I think Grafted Exoskeleton and Argentum Armor sound pretty sweet with Godo. 10 infect counters in 1 swing sounds... lethal.
Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
Get it...? Ass, u, me?
... ffs I was trying to be funny...
@Alexeezay
Did you play the Scapewish list as published on page 86 or did you make changes to be better prepared for the meta?
Currently Playing: Scapefit , Shardless BUG, Team America,
I considered both. Argentum Armor isn't good enough though, as you don't want to spend 12 mana versus 1 mana against swords to plowshares. The thing that puts me off the most is that it's just such a bad top deck. With a cheaper equip cost the card would have been insane and I would definitely run it. Grafted Exoskeleton really depends on the other creatures. For MUD, I'm strictly running SOFI and SOLAS and multiple Batterskulls. You really want to just grab a Batterskull or a sword with the right colors in that particular match-up. Have a read in the MUD thread. We've considered literally every equipment card there is.Originally Posted by Qweerios
Batterskull + Godo = 6 mana for 14 life link and 14 combat damage at most.
Godo + SOFI = 6+2 mana for10 combat damage and 2 cards + 4 direct damage + protection against Jace and Bolt (and resistance to terminus/STP)
Godo + SOLAS = 6+2 mana for 10 damage, protection against Batterskull + Swords to Plowshares + 6 life + 2* raise dead
Compare that to grafted exoskeleton. Same manacost, (6+2), turns Godo into Blightsteel Colossus, but it doesn't protect him! He does not have trample nor does he have first strike. A knight will simply kill him. It 'looks' broken, and it is when it works, but it is such a fragile combination that I don't think it is worth it. Also, would you rather topdeck an exoskeleton or a sword of X/Y considering your creature base?
The only other equipment I actually considered for MUD (not for nic fit) is Moonssilver spear. We also flirted with Grappling Hook and Sword of Vengeance in that build but the first is too cute and the latter I haven't really gotten around to testing yet.
So i played with the Rector version this weekend in a small 9-man tourney going 3-2.
I played almost the same list as i did for the GP except -1 Fleshbag Marauder -1 Fierce Empath +1 Swords to Plowshares +1 Vindicate.
Overall the deck was quite good, however i did notice that it felt somewhat threat-light, often having fairly good control over the game but not finding something to properly finish the game with.
I did fall in love with my Rectors again and managed to get 2 Japanese Rectors off the trader there :)
Pardon my ignorance, I see many lists using Volrath's Stronghold, but rarely ever Genesis, can anyone explain why that might be the case?seems like a small price to pay to get card into hand rather than on top library.
To me the list seems kind of awkward as it is, I dont understand the need of 4x wish with the current SB. From your sideboard I think Damnation is ok, but why all those other wish targets?
@Bruizar
You arlready mentioned Godo in this thread as well at page 100 though not for nic fit.
Clearly Godo was a sleeper and has been discussed throughly, as for Nic Fit Im sre he will fit in perfectly in some builts. why not play multiple batterskulls and a singleton recurring nightmare, or even an Anger. The current list of querios has this:
=2 Maelstrom Pulse (is this just spot removal? for cmc3 and sorcery speed this doesnt seem good imo
=4 Pernicious Deed (blows up: Dryad Arbor//(tokens) Garruk, Primal Hunter/ Huntmaster of the Fells/Thragtusk
the PDeed seems really out of place in this built. Why not play enginered explosives instead? Splach 2 duals and ramp up to 5
=1 Umezawa's Jitte (Jitte is a great equipment, though why not play evasive/protective instead?)
=4-Burning Wish ()
4 Red Elemental Blast (not a wish target I assume)
4 Thoughtseize (might be needed in some occassions, I geuss its for SB combo)
1 Reanimate (what do you want to reanimate in turn 3?)
1 Damnation (I agree with this)
1 Cranial Extraction (isnt this to slow? wha do you want to extract?)
1 Haunting Echoes (for why?)
1 Flashfire (because you are running veteran explorer?)
1 Tsunami (same as Flashfire)
1 Maelstrom Pulse
To be honest, I don't see a reason to run Burning Wish at all if you aren't on the Scapeshift plan. I understand Tsunami and Damnation, but I clearly don't like the rest. Tapping out for Burning Wish to tap out for Cranial Extraction to prevent Show and Tell from happening just seems too slow against decks with Ancient Tombs / Lotus Petals. They are obviously going to ramp quicker than you. Even if you do manage to pull of Burning Wish, they can see it coming from miles ahead and just cantrip into counter magic if they don't have it already. I would rather play 4*Kederekt Leviathan and just put that into play from their show and tell, instead of the plan you are on now. I think that should solve SnT.
I'm actually not sure if K. Leviathan solves it. If Leviathan is put into play through SnT, either Omniscience or Griselbrand is put into play. The trigger of Leviathan is put onto the stack and occurs after priority is taken by the SnT player (i think?). The player can then still put Griselbrands activation on the stack, but the griselbrand will go back to his hand so that doesn't matter. The question is, what if Omniscience is put into play? Will the player still be able to put an Emrakul on the stack for free before the Omniscience is bounced? Maybe someone with more rules knowledge can help?
Last time I checked, Emrakul didn't have Flash, so no, he couldn't respond to a trigger by casting Emmy. Unless they boarded in some sick tech with Leyline of Anticipation!
Emrakul is a creature, creatures are played at sorcery speed. You cannot respond to something on the stack with a sorcery. Being free doesn't make it not cast at sorcery speed, so Omniscience would be bounced to their hand.
On the other hand, Kederekt Leviathan actually sounds kind of amazing..? Drop it in, bounce their board, play Recurring Nightmare, swing, you tempo-lock them out of the game. It deals with planeswalkers, it deals with creatures, it deals with enchantments, it's very Nic-Fittey in the sense that it's massive board removal.
Well, that should solve the problem then. The only thing they can possibly do is show and tell griselbrand, pay a bunch of life to draw into a new show and tell and try it again, at which point you might be able to race.
That card is insane Bruizar. It does solve all problems you might be facing, where Pdeed might fail.
Further more it can 'recure' itself.
In some cases I see where you want to Unearth Kederekt, bounce the board and then flashback a therapy to sniper the nemesis out of the opponents hand.
I browsed through all 6+ drop blue creatures that might fit in Nic Fit, three biggest candidates were:
Kederekt Leviathan
Keiga, the Tide Star
Damia, Sage of Stone
Leviathan feels like the most relevant. In a Gifts build with Recurring Nightmare's that card just seems unstoppable.
Yeah, Intuition / Gifts likes the unearth.
If you have two of them in your hand, there is no way SnT can win against you, since the second one bounces the first one, and they can't counter it.
You can also do this.
Intuition for 3 Kederekt Leviathan. Keep 1 for show and tell. Wait for show and tell to resolve putting into play Kederekt from hand, then on your turn Unearth a Kederekt from your graveyard, bounce your other Leviathan and wait for the next Show and Tell :-).
Yes so you would play 1 mainboard and 2 sideboard versus Show and Tell
With phantasmal Image you are already running 2/3 virtual Leviathans, which makes the deck also game one already even more resilent versus Show and Tell due to a 'hardlock'
Perhaps Thragtusk though I am not really fond of that card, I haven't checked others at this moment though... it's an option.
My curent lists looks like this, though not tuned at all because for me it has been two years of actually playing:
1xDryad Arbor
4xVeteran Explorer
1xPalinchron
3xEternal Witness
1xScavening Ooze
1xPhantasmal Image
1xGigapede
1xHymn to Tourach
1xUnburial Rites
2xDiablic Intent
3xIntuition
4xGitaxian Probe
4xCabal Therapy
1xRecurring Nightmare
1xUnearth
4xGreen Sun's Zenith
1xChord of Calling
3xPernicious Deed
1xGaddock Teeg
1xKederekt Leviathan
1xLiving Wish
2xBrainstorm
SB
Loaming Shaman
Iona, Shield of Emeria
Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
3x Carpet of Flowers
2xKederekt Leviathan
Sylval Safekeeper
2x Krosan Grip
2x Ethersworn Canonist
Obviously this needs quite some polish in the numbers.
And I need to add 4xMeddling Mage
Leviathan makes Animate Deadpretty sick as well
Dance of Many Has potential with the Populate mechanic though it's UU
To be clear, I made the Godoblade list off the top of my head, so it's not so great. I too think that Burning Wish doesn't belong in there, Punishing Fire seems more appropriate. It hoses aggro and Stoneblade and Planeswalkers quite convincingly. I think Deed belongs in Jund Fit as well. Huntmaster is 4 CMC, therefore he is considered out of Deed Range, and taking tokens along while wiping the board isn't crippling at all, it usually leaves you at an advantage. In fact, Garruk has great synergy with Deed, not the opposite... Dryad is mostly there for the secondary Godo equipment. I kinda like Argentum Armor right now because it turns every single Explorer/tokens/Witness into a lategame bomb. Turning your puny creatures on that draw into 7/7+ Vindicate swingers is sweet.
As for Genesis instead of Volrath, It doesn't even cost 1 more to cast because you have to tap Volrath itself to bring something back on top, therefore cumulating to 2B mana! I think that the reason I did not play Genesis instead of Volrath Tower before is because I transitioned from BG Nic Fit with Primeval Titan to Gifts Fit, and to think that I used to play Gifts Rock with Genesis too...
Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
Get it...? Ass, u, me?
... ffs I was trying to be funny...
And maybe because the Stronghold is actually good. It doesn't have to be in your graveyard and even taps for mana in a pinch. It operates at instant speed as opposed to making you use your mana on your upkeep. You know. Stuff like that.
The ability to sac something (like Kokopuffs or even like thragtuk) via tower in response to a plow or terminus then using stronghold to put it back. Livin' the dream....
Or what happened in my case Sunday playing against Dredge. He has an Elesh Norn and nothing else...I have a finks in my yard with a stronghold out. That was just awesome.
Now I have and: Problem solved!
My built needs tweaking and I need allot of playtesting and finetuning again, so many misplays and the deck is not optimal yet.
Especially the mana base.
Probably need a 4th intuition, and perhaps even a singleton carefull study as it fixes a little draw and its a great discard outlet.
I have added Animate Dead, so that cards lets me either: (recurring) Clear board 2CMC / get Palinhron to ramp mana / post sb, get iona/elesh norn
What kills me are my misplays and unsufficient meta knowlage, so that is two times me, Im sure anyone else would play much better at this moment
You can also save your creatures from death via Tower when you have Genesis in your GY. The instant speed on Volrath serves very few purposes;
-the first being EoT recursion to have 2-3 additional mana on your main phase;
-the second being proction from GY hate.
Ironicaly enough, it doesn't help much against most forms of GY hate. Ooze can exile or re-exile in response to a Volrath activation. Crypts and the likes can exile ur entire GY in response to an activation as well, and Extraction is mostly used on the Volrath target.
When compared to Genesis, it is a matter of:
-What Gift pile is better, the one involving Genesis or the one involving Volrath;
-Would you rather keep drawing cards while activating the recursion (Genesis) or forfeit your draw step in favor of recursion that is harder to disrupt
I think Genesis is better when you want to use the engine as a mean of producing card advantage while Volrath is better when sealing a match mostly depends on the success of the recursion.
Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
Get it...? Ass, u, me?
... ffs I was trying to be funny...
The List:
4x Veteran Explorer
2x Eternal Witness
3x Academy Rector
1x Baneslayer Angel
1x Thragtusk
1x Sigarda, Host of Herons
1x Sun Titan
(1x Gaddock Teeg)
(1x Kitchen Finks)
(1x Scavenging Ooze)
(1x Thrun, the Last Troll)
17
3x Pernicious Deed
1x Recurring Nightmare
1x Phyrexian Arena
1x Faith's Fetters
3x Sensei's Divining Top
1x Swords to Plowshares
4x Cabal Therapy
3x Green Sun's Zenith
1x Vindicate
1x Maelstrom Pulse
(1x Eladamri's Call)
(1x Diabolic Intent)
21
2x Phyrexian Tower
3x Bayou
1x Savannah
1x Scrubland
3x Forest
3x Plains
2x Swamp
1x Windswept Heath
3x Verdant Catacombs
(1x Volrath's Stronghold)
(2x Marsh Flats)
22
//SB
3x Carpet of Flowers
2x Extirpate
1x Enlightened Tutor
1x Humility
1x Curse of Death's Hold
(2x Leyline of the Void)
(2x Leyline of Sanctity)
(1x Vampire Hexmage)
(1x engineered Plague)
(1x Pernicious Deed)
() is stuff not from the primal list
SCGMinn
Round 1: Jessie (RUG Delver)
Game 1: I end up getting down to 4 before a sun titan/deed lock comes down.
In: 2 Carpet Out: Teeg, Fetters
Game 2: Delver beats comes in the form of 1/1 for a while, he sided in a surgical (probably saw a rector, first game) and surgicals my only finks. I get arena out which didn't killed before I win baneslayer and an ooze.
1-0 (2-0)
Round 2: Shiny (Rug Delver) Shiny, is a local guy, who I have met before, nice guy.
Game 1: Tusk happens and deed wins.
In: 3x Carpet
Game 2: I misplay horribly with my sun titan and go way too aggro with my rector.
Game 3: Goes to time after he steals my baneslayer with a gilded drake and I'm forced deed it away. Probably should have won.
1-0-1 (3-1-1)
Round 3: NOS aka Stephen Hink aka Std Winner
Feature Match! I remembered he played RUG in KC, so I was hopeful again. Not as lucky. (u/w Miracles with counterbalance)
Game 1: I get some early explorer beats in, while he sets up with skull and jace. He has a stoneforge in play while I decide what to get with my intent....I chose titan over swords. I chose wisely. He entreats for 3. I titan back the deed and win.
In: Carpet x3, Deed Out: Baneslayer?, Tusk, Finks, Ooze
Game 2: He never got anything going while I had an arena and top out. Sacing big fatties to avoid terminus is fun. Beats happen.
2-0-1 (6-1-1)
Round 4: Mark Grupa (Dredge)
Game 1: I see undiscovered paradise and pretty much know what I'm playing against.
He stalls on a dredge or 2, while I zenith for an ooze. Pretty much over then.
In: Leyline of the Void x2, Extirpate x 2
Game 2: I keep a deed, swamp, explorer, void, + stuff. I kept on the strength of the void. Bad void. I got void, he goes nature's claim. I brick on lands for a couple turns while he setups with bridges. He ends wiping my board with a dread return on norn. While I have a explorer out. I play my finks and pass. Then Sun titan, bring back finks Then stronghold bring back finks. I attack with titan, bring back deed. Deed for 7. He has 4 cards left in his deck and scoops. Bad keep on my part.
3-0-1 (8-1-1)
Round 5: Matt W. (Rug Delver)
Game 1: Early delver and goyf beats get there.
In: 3 carpets, 1 deed? Out: not sure
Game 2: We durdle until I get out Baneslayer and he scoops.
Game 3: See game 1. :(
3-1-1 (9-3-1)
Round 6: Brandon (mono-blue fairy tempo?)
Game 1: I see island delver and yay inside. Sadly, it never happens. Spellstutter sprite happens, ninja of the deep happens. I don't think I ever got a deed out.
In" Carpet x3, deed Out: call, top, teeg, nightmare
Game 2: Pretty much the same.
3-2-1 (9-5-1)
Round 7: Harrison (bug turbo grow control?)
Game 1: Jace controls the game (but doesn't fate seal me). Delver and dryads beat me.
In: Carpet +3, Hexmage +1 Out: ?
Game 2: More of the same, except he fate seals more this time. Bottoms the hexmage once and puts on a frowning face after he sees it.
3-3-1 (9-7-1)
Round 8: Gio (Maverick)
Game 1: Rough beats early but deed and tusk save the day.
In: +1 deed, +2 extirpate out: Teeg, nightmare, therapy?
Game 2: I get an early ooze out, she can't find an answer quick and baneslayer mops up.
4-3-1 (11-7-1)
Round 9: Brad L (Miracle Control)
Game 1: Long first game...I go to 1 via my own arena but have enough mana to go green sun for tusk and green sun for finks same turn. Baneslayer versus batterskull and he scoops to save time.
Game 2: I die very quickly to batterskull and friends.
Game 3: Clear board but he has a batterskull in play when time is called. Board position sucks , so I just scoop.
4-4-1 (12-9-1)
Thoughts:
Carpet is awesome. 4th deed is good in the board. I'm starting to think I need to run a pridemage main (maybe instead of teeg). Call was awesome again. 2 Towers worked well. Nightmare got sided out a lot. Leylines just seemed bad. Hexmage was cute.
Changes:
Underworld dreams in SB for blue decks/grislebrand? Hexmage/dark depths/urborg plan? Probes in main deck for better therapies?
PS. Rectors are harder the hell to find on modo to test.
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