[Deck] Death and Taxes

[Barbed Blightning]

Has anyone tried Blind Obedience at all. Surely this card was at least discussed but I couldn't really find any serious discussion on it. I realize it's a tempo card and not a creature with abilities on a stick but having your opponents creatures come in tapped does have the potential to be a type of taxing card. Extort certainly could be useful in the mid game onwards. Not so sure we have the mana for it in the early game and if we do, we probably should have mulled.

It feels like it was just passed over

Try it out. Personally, I think better/higher impact cards can and should be played, but if in your testing you find it to be superb, by all means let us know.

(Sent from my phone, please ignore typos and grammar errors)

[DavidHernandez]

Has anyone tried Blind Obedience at all. Surely this card was at least discussed but I couldn't really find any serious discussion on it. I realize it's a tempo card and not a creature with abilities on a stick but having your opponents creatures come in tapped does have the potential to be a type of taxing card. Extort certainly could be useful in the mid game onwards. Not so sure we have the mana for it in the early game and if we do, we probably should have mulled.

It feels like it was just passed over

It was not passed over. I ran it in my board for a while, but it had such narrow, limited use that I dropped it. What's it good against? Elves? Really not much else. Grafdigger's Cage was much better and it also hit Graveyard decks. If you want to run something like it for testing, use Imposing Sovereign. At least you get a 2/1 body that works with Vial.

[Technicolor Mage]

I was going to test imposing sovereign as well. I thought extort might have some significance which is why blind obedience looked alright to me. Was extort ever significant?

[The Duck!!]

I don't think you'll be casting spells that much during mid-late game because you'll be vialing in your creatures and probably controlling his lands via ports.


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[Barook]

Looks like we got a solution to TNN with Conspiracy, guys:



Can also be used to get rid of our pro-guys like Mom, however. But with all the -1/-1 effects around, that seems like a minor issue.

It can also permantenly kill off annoying Planeswalkers like Liliana or Jace.

Good times, good times!

[Barbed Blightning]

Looks like we got a solution to TNN with Conspiracy, guys:



Can also be used to get rid of our pro-guys like Mom, however. But with all the -1/-1 effects around, that seems like a minor issue.

It can also permantenly kill off annoying Planeswalkers like Liliana or Jace.

Good times, good times!

3 issues:

1) WW1 is quite expensive to cast, even in a deck sporting as tough a mana base as ours. It's even more expensive with Thalia out.

2) due to its price tag, TNN tempo's counters can more easily snag it. They may cut Pierces, but depending on if they are playing or drawing, Daze can still be a factor. And even though Tempo is not a primary factor in how we play, if they manage to counter it and we are getting pummeled, we'll have more or less put ourselves in a corner for that turn.


3) my biggest concern: it's a sorcery. Yes it can be a haymaker, but it is going to impact our Ports, Wastes and Karakas tricks by its very nature.

I would sooner play celestial flare: its cheaper, faster and punishes your brainless opponents (while disrupting your savvy ones just by the mere threat of it.

(Sent from my phone, please ignore typos and grammar errors)

[mrjumbo03]

Re: new card, it says each player votes for a nonland stuff you don't control. So it means that your opponent can't pick something of yours right? If yes, then it's awesome.

[nevilshute]

3 issues:

1) WW1 is quite expensive to cast, even in a deck sporting as tough a mana base as ours. It's even more expensive with Thalia out.

2) due to its price tag, TNN tempo's counters can more easily snag it. They may cut Pierces, but depending on if they are playing or drawing, Daze can still be a factor. And even though Tempo is not a primary factor in how we play, if they manage to counter it and we are getting pummeled, we'll have more or less put ourselves in a corner for that turn.


3) my biggest concern: it's a sorcery. Yes it can be a haymaker, but it is going to impact our Ports, Wastes and Karakas tricks by its very nature.

I would sooner play celestial flare: its cheaper, faster and punishes your brainless opponents (while disrupting your savvy ones just by the mere threat of it.

(Sent from my phone, please ignore typos and grammar errors)

These are my concerns too. With Thalia out this effectively is a spot removal at sorcery speed. I like that it gives us an out to Progenitus but all in all I think it's going to be too clunky. Think Miracles will be likely to get this to work.

[Barook]

Costing 3 (or 4 mana with Thalia) might be a concern, just as sorcery speed, but that's about it.

It's an unconditional kill spell for any creature, but it can also kill dreaded Planeswalkers like Liliana right on the spot. Being able to get rid of annoying artifacts or enchantments is just the icing on the cake.

I'll try out 2-3 copies in my sideboard for sure since flexibility at a reasonable cost is king.

[Finn]

To see if it is any good think of the card this way: It is an Oblivion Ring that:

1. Can hit True Name Nemesis
2. Can not be undone with something like Pernicious Deed
3. Can hit Nimble Mongoose
4. Can not be fetched with Enlightened Tutor
5. Has a harder color requirement
6. Not handy facing Show and Tell

I dunno folks. Seems good to me. Looks like almost a strict upgrade to a card we don't much use though.

[Tormod]

Yup, 2 in the sideboard.

Upgrade over O-ring

[MrShine]

I know I'm excited to start casting it. Answer to anything, yesplease.

[Megadeus]

Having a nice catch all seems awesome. Worse vs SnT, but it's not like this deck doesnt play 3 Karakas among other cards good against SnT anyway.

[DavidHernandez]

To see if it is any good think of the card this way: It is an Oblivion Ring that:

1. Can hit True Name Nemesis
2. Can not be undone with something like Pernicious Deed
3. Can hit Nimble Mongoose
4. Can not be fetched with Enlightened Tutor
5. Has a harder color requirement
6. Not handy facing Show and Tell

I dunno folks. Seems good to me. Looks like almost a strict upgrade to a card we don't much use though.

This card has me a little confused. It says each player casts a vote. TNN can't be targeted by us, so we can't vote for TNN, can we? Also, it doesn't say the opponent has to choose a different permanent to vote for, so they can vote for the same one you do, effectively losing only one permanent.

How can it hit Nimble Mongoose, which has Shroud?
How can it hit Progenitus, with it's "protection from everything"?

How is this better than Wrath of God or Oblivion Ring when if we can't target?

I really don't understand. What am I missing? Is there a ruling that allows us to vote for non-targetable permanents?

Thanks in advance.

Dave

[Tyrio]

Voting isn't targeting, which is why you can hit through shroud and protection. Spells and abilities don't target unless they say target or are auras.

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[Tormod]

Voting =/= Targeting

[DavidHernandez]

Ok, thanks. That's pretty awesome.

[Mr. Froggy]

Having a nice catch all seems awesome. Worse vs SnT, but it's not like this deck doesnt play 3 Karakas among other cards good against SnT anyway.

Even before the spoiler, SnT is almost a bye for D&T.

[Said-In-Contest]

Hi everyone!
I'm playing the deck for a while and I'm finding troubles when i have to side...the point is the deck is so consistent in its maindeck configuration that i find more then challenging to side out the correct cards, always reminding not to break the sinergy berween the MD cards.
So i start from my current list, just to have something to refere to:

LANDS 23
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
12 Plains
3 Karakas

CREATURES 26
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Mother of Runes
4 Phyrexian Revoker
3 Serra Avenger
2 Spirit of the Labyrinth
3 Flickerwisp
1 Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1 Mirran Crusader


4 AEther Vial
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Batterskull
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte


SB: 3 Rest in Peace
SB: 2 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 1 Oblivion Ring
SB: 2 Wilt-Leaf Liege
SB: 1 Pithing Needle
SB: 1 Path to Exile / Sunlance
SB: 1 Enlightened Tutor
SB: 2 Cataclysm
SB: 1 Manriki-Gusari


So, the only thing i know for sure, is that you don't have to overside with this deck, so it will be good to be able to side the minimum ammount of cards as possible...
Then problems start...for exemple, vs team america i'd like to have 3 RiP, 2 Wilt-Leaf and a PtE / Sunlance....but these are 6 cards...how am i supposed to take 6 cards out from a build like that?! :(((((((((((

having that said, can someone help with the sideboarding plans vs the most common decks in the format? Here is the list

Miracles
Team America
Death & Taxes (Mirror)
Deathblade
Sneak And Show
Patriot
Elves
Painter

Just a few to start.
Thank you everyone for the help! I'm asking you because it will be great to hear what a more experienced player than me usually do!!

[dcosiem]

Hello fellow Magic enthusiast or Death and Taxes players,

I consider myself a Legacy amateur. I've been playing this format for about 3 years. I like to think that I know the whole format, and all the cards people use in their decks. For I myself, I play most of the decks in Legacy. Perhaps willing or not, I think at this moment, Death and Taxes seems well ahead of everyone in terms of winning percentage of the field since so many new cards have been added with these new few sets. I don't think anyone can argue this point because Spirit of the Labyrinth or Aegis of the Gods are just too good to not be played in this control, hate-bear deck. Let me give you my point, Spirit of the Labyrinth must be played in this deck because it's so good against all combo/tempo/blue deck strategies. The reasons are self-explanatory--draw 1 card per turn. I'm playing just about 3 in my list I think. I only need 2, but consider it's power, I think an extra one couldn't hurt because it will likely be removed. I think this card is nuts because it serves more purpose than Thalia, which I've put her number down to 2 because simply makes powerful blue decks become fair decks, which for us makes our decks more powerful because we play more advantageous components to our winning strategy. No sir, you cannot Brainstorm at the end of my turn. No sir, you can not Ponder during your turn. No sir, you cannot cast Enter the Infinite to cast Cunning Wish into Release the Ants. No sir, you cannot pay 7 life to draw 7 cards to counter Swords to Plowshare on your Griselbrand.

I'm also going to add another point. I have 1 Ghost Quarter in my deck because I play Aven Mindscensor, which will sometimes causes my opponents to miss retrieving a basic land about 50% of the times. I also consider running 1 because the fact that so many decks play nothing but dual lands, that even destroying 1 land can cause them to retrieve no land because they don't run basics.

For any odd measure of occurrence in random deck tech, I'm running a single Chrome Mox on top my 23 land decks because even sometimes I feel that this deck still needs more than 23 lands especially during it's opening draw because sometimes I'll be stuck with non-castable cards due to non-white producing lands. That is the cost of using Wastelands and Rishadan Ports, but overall it's a good strategy when our control lock is on board.

I'm coming to agree that this deck is simply a control deck because Thaila, Revoker, Spirit of L, and Aven simply stops our opponent from executing their strategy.

Thank you for your patience. I hope you enjoy my post.

Dan