[DTB] Sneak Attack

[Esper3k]

how could you be unhappy with preordain? that card is great in this deck. with most decks running 18/19 land and 4 petals the preordains in my deck always help me get there. Gitaxian probe is a card that I've always hated. For the most part its a card that lets you know if its ok to go off, and draw a card. Id rather not pay the 2 life since Im already paying plenty with fetches, tombs, fow, Gmoney. Every extra life payment is 1 less Gdraw.

Against decks that Id be worried about whats in their hand its almost always going feel like Im paying 2 to see that they have disruption. If I dont already have the ability to protect my Show into sneak, or show into fatty then I dont care what your hand is.. Im waiting.

the card Im most unhappy with in the deck is intuition, and Im highly considering cutting the 2 intuitions myself. With how much I worry about top based decks, Im considering running a sneaky think twice, or thought scour to punch the top setup.

I'm unhappy with Preordain because I keep wishing it was Brainstorm / Ponder :)

Really, it just doesn't dig enough for me, which was why I've been starting to consider Impulse.

Regarding Probe: It's mainly there to tell you if your Show & Tell is safe or not (ie, do they have a Knight / Drake / something that will push in your shit). I think even casting it the turn before with U (if you're worried about paying the 2 life) is fine if all you're trying to do is see if the way is clear.

[Water_Wizard]

@ Koby - what are your current flex slots? I read in the Miracle Control board you are running 2 Spell Pierce/Flusterstorm (I assume this is inclusive, not two of each). This led me to wonder what else you were running? 3 Misdirection and 2 Intuition? You are on the 10 cantrip plan, I was just wondering what else you are running main (besides the 23 mana, 8 creature, 8 business, 10 cantrip, 4 FOW spells I already know about)?

I plan to change my sideboard (from page 59) -2 Submerges to +2 Pyroclasm to deal with Elves, BW, Thalia and other random small creature decks that have been popping up on MODO.

[Koby]

The only recent change I'm trying is -2 SPierce +2 Flusterstorm as a way to hedge my game against Reanimator (Entomb/reanimate/counter-war that ensues). The list hasn't changed from what I posted 3 weeks ago aside from the changeout in 1cc counterspell.

[rxavage]

The only recent change I'm trying is -2 SPierce +2 Flusterstorm as a way to hedge my game against Reanimator (Entomb/reanimate/counter-war that ensues). The list hasn't changed from what I posted 3 weeks ago aside from the changeout in 1cc counterspell.

You won't regret the change. I'm currently running 3 Flusterstorm and seriously contemplating going to 4, I'm just not sure if it's completely necessary.

[csy]

4 flusterstorm is about as overboard as you can legally go. A buddy of mine (you know who you are) said something that totally switched my game plan for piloting SnT.

'Maybe we're just playing differently. Im only interested in countering spells that stop me from going off, now slowing down my opponent'

and he's right I was. Im used to playing reanimator where you play a little more of a control game when you need too, and in fact SnT doesnt care about playing the control game.

[Koby]

'Maybe we're just playing differently. Im only interested in countering spells that stop me from going off, not slowing down my opponent'

More or less, ya.

[rxavage]

4 flusterstorm is about as overboard as you can legally go. A buddy of mine (you know who you are) said something that totally switched my game plan for piloting SnT.

'Maybe we're just playing differently. Im only interested in countering spells that stop me from going off, now slowing down my opponent'

and he's right I was. Im used to playing reanimator where you play a little more of a control game when you need too, and in fact SnT doesnt care about playing the control game.

I made the switch from Reanimator too and stated similar a few pages back, something along the lines of only winning counter wars and Flusterstorm does just that, which is why I'm tempted to run 4. My meta is infested with RUG decks, there is very few non-blue decks. ATM I'm trying out a suite of 4 FoW, 3 misdirection, 3 Flusterstorm. I've thought of replacing the MisD's with Daze although I'm hesitant because I only get to really playtest one night a week and I don't like losing games I don't have to.


BTW, anyone going to GenCon Indy? A few of my buddies and I are planning on driving out. I've never been, how is it?

[Esper3k]

4 flusterstorm is about as overboard as you can legally go. A buddy of mine (you know who you are) said something that totally switched my game plan for piloting SnT.

'Maybe we're just playing differently. Im only interested in countering spells that stop me from going off, now slowing down my opponent'

and he's right I was. Im used to playing reanimator where you play a little more of a control game when you need too, and in fact SnT doesnt care about playing the control game.

Yeah exactly - when we have effectively 7+ Force of Will, we can just go off with odds that we have a much better chance of having Force than they do.

Especially against RUG, whose counters primarily consist of taxing effects like Spell Pierce & Daze, you can play around those and worry pretty much only about Force.

Also, I've found that unless they open a super aggressive hand (T1: Delver, T2 Goyf, etc.) we tend to have time to push through a Show & Tell to just trump whatever they have.

[JJ-JKidd]

Omniscience?

[Esper3k]

@rxavage: I'll be going to GenCon again this year (6th year going). Honestly, it's ways been a lot of fun for me. The sheer number of MTG events is pretty nuts, but just all the other games and things to see & do is awesome as well. If it's not too late, I'd recommend getting a hotel that's within walking distance of the convention center so you and your friends can come and go at your own schedules (there are events around the clock). Having your badges FedEx'd to you is also worth it so you don't have to spend a lot of time waiting in line to get them.


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Did some more testing last night and I may have to start playing Pyroclasm or something in the board for Maverick. Post board, that matchup is just tougher than I'd like it to be. I have not liked Through the Breach against Maverick since between Thalia and Teeg, it's just too unreliable. Even Blood Moon isn't a guarantee out due to Pridemages.

The matchup is still favorable, but not the ass beating I'd like it to be. Anyone have any suggestions on board cards?

[Deez_Naughts]

Omniscience?

It turns a two card combo, into a three card combo. Not playable in Sneak-Show.

[catmint]

=========================
Did some more testing last night and I may have to start playing Pyroclasm or something in the board for Maverick. Post board, that matchup is just tougher than I'd like it to be. I have not liked Through the Breach against Maverick since between Thalia and Teeg, it's just too unreliable. Even Blood Moon isn't a guarantee out due to Pridemages.

The matchup is still favorable, but not the ass beating I'd like it to be. Anyone have any suggestions on board cards?

As already discussed earlier in the thread pithing needle is the best SB option vs. Maverick. Phillip played 25 games with needle and 25 with blood moon to compare which one does a better job against maverick and it was clear in the favour of needle.

The reason is that you can needle karakas & pridemage depending on whats best at the moment and you do not have to "jump through hoops" to get the blood moon out, so playing neelde in the combo turn or 1 turn before does not slow you down.

I dont like removal in the board since it is really only good vs. elves, but pithing needle does work vs. Liliana, Jace, SD.top, Belcher and a lot of other random stuff coming your way.

In a maverick heavy metagame i would put 4 needle in the SB!

[S1N1STER]

I am wondering if I should spend any $ on a couple Japanese Homeward Path, if I start running into Gilded Drake I might give it a try.

[Water_Wizard]

Someone suggested Brand a few days ago. Probably a better option due to the cycling, instant ability, and wasteland-ability-proof. This deck really only wants colorless lands that produce double mana. And, you can buy Brand in Korean, because it's Urza's Saga.

And, the even better part about Brand is that you still get to keep the Drake! (I'm not a rules expert, but because Brand says "you" and Homeward Path says "each player," I think Brand let's you keep the Gilded Drake, while Homeward Path would switch both.)

[Cyrandir]

I agree that Homeward Path is probably not the optimal choice. For Gilded Drake, I think the discussion should be between Stifle and Brand.

Stifle stops the Drake's cip trigger, is blue (pitch to FoW/Misdirection), and is generally more useful.

Brand gets your creature back, cycles, and keeps the drake, but is red (no pitch).

Both are 1cmc instants, so no speed difference.

I think I would generally come down on the side of Stifle. I don't care if they keep their 3/3 flyer and would rather have a utility card that I can pitch to FoW/Misdirection over a cycle. If I'm missing some important aspect of this, someone please let me know.

[Koby]

The thread has taken a turn for the stupid.

REB and Pyroblast already answer Gilded Drake and Sower of Temptation right now. We bring them in against Blue decks (that, OMG!) play blue cards. Stifle has some merit against Karakas no doubt, but Blood Moon and Sneak Attack already beat that strategy.

Let's NOT discuss Brand please. As much as I love packing the deck with Saga rares and calling this Mono-Saga.dec, we shouldn't be boarding into Crater Hellion. At least not to beat Gilded Drake

[Cyrandir]

How does pyro/REB answer Gilded Drake? Destroying the Drake doesn't return control to you.

Does fine for Sower of Temptation.

[Telperion]

When Gilded Drake enters the battlefield, exchange control of Gilded Drake and up to one target creature an opponent controls. If you don't make an exchange, sacrifice Gilded Drake. This ability can't be countered except by spells and abilities. (This effect lasts indefinitely.)

The exchange must happen for them to get your critter. If you blast the drake before the exchange trigger resolves, they do not get your Emrakul.

[Water_Wizard]

Seems like the thread has taken a turn towards 'Established Decks.'

Was S&S a flash in the pan? It hasn't been putting up the numbers it was a few weeks ago.

Under-powered or under-represented?

Did Reanimator take its spot? Having played the Reanimator v. S&S mu, Reanimator is a turn faster and seeks to do the exact same thing Sneak and Show does, only with more disruption (not to mention, Reanimator turns off our Show and Tells.) Thoughs?

[Koby]

Seems like the thread has taken a turn towards 'Established Decks.'

Was S&S a flash in the pan? It hasn't been putting up the numbers it was a few weeks ago.

Under-powered or under-represented?

Did Reanimator take its spot? Having played the Reanimator v. S&S mu, Reanimator is a turn faster and seeks to do the exact same thing Sneak and Show does, only with more disruption (not to mention, Reanimator turns off our Show and Tells.) Thoughs?

Perhaps Reanimator has. Reanimator has a much higher profile of hate than this deck - graveyard is a resource to them. Comparing the Reanimator / SS matchup is like asking who who is favored: ANT vs TES. There is a clear winner, but the likelihood of seeing this matchup is extremely slim. (assuming 10% Reanimator and 8% Sneak Show in the meta... simple math says 0.8% matching - probably higher since both tend to go to the upper tables rather quickly)

If you're comfortable with the matchup being bad, then the matchups are lopsided -

RUG / Maverick - favored
Reanimator - highly unfavored
everything else - bye

EDIT: oh, and this deck can't actually beat a first turn Liliana of the Veil. (Pox... LOL)
EDIT #2: According to TC Decks, Sneak Show is still #4 deck for June.*Subject to change*