[DTB] Vial Goblins

[UberNewHacks]

Why not Snuff Out? It takes care of Iona, anything in Merfolk, anything in Zoo without having the Pyrokinesis card disadvantage?

[Cyrus]

Pyrokinesis can be a 2:3, and usually a 2:2. Snuff Out is always a 1:1, and can't kill confidant and other relevant stuff. And the lifeloss isn't negligible either.

[Enigma]

I played goblins last sunday in a 35 people tournament in montreal and finished 9th. I wanted to share the list, which I find really good against control and aggro-controls. I'll just add more pyrokinesis to the board and switch 1 MD Squad for 1 more Gempalm, and I think I'll be fine enough against aggro too.

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Comments!

P-M

[Nelis]

1 Wort, the Raidmother

<snip>

SB

1 Tin Street Hooligan
2 Krosan Grip
3 Pyrokinesis
3 Perish
3 Chalice of the Void
3 Thorn of Amethyst

Apparently the splashes in both decks are primarily for the sideboard, this list only have 1 black card main in Warren Weirding. Also some weird numbers and inclusions - look for instance the ratio between Warchief and Chieftain, the 1 Mogg war Marshall, 1 Mogg fanatic, 1 Skirk Prospecter and 1 Raidmother. Honestly Raidmother just seems like a worse Siege-gang Commander maindeck, but I guess she is quite the beating when you can copy Perish (to fight counterspells), and to a certain extent Krosan Grip and pyrokineisis, and ofcourse you can copy the maindeck Weirding, which seems quite saucy too..

I just figured out that's not possible.

Each red or green instant or sorcery spell you cast has conspire. (As you cast the spell, you may tap two untapped creatures you control that share a color with it. When you do, copy it and you may choose new targets for the copy.)

So I wonder is Wort, Raidmother only intended to copy Pyrokinesis or Krosan Grip or is it simply an entry mistake? Should it not just be Wort, Boggart Auntie?

And am I right that I do not have to remove a card when I copy a Pyrokinesis with the conspire ability? I'm not 100% sure.

[FoulQ]

I really doubt its Wort the Raidmother, seeing as how that card is absolutely atrocious, especially in this deck which plays 0 maindeck red or green instant/sorcery spells and only 2 in the sideboard. A card that costs SIX, with ZERO relevance g1, sorry but that was a misprint.

[Mikeleroi]

I played goblins last sunday in a 35 people tournament in montreal and finished 9th. I wanted to share the list, which I find really good against control and aggro-controls. I'll just add more pyrokinesis to the board and switch 1 MD Squad for 1 more Gempalm, and I think I'll be fine enough against aggro too.

Report, List

Comments!

P-M

Just curiosity, why not running Warchiefs? Better with Bannerets?

[Enigma]

It fits the curve better, making our non-vial hands way, way better. That's the main reason. Sure, Chieftain helped making this switch because we still have the "haste lord".

P-M

[arebennian]

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showt...36#post4849536

Bazaar Trader 1R
Creature - Goblin (R)
T: Target player gains control of target artifact, creature or land that you control.
1/1
Matt Cavotta
#72/145

I was really looking forward to this guy :-(

[Cyrus]

Me too. Thought it was gonna be a gilded drake on steroids.

[Cesarius]

...Well, at least Goblins now has an excuse to strap a Bronze Bombshell combo onto the deck.

Okay who am I kidding, let's hope for other, more relevant goblins.

[Nelis]

It has taken me a while to realize that monoR is better than Br. I have also figured out that Warren Instigator isn't worth running. He makes the deck too inconsistent.

Next sunday I will play at my local tournament, 20 people will attend. First I'll post my decklist and below that the expected metagame and what I'm thinking of putting in my sideboard. That's where I'd like your advice.

//Creatures
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Mogg War Marshal
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Matron
4 Gempalm Incinerator
4 Goblin Chieftain
2 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Ringleader
2 Siege-Gang Commander

//Artifacts
4 AEther Vial

//Lands
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
16 Mountain

My thoughts on the Chieftains and Warchiefs. I rather have a War Marshal on turn 2 and a Chieftain turn 3 than a Warchief turn 3. I see Warchiefs more as a midgame/lategame card when you want to push some last damage in fast or when you're trying to overwhelm your opponent (and want to put out multiple creatures).

I'm thinking of putting in 1 Stingscourger but don't know what to take out.

Expected metagame:
Merfolk: 2, maybe more. 1 will be U/W
Rock: 1 (could also be Merfolk)
Landstill: 1 (could also be Merfolk or a countertop deck)
Aggro Loam: 1 (maybe 2)
WGB TopRock: 1 (flickerwisp/kitchen finks 'combo' included)
Dragon Stompy: 1
NoPro Countertop: 1
UGr TreshTresh: 1
Combo: 3 probably (if I guess: 1 Belcher, 1 Aluren or Dredge, 1 unknown)
Random Homebrew: 3 (2 are negligable)
Unknown: 5 (most likely aggrocontrol)

Bad matchups:
Aggro Loam
Combo (1 person will be a good pilot (Aluren or Dredge))

Troublesome matchups:
NoPro Countertop
Dragon Stompy
WGB Toprock

Annoying matchups:
Merfolk

Please let me know if you see things differently about the analysis above.

Sideboard:
4 Ravenous Trap (vs aggro loam Dredge)
4 Pyrokinesis (Merfolk and random aggro)
3 Shattering Spree (Merfolk: Jitte/Vial, Dragon Stompy, Random Artifacts)

That leaves 4 open slots. What to put in?

[Cesarius]

If you want to improve your combo-matchups: Try CotV/Pyrostatic Pillar.
I'm also seeing a blue-heavy meta going on there. I'm not too experienced with Goblins so I might be wrong here, but is Pyroblast/BEB a viable sideboard card for Goblins?

[Nelis]

I'm thinking of ignoring Belcher if they belch, I can side in Pyrokinesis vs their tokens if they go that way. I'm not 100% sure that deck will show up anyway. Ravenous Trap 'takes care' of Aggro Loam and Dredge. That should be enough to battle the combo decks that (might) see play.

Pyroblast/Reb has entered my mind but shouldn't Pyrokinesis be enough vs Merfolk?

How about Summoning Trap for the other U matchups?

[Joe_C]

Nelis: I wouldnt say instigator isnt worth running at all, I wouldnt run more than 2 personally, but I cant say not running him makes your list inferior, since goblins was good before instigator, and he doesnt make the deck broken by any means ie. thresh running werebear nowadays vs goyf...

I like 4 pyrokinesis and at least 2 reb in my board. Reb is useful in alot of matchups, I even bring in a few against ichorid. Rhox war monk is another big card that Reb deals with, and in a way in certain situations I would rather pitch a reb to pryokinesis than a creature, so having them in together against blue is good times. I know people who have run summoning trap with some success, seems worthwhile if you are in a control infested meta.

[Nelis]

Nelis: I wouldnt say instigator isnt worth running at all, I wouldnt run more than 2 personally, but I cant say not running him makes your list inferior, since goblins was good before instigator, and he doesnt make the deck broken by any means ie. thresh running werebear nowadays vs goyf...

I figured if I run 2 I hardly have them in my hand when I would want them the most (early game) that's why I left them out.

I like 4 pyrokinesis and at least 2 reb in my board. Reb is useful in alot of matchups, I even bring in a few against ichorid. Rhox war monk is another big card that Reb deals with, and in a way in certain situations I would rather pitch a reb to pryokinesis than a creature, so having them in together against blue is good times. I know people who have run summoning trap with some success, seems worthwhile if you are in a control infested meta.

Sounds solid, there's probably about 8-10 blue based decks. So that's + 2 REB. I think I'll add 2 Pithing Needles as well since it's good vs Sensei's Divining Top, Belcher, Planeswalkers (Elspeth) and other random stuff.

[lillelassie]

[QUOTE=Nelis;421945]I figured if I run 2 I hardly have them in my hand when I would want them the most (early game) that's why I left them out.

You kind of run them as Lackey number 5 and 6, since thats the number I guess most people would play of lackey's if you could play more than four.. So if you run two you effectively have 6 lackey effects - thus improving to have a lackey when you want it the most (early game). You could try to add 2 Warren Instigators over 2 Mogg War Marshalls for a while and tell us all how that is..

Regarding your sb I have a few comments. If you want 3 Shattering Spree I think it could be nice to replace 1 of them with Goblin Tinkerer as a tutor target, and he can sometimes kill more than 1 artifact too.. I would split up your graveyard hate - if you only 4 hate-effect I would go something like 2 Tormods Crypt and 2 Ravenous Trap.. This way you challenge GY-decks better I think cause they have to have different anti-hate cards too. Like artifact hate AND discard, instead of just discard.

The 2 added Reb is okay I guess - personally I dont really like them, since they dont really do anything for me I think.

Other than that you could maybe add a Stingscourger or two in your sb just to bring in vs goyfdecks, but I guess your MD Mogg War Marshall does a gooc job blocking them anyway. For the last slot you could consider something fun like 1 Jitte or 1 Sharpshooter against creature decks I guess. Have you guys had any experiences with Sharpshooter vs Merfolk? He seems good on paper vs them. So my SB for you would look something Like:

Creature Hate:
4 Pyrokinesis
1 Sharpshooter
1 Stingscourger

Artifact hate:
2 Shattering Spree
1 Goblin Tinkerer

GY hate:
2 Ravenous Trap
2 Tormods Crypt

Misc:
2 Red Elemental Blast

[Nelis]

Yeah you're right on the Instigator (that line of reasoning slipped my mind) but I'll leave 'em out because there's no room. I just cut 1 mountain for a Stingscourger.

I'll think the sb over some more.

[ScatmanX]

Dropping Stigator Turn 2 and Chieftain Turn 3 deals the same amount of damage as War-marchall. I'd suggest running at least 2. I'm at 3 for instance.

About Sharpshooter, Lightning Crafter is just better agains't Merfolk. You just win 90% of the time you land one. The bad part is that Sharpshooter is better agains't Empy the Warrens, so dunno... The SB looks fine.

[Nelis]

Dropping Stigator Turn 2 and Chieftain Turn 3 deals the same amount of damage as War-marhall. I'd suggest running at least 2. I'm at 3 for instance.

That's true but with war marshal you get 2 damage in when my opponent has a blocker. Another reason I chose for War Marshal is that it's better with Gempalm Incinerator.

But what would you propose I take out should I want to put in 2 Instigators? I suppose I cuold take out 1 War MArshal but I don't feel like going to 2 marshals.

[lillelassie]

Piledriver or Chieftain are probably what you want to cut after 1 MWM. imo. I still like my 4 Warchiefs main, since its nice to both tutor for and play a Ringleader in the same turn. Makes you cast multiple spells on one turn - its kinda like a pseudo Vial in my opinion, and they are actually okay in multiples, since Matron, Ringleader, SGC have more colorless manacost.

In general I find Goblins to be a very manahungry deck, add to this that you run waste and port - its nice to be able to waste on turn 4, and STILL play your Ringleader, Port keeping them off goyf-mana mid game, etc... Point is that you almost can't manascrew with goblins, there is just so much to do with that mana, SCG's activated ability, Gempalm, Port, Echo-cost, playing multiple goblins in the same turn. I'd think twice about playing less than 4 Warchiefs. This is ofcourse just arguments from the top of my head - pure theory. I haven't tested or played goblins for a long time.