[DTB] Vial Goblins

[GoboLord]

Yes.
You need Prospector OR Shooter.
That's what I said...

Yeah sry, I managed to misunderstand your post twice

[ScatmanX]

The difference is, that you can cast Rev. SIlence any time you control a forest while the other one can be played every time you have 2 mana left. The temposink IS the same, yeah.

I'd prefer Grip or Nature's Claim too btw. What Do you think of Nature's claim, Scatchman?
I bring it in against combo too, to destroy my vials/chalice in response on the any Tendrils copy and gain 4 lives

@ GoGoLord: I think Nature's Claim is a valid option for SB instead of Krosan also. Haven't tested it yet, but seem quite solid.
Nice Idea versus combo also. That can nail you a few games.
I tested Grip while CB/Top and Stiflenought saw a lot of play. Maybe, in today's metagame, if you don't see a lot of those, Nature's Claim would be my 1st option.

Question: Do you side it in against Goblins? Merfolk? Death and Taxes?

[Neuad]

Prospector is out since I can combo off with Kiki Crafter and Sharpshooter also, and Sharpshooter is obviously better.

Vexing Shusher is MB now.

SB looks something like this now

3 Perish - Obvious
3 Thorns - Storm and Enchantress, totals about 5-6 decks any given week in my meta so possibly more
3 Pyrokenesis - Still gotta do some testing and learn this card
3 Leylines of the void - Survival decks, which we have 2-3 of any given week. Dredge which I've seen 1-2 up there, possibly enchantress to stop replenish?
3 Reverent Silence - Moat, Humility, enchantress.

Edit - Manabase looks like this now, since I relized I don't have easy access to Ports

4 Badlands
4 Bloodstained Mires
4 Wastelands
2 Taiga
6 Mountains
2 Wooded Foothills

[GoboLord]

@ GoGoLord: I think Nature's Claim is a valid option for SB instead of Krosan also. Haven't tested it yet, but seem quite solid.
Nice Idea versus combo also. That can nail you a few games.
I tested Grip while CB/Top and Stiflenought saw a lot of play. Maybe, in today's metagame, if you don't see a lot of those, Nature's Claim would be my 1st option.

Question: Do you side it in against Goblins? Merfolk? Death and Taxes?

Sorry Scatman :D.

If you are aiming at the Vial-component of their decks: no.
Since D'n'T is likely to run Jitte and Swords I'd always bring it in against them. Plus, they are unable to counter it and the damage race against them isn't too hard, so this are the things I'm considering.
Against Merfolk: If I get to see Jitte in g2 I'd bring Claims in in g3. Since the damage race is a bit harder here AND they have counters I would not bring it it to only hit Vial.
Against Goblins: Never. The last thing I want to do is to donate my opp 4 lives. Plus, every card in our MD is more useful against Gobins than Nature's Claim is.

Prospector is out since I can combo off with Kiki Crafter and Sharpshooter also, and Sharpshooter is obviously better.

Vexing Shusher is MB now.

SB looks something like this now

3 Perish - Obvious
3 Thorns - Storm and Enchantress, totals about 5-6 decks any given week in my meta so possibly more
3 Pyrokenesis - Still gotta do some testing and learn this card
3 Leylines of the void - Survival decks, which we have 2-3 of any given week. Dredge which I've seen 1-2 up there, possibly enchantress to stop replenish?
3 Reverent Silence - Moat, Humility, enchantress.

Edit - Manabase looks like this now, since I relized I don't have easy access to Ports

4 Badlands
4 Bloodstained Mires
4 Wastelands
2 Taiga
6 Mountains
2 Wooded Foothills

Straight mana base!
I run 2 Kinesis. Maybe you can cut one and go up to 4 Thorns? But this is what testing wil reveal.
I wouldn't bring Leyline in against Enchantress cause it stops only 3 cards of their deck. Thorn and SIlence should do it.
Against Survival decks I bring in Leyline in g2. When it comes to g3 I exchange it with Reverent Silence (cause they will board Krosan Grips to go for your Leyline)

[JonBarber]

I really like kgrip more than nature's claim. The speed difference is not THAT big of a deal. The things I'm hitting it the most with are Moat, Humility, E plague, and Jitte. Almost all of the decks that play these cards also back them with counterspells. Therefore I find it much more valuable to be positive I'm gonna destroy their bomb then get screwed by a force. Although that nature's claim trick vs storm seems narrow, but hilarious if it actually works.

[Micki]

Hello everybody and greetings from Finland!

I need help with my Goblin deck!!
First some history;

1) I have NEVER played Goblins in a competition, all my thoughts are from goldfishing and playing "casually" with some friends.
2) I DO know that this is a DTB thread and if posting here with just questions and not much experience to share is wrong, then hopefully someone with the right authorization will delete this post.

I quit magic (once again) about 6 months ago mainly because I'm old enough to be father to most of you and I felt a bit stupid :) And once again my passion for this stupid game became to strong for me to think about trivial things like age....
I used to play Zoo or BWG -Deadguy but got bored with both and now I want to start playing the deck I always wanted but never got around to playing, here are my reasons for "why goblins";

1) This and burn are the only decks that I still have the cards for.
2) Burn is too boring
3) This is the only deck I still have the cards for :)
4) Since I don't have the time to play much and I don't know other decks good enough, I need to play a deck that is more focused on winning than preventing the opponent from doing so. I simply wouldn't know what to FoW if I played control or what to make the opponent to discard if I played black.
5) I have always wanted to play Goblins and as someone said earlier on this thread, the quest to find solutions from a limited card pool intrigues me much more than having 4-5 colors to choose from.

So here's the list I'm sitting on right now, followed by questions and thoughts;

4 Wasteland
2 Rishadan Port
16 Mountain

4 Aether Vial
2 Pyrokinesis

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
3 Siege-Gang Commander
3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Stingscourger
1 Lightning Crafter
2 Warren Instigator
1 Goblin Chieftain

Very very "raw" sideboard

3 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Pithing Needle
2 Anarchy
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Goblin Tinkerer
1 Vexing Shusher
1 Goblin King

I don't know the meta here well enough right now to try to optimize the deck against something so I want to keep the MD as close to an optimal goldfishing list as possible, this is why I have Instigators for instance though they aren't played much. Here's some cards I'd love to fit in but don't know how; Mogg War Marshall, Kiki-Jiki, mirror breaker and maybe one more Goblin Chieftain.
I'm VERY thankful for every comment, suggestion, thought or feedback You can take your time to give me!! Here are some things I've been wondering...

1) Are Perish and Warren Weirding important enough to invest in badlands and red fetches (which I don't have anymore) or can the deck be played well enough as mono R?
2) Does anyone use Leyline of the Void in a mono R SB?
3) The 2 Pyrokinesis MD might seem quite unusual but I want to have 6 removal spells that I can tutor for and I've played mostly against elves... Is 2 pyrokinesis MD a totally stupid idea?
4) Is there any point in playing Kiki-Jiki without both Lightning Crafter and Sharpshooter/Prospector?
5) What would a "basic" mono R sideboard look like today? At least earlier the meta here in Helsinki have been quite balanced (aggro/control/combo).

I all ready said that I'm aware that this is a DTB -thread so there is no need to comment on that, otherwise feel free to laugh, shout, advise, suggest or whatever the way you like to comment. If my list looks totally hopeless and I would be better of playing 40 Lightning Bolts or if I should return when I've bought the duals to make the deck 3 colored, do tell me...

My humble goal is to be the best Goblin deck in the Finnish Legacy champs late October/early November :) I neeed help!!!
Btw. English is very far from being my native language so please excuse me if I don't sound very fluent!

Many thanks in advance!!

[JonBarber]

Hello everybody and greetings from Finland!

I need help with my Goblin deck!!
First some history;

1) I have NEVER played Goblins in a competition, all my thoughts are from goldfishing and playing "casually" with some friends.
2) I DO know that this is a DTB thread and if posting here with just questions and not much experience to share is wrong, then hopefully someone with the right authorization will delete this post.

I quit magic (once again) about 6 months ago mainly because I'm old enough to be father to most of you and I felt a bit stupid :) And once again my passion for this stupid game became to strong for me to think about trivial things like age....
I used to play Zoo or BWG -Deadguy but got bored with both and now I want to start playing the deck I always wanted but never got around to playing, here are my reasons for "why goblins";

1) This and burn are the only decks that I still have the cards for.
2) Burn is too boring
3) This is the only deck I still have the cards for :)
4) Since I don't have the time to play much and I don't know other decks good enough, I need to play a deck that is more focused on winning than preventing the opponent from doing so. I simply wouldn't know what to FoW if I played control or what to make the opponent to discard if I played black.
5) I have always wanted to play Goblins and as someone said earlier on this thread, the quest to find solutions from a limited card pool intrigues me much more than having 4-5 colors to choose from.

So here's the list I'm sitting on right now, followed by questions and thoughts;

4 Wasteland
2 Rishadan Port
16 Mountain

4 Aether Vial
2 Pyrokinesis

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
3 Siege-Gang Commander
3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Stingscourger
1 Lightning Crafter
2 Warren Instigator
1 Goblin Chieftain

Very very "raw" sideboard

3 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Pithing Needle
2 Anarchy
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Goblin Tinkerer
1 Vexing Shusher
1 Goblin King

I don't know the meta here well enough right now to try to optimize the deck against something so I want to keep the MD as close to an optimal goldfishing list as possible, this is why I have Instigators for instance though they aren't played much. Here's some cards I'd love to fit in but don't know how; Mogg War Marshall, Kiki-Jiki, mirror breaker and maybe one more Goblin Chieftain.
I'm VERY thankful for every comment, suggestion, thought or feedback You can take your time to give me!! Here are some things I've been wondering...

1) Are Perish and Warren Weirding important enough to invest in badlands and red fetches (which I don't have anymore) or can the deck be played well enough as mono R?
2) Does anyone use Leyline of the Void in a mono R SB?
3) The 2 Pyrokinesis MD might seem quite unusual but I want to have 6 removal spells that I can tutor for and I've played mostly against elves... Is 2 pyrokinesis MD a totally stupid idea?
4) Is there any point in playing Kiki-Jiki without both Lightning Crafter and Sharpshooter/Prospector?
5) What would a "basic" mono R sideboard look like today? At least earlier the meta here in Helsinki have been quite balanced (aggro/control/combo).

I all ready said that I'm aware that this is a DTB -thread so there is no need to comment on that, otherwise feel free to laugh, shout, advise, suggest or whatever the way you like to comment. If my list looks totally hopeless and I would be better of playing 40 Lightning Bolts or if I should return when I've bought the duals to make the deck 3 colored, do tell me...

My humble goal is to be the best Goblin deck in the Finnish Legacy champs late October/early November :) I neeed help!!!
Btw. English is very far from being my native language so please excuse me if I don't sound very fluent!

Many thanks in advance!!

I'd def cut pyrokensis from the main. Theres certain matchups where its completely dead, and thats something you definitely don't want. If anything, play bolts there instead. I'm also not a big Lighting crafter fan, so I'd recommend cutting that for the 4th incinerator or maybe 3rd bolt.

[TossUsToLions]

Hello everybody and greetings from Finland!

I need help with my Goblin deck!!
First some history;

1) I have NEVER played Goblins in a competition, all my thoughts are from goldfishing and playing "casually" with some friends.
2) I DO know that this is a DTB thread and if posting here with just questions and not much experience to share is wrong, then hopefully someone with the right authorization will delete this post.

I quit magic (once again) about 6 months ago mainly because I'm old enough to be father to most of you and I felt a bit stupid :) And once again my passion for this stupid game became to strong for me to think about trivial things like age....
I used to play Zoo or BWG -Deadguy but got bored with both and now I want to start playing the deck I always wanted but never got around to playing, here are my reasons for "why goblins";

1) This and burn are the only decks that I still have the cards for.
2) Burn is too boring
3) This is the only deck I still have the cards for :)
4) Since I don't have the time to play much and I don't know other decks good enough, I need to play a deck that is more focused on winning than preventing the opponent from doing so. I simply wouldn't know what to FoW if I played control or what to make the opponent to discard if I played black.
5) I have always wanted to play Goblins and as someone said earlier on this thread, the quest to find solutions from a limited card pool intrigues me much more than having 4-5 colors to choose from.

So here's the list I'm sitting on right now, followed by questions and thoughts;

4 Wasteland
2 Rishadan Port
16 Mountain

4 Aether Vial
2 Pyrokinesis

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Piledriver
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
3 Siege-Gang Commander
3 Gempalm Incinerator
2 Stingscourger
1 Lightning Crafter
2 Warren Instigator
1 Goblin Chieftain

Very very "raw" sideboard

3 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Tormod's Crypt
3 Pithing Needle
2 Anarchy
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Goblin Tinkerer
1 Vexing Shusher
1 Goblin King

I don't know the meta here well enough right now to try to optimize the deck against something so I want to keep the MD as close to an optimal goldfishing list as possible, this is why I have Instigators for instance though they aren't played much. Here's some cards I'd love to fit in but don't know how; Mogg War Marshall, Kiki-Jiki, mirror breaker and maybe one more Goblin Chieftain.
I'm VERY thankful for every comment, suggestion, thought or feedback You can take your time to give me!! Here are some things I've been wondering...

1) Are Perish and Warren Weirding important enough to invest in badlands and red fetches (which I don't have anymore) or can the deck be played well enough as mono R?
2) Does anyone use Leyline of the Void in a mono R SB?
3) The 2 Pyrokinesis MD might seem quite unusual but I want to have 6 removal spells that I can tutor for and I've played mostly against elves... Is 2 pyrokinesis MD a totally stupid idea?
4) Is there any point in playing Kiki-Jiki without both Lightning Crafter and Sharpshooter/Prospector?
5) What would a "basic" mono R sideboard look like today? At least earlier the meta here in Helsinki have been quite balanced (aggro/control/combo).

I all ready said that I'm aware that this is a DTB -thread so there is no need to comment on that, otherwise feel free to laugh, shout, advise, suggest or whatever the way you like to comment. If my list looks totally hopeless and I would be better of playing 40 Lightning Bolts or if I should return when I've bought the duals to make the deck 3 colored, do tell me...

My humble goal is to be the best Goblin deck in the Finnish Legacy champs late October/early November :) I neeed help!!!
Btw. English is very far from being my native language so please excuse me if I don't sound very fluent!

Many thanks in advance!!

Welcome back to magic! And your list is far from "totally hopeless." It actually looks really strong. The only obvious things I see would be moving the pyrokenisis to SB. In their spot i would probably add Mogg War Marshall/more Chieftains. I also really like Rishadan Ports, and I would probably play 4 in a mono-red list, but that is obviously up to you. I understand theyre a bit pricy at the moment, too (i got lucky finding a great deal on mine :))

The splash is not necessary; mono-red decks do just fine. But, if you know your meta, then splashes can be extremely helpful. For example, if you know that Enchantress, Stax, Thopters, Engineered Plagues, etc. are running around the meta, then a green splash is for you. If there is a lot of Bant and Zoo, then black for perish is a great choice. It also depends on your personal playstyle. This takes some time to figure out, so i would probably stick with mono-red for a bit while you get used to your deck. Good luck!

[Neuad]

Weather you use Rev Silence or Back to Nature. . . how do you work around Karmic Justice? Or do you just hope to be able to clear the board and swing for lethal before they get one?

[Amon Amarth]

If you can avoid fetching out your Taiga most of the time they won't board in Karmic Justice. If worst comes to worst, yeah, just build up lethal and sac a bunch of lands and win.

[Neuad]

Well they get to choose the targets, and Enchantress is a huge part of my meta. We have 3-4 that run around weekly.

I was talking to my friend last night and he said he was planning on mainboarding a Karmic Justice :(

[Justin]

Hello everybody and greetings from Finland!


1) Are Perish and Warren Weirding important enough to invest in badlands and red fetches (which I don't have anymore) or can the deck be played well enough as mono R?
2) Does anyone use Leyline of the Void in a mono R SB?
3) The 2 Pyrokinesis MD might seem quite unusual but I want to have 6 removal spells that I can tutor for and I've played mostly against elves... Is 2 pyrokinesis MD a totally stupid idea?
4) Is there any point in playing Kiki-Jiki without both Lightning Crafter and Sharpshooter/Prospector?
5) What would a "basic" mono R sideboard look like today? At least earlier the meta here in Helsinki have been quite balanced (aggro/control/combo).

Many thanks in advance!!

1) I think the deck can play well enough with mono red. Mono red has some advantages, as it is less fragile to Wasteland and other non-basic land hate. If you are running, mono red, you should definately be playing Ports, however.

2) No. Go with Relic of Progenitus for your graveyard-hate sideboard. Removing your graveyard doesn't hurt and the extra card is really nice. Best of all, this card definately won't hurt your budget :)

3) I've seen Pyrokenesis in the main deck, but I wouldn't recommend it. You have enough removal in your main deck as it is. I agree with the recommendation that you should replace them with War Marshals and/or Chieftains.

4) Most experienced goblin players do not play Kiki-Jiki. The reason is that it is a "win more" card. This means that it is only really great when you are already winning (i.e. have a lot of great goblins already on the board to copy). It is a poor topdeck after your board has been wiped out by a firespout or other mass removal. I would recommend just playing an extra Siege-gang Commander in the Kiki-spot. Siege-gang is a great top deck after your board has been cleared.

5) It's hard to answer this last question. I would definately go with gy hate (relic), you can have your pyrokinesis in the side. Your rough sb isn't too bad. I like the idea of having a toolbox of one-of goblins that you can fetch with Matron (Shusher, Tinkerer, Sharpshooter, etc.). Personally, I see a lot of blue decks, so I would recommend playing some anti-blue hate (like Red Elemental Blast), but not everyone agrees.

[Nidd]

If your Meta is creature-heavy, play War Marshals and consider a 1-of Lightning Crafter.

In my testing, that dude has been a house against creature-based decks.
Maybe it's the german Meta or something, but I don't see Sharpshooter being any good here at all. In which MUs do you folks side him in?

[bakofried]

Again, here's my sideboard, if it helps:
3 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Tormod's Crypt
2 Red Elemental Blast
2 Pyroblast
1 Tuktuk Scrapper
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Goblin Tinkerer
1 Stingscourger

[kinda]

So I top 16'd again at Jupiter this weekend with Rw goblins going 5-2...unfortunately I had to settle for arid mesas this time instead of strands, but it was fun and I was very pleased with the deck.

4 Aether Vial

4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Piledriver
2 Goblin Instigator
2 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Stingscourger
4 Goblin Warchief
4 Goblin Matron
2 Goblin Chieftain
4 Goblin Ringleader
3 Siege-Gang Commander

4 Swords to Plowshares

4 Wasteland
2 Rishadan Port
4 Plateau
6 Mountain
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Arid Mesa

SB:
4 Mindbreak Trap
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Blood Moon
3 Disenchant
1 Chalice of the Void
1 Goblin king

The changes I would make would be -1 Goblin King, -1 Chalice of the Void, -1 Blood Moon, +3 Burrenton Forgetender. As usual disenchant/swords were awesome...the three times I've played goblins (Rb 3-4, Rw 5-2 twice) I've wanted disenchant in at least two matchups. My matches went: ubg countertop 2-1, 4c counterbalance w/ firespout 1-2, burn 1-2, new horizons 2-0, gbr survival 2-0, probant 2-0, rb goblins 2-0.

[GoboLord]

Hi guys,

I'm in doing some statistics and I need your help.
I need you estimates about certain MUs of Goblins. If you want to help me, please click on the link below and fanswer 7 questions about Goblins' MUs.

Survey

Thank you!

[Neuad]

// Lands
4 [R] Badlands
4 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
4 [MPR] Wasteland
2 [U] Taiga
6 [ON] Mountain (3)
2 [JGC] Wooded Foothills

// Creatures
3 [LE] Gempalm Incinerator
4 [US] Goblin Lackey
4 [7E] Goblin Matron
4 [ON] Goblin Piledriver
4 [AP] Goblin Ringleader
4 [SC] Goblin Warchief
2 [M10] Siege-Gang Commander
2 [PLC] Stingscourger
1 [M10] Goblin Chieftain
1 [CHK] Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 [LRW] Wort, Boggart Auntie
1 [MOR] Lightning Crafter
1 [ON] Goblin Sharpshooter
1 [AT] Goblin Tinkerer

// Spells
4 [DS] AEther Vial
2 [MOR] Warren Weirding

// Sideboard
SB: 3 [6E] Perish
SB: 4 [LRW] Thorn of Amethyst
SB: 2 [AL] Pyrokinesis
SB: 3 [GP] Leyline of the Void
SB: 3 [M11] Back to Nature

That is the final list I've settled on for now.

61st card is Goblin Tinkerer to help even more vs the mirror and merfolk. . .and possibly the random problem artifact that crops up such as an ensnaring bridge, a chalice at 1 early on, 3sphere etc.

I disagree with Kiki Jiki being 'win more' all the time. I have won many games on the back of him alone, weather it be tutoring up the right answer with Matron, drawing more cards with Ringleader, bouncing that one blocker I cant deal with at beginning of upkeep before scourger goes. . . I would never cut him out of my list.

[lotriderm]

I'm running MonoR goblins and I have recently ran into some trouble against UGR Countertop (http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=34659).

Does anyone have any trouble with this matchup or is it just me?

[Avatara]

I disagree with Kiki Jiki being 'win more' all the time. I have won many games on the back of him alone, weather it be tutoring up the right answer with Matron, drawing more cards with Ringleader, bouncing that one blocker I cant deal with at beginning of upkeep before scourger goes. . . I would never cut him out of my list.

I second that.

[Mantis]

I second that.

You could have won those games with Siege Gang as well, seriously.