using the cruel as discard here is possible, but I try not to so if they stop this part somehow I still have another spell to play here)
Sacrifice Nucklevee to Hypnotist (And hypno if needed
NOW play Cruel and get back Nucklevee
Play Nucklevee getting Cruel and X
Etc....

I play a copy of Turn to Mist which is a 'White' card that can also donk ppl's Dreadnoughts and fog a turn, but gives you the last part of your combo, otherwise you only find 4 with conflux and then I want an extra blue card in hand to go off with so if they counter the Nucklevee I can still play Cruel dump their hand and get Nucklevee back. Then you just play the waiting game attacking with Nuck FTW

[Maveric78f]

The way you describe it you could be disrupted with Extirpate.

Let's say you play Ub.

Conflux#1 :
R : CU
W/G : Conflux#2
B : randomB
U : randomInstantU

Conflux#2 discarding randomInstantU:
R : Nucklavee
W/G : none
B : Sadistic Hypnotist
U : randomU

Your hand at this point (considering your hand was empty after Conflux#1):
Sadistic Hypnotist, randomB, randomU, CU, Nucklavee

Play Sadistic Hypnotic with randomB. Sacrifice it. Opponent discard 2.
Play CU with randomU. Opponent discards 3. You draw 3. You regrowth Sadistic Hypnotist.
The danger here is not to draw any blue card with CU. I prefer to play a bounce for the combo.

[Shanghi Knights]

one of the pesky issues thats been bothering me in the tinkering with my last posted build is lim duls isn't always getting me what i need and often i'm getting counter spelled as i go to play dream halls/show and tell. Hand tutoring might make a big difference, vs tutor top of library then say divining top what u tutored to your hand. ((i guess rhystic and grim tutors count) just slight problem of cost and an opponent paying two) So throwing in dark rits for speed seems like a good idea but the card i'm trying to figure out if it can have a tutoring home here is brainspoil. transmutes for 5 and not so risky as rhystic, the thought is it fetches dream halls or force. with ritual and show and tell it brings the deck 8 chances to have a 3 mana curve to feasibly go off. but i'm just not entirely sure about brainspoils, looks good but doesn't do much other than card grab. If i were to use them, i'd probably go for 4 in the main board.

[Brushwagg]

My newer list.

// Lands
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
2 Crystal Vein
3 Island
3 Volcanic Island
3 Underground Sea
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Swamp

// Creatures
2 Nucklavee

// Spells
2 Echoing Truth
1 Chain of Vapor
3 Dream Halls
2 Conflux
4 Cruel Ultimatum
3 Cabal Therapy
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
3 Lim-Dul's Vault
3 Fact or Fiction
4 Thoughtseize
3 Dark Ritual

// Sideboard
SB: 3 Firespout
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt
SB: 4 Pyroblast
SB: 3 Propaganda
SB: 1 Wipe Away

@FoF: It's been kind of hit or miss. After I track down a couple more Ancestral Vision it's going in it's place.

@Dark Ritual: Testing it to try to speed the deck up. Not to into Show and Tell since you never know what your opponent might drop with it.

@Firespout: Proabaly going to be removed for something else. Not sure what yet.

[Mr.T]

A friend and myself have been working on dream halls since its unbanning.

DREAM HALLS

//1cc
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
//2cc
3 Remand
//3cc
4 Show and Tell
//5cc
4 Dream Halls
4 Mulldrifter
4 Tidings
4 Force of Will
//7cc
4 Cruel Ultimatum
//8cc
2 Conflux
//10cc
2 Progenitus
1 Time Stretch
//LAND
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Crystal Vein
3 Syvelunite Temple
4 Underground Sea
5 Island

Draw package:
Brainstorm and Ponder: are a staple in blue should need no explanation.
Tidings: was originally Opportunity but after testing I have realized that Tidings costing one less to play allows you to play it without Dream Halls on board a lot easier. Also the instant speed wasn't really needed.
Mulldrifter:It is basically a draw engine and helps with the combo. I didn't like not getting the full effect of Cruel Ultimatum so I found a creature that would be useful pre-Dream Halls as well as post-Dream Halls. Mulldrifter allows you to evoke early to draw cards and when Cruel is cast comes back to your hand to cast either another cruel or cast a different draw spell or at the very least cast himself to draw cards.
The Combo:
Dream Halls:Self explanatory
Conflux:Just one of these sets you up for to win with Dream Halls in play
Show and Tell:Allows you to combo off on turn 2. Also can cast an early Progenitus.
Time Stretch:Take extra turns when progenitus is on board or if you happen to stall out hopefully you can continue on the one of your next 2 turns
Cruel Ultimatum:Cast it 4 times and win.
Protection:
Force of will:Self explanatory
Remand:Helps you buy a turn as well as draw u an extra card to go off the following turn.

Sideboard:
4 Thoughtseize
2 Disrupt
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Chill
3 Hydroblast

Knowing that Krosan Grip is a problem card, the black was added for thoughtseize in the board.

[Zlatzman]

This list was just piloted to a win in a 270-player tournament in Germany by Jonas Harbili (source). I've never played the deck myself, but I figure this result might warrant further discussion on the deck. I'm not going to attempt to do an in-depth analysis of the specific card choices made, but I would believe that the stability of the mana-base was important in this tournament (the deck was faced with 11x Wasteland through the top-8 only).

Land:
4 Flooded Strand
2 Scalding Tarn
5 Island
1 Polluted Delta
3 Ancient Tomb
2 Underground Sea

Cantrips and tutors:
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Lim-Dul's Vault

Acceleration:
4 Show and Tell
3 Lotus Petal

Disruption:
4 Force of Will
4 Thoughtseize

Combo:
1 Bogardan Hellkite
4 Progenitus
4 Dream Halls
3 Cruel Ultimatum
4 Conflux


Sideboard:
1 Hydroblast
2 Pithing Needle
1 Rushing River
3 Propaganda
2 Duress
2 Meditate
4 Spell Pierce

[ktkenshinx]

This deck seems incredibly strong against Aggro. With a decent hand you can easily attain turn 3-4 wins with regularity. Even turn 2 wins would likely appear throughout a day at a tournament.

Instead of trying to beat Aggro with disruption and alternate win conditions, like some combo decks do, this one tries to do it with speed alone. Looking at the top 8 of the day, as well as the metagame breakdown, this seems to have worked very well. En route to his top 8 victory, the deck's pilot, Jonas Harbili, beat 2 Aggro Loam decks and 1 Zoo build. We do not have any information (that I can find) about Harbili's Aggro Loam matchups, but the German blow-by-blow of his Zoo final is indeed up. For those who do not speak German, here is what happened (this is not a direct translation from the site, but rather, my narration of the facts).

Game 1
Harbili opens with a fetchland and Ponder. Meier drops Nacatl. Harbili Ponders again and puts Ancient Tomb into play. Meier drops another land, suspends a Rift Bolt, and brings another Nacatl into play. He then swings for 2, unable to find a Plains to pump up the Nacatl to full 3/3 might. Harbili only plays a land on turn 3 and passes. Meier unsuspends Rift Bolt, zapping Harbili down to 14. He then sends both Nacatl's into the red to bring the combo player to 10 life. On his turn 4, Harbili plays another fetch, cracks both it and the one from the previous turn, and then casts Dream Halls courtesy of the Ancient Tomb. This brings him down to a dangerous 6 life, well in range of Meier's burn spells. As if he had planned for this, Meier responds to Harbili's Conflux casting with a pair of Bolts for the win. But Harbili has a FoW to keep him at 2 life. That's all it takes for Harbili to quickly fire off 3 Cruel Ultimatum's and 1 Hellkite to secure game 1.

Game 2
Meier kicks things off with a turn 1 Nacatl. Harbili Brainstorms on his turn and ends. Nacatl is reinforced with a Vexing Shusher, and Meier attacks for 3. Unfazed, Harbili just drops a land. On his turn 3, Meier blasts Harbili for 3 with Chain Lightning, and swings with both of his creatures. Unfortunately, this is the last turn that he gets. Harbili's turn 3 sees a land, a Show and Tell, and a Dream Halls. 3 Ultimatum's and 1 Hellkite later, the match is over and the tournament wraps up in Harbili's favor.

Harbili's Dream Halls deck was just too fast. This is proof that adding all sorts of defensive cards like Firespout, extra counters, extra creatures, etc. is not needed against aggro decks. Speed and a minimum of necessary protection is enough for Dream Halls to win.

-ktkenshinx-

[Phoenix Ignition]

That's the luckiest game one ever. Even with stifle and wasteland you can't count on zoo being screwed off of a plains.

Honestly that list has so many dead cards in it and is so dependent on dream halls that I would just play belcher since it wins against similar decks and is more or less better at it.

[Nidd]

I wonder how much DH will go up no - SHIT, GOTTA GET A PLAYSET!

The fact that this deck is a combo deck that actually packs counters make sit pretty scary in my eyes. However, 1 T8 proves nothing, this deck still has a long way to go.

[Maveric78f]

His list looks really inferior to the ones I've built earlier. It's only strength is the Prog/show and tell plan, which I've already included in several of my builds. The main reproaches I would make to this deck is to fold to black decks (it can't do anything once it has 0 card in hand, it looks also very dependent on SnT with only 17 lands and even SnT might be difficult to cast, and finally the huge number of dead cards precombo is really annoying.

[Illissius]

Yeah this deck sucks, it could never win a major tournament.