I guess I board out the third Volcanic instead of the second Plains against Elves now.
2nd place @ Local 8 man on Saturday Night. Learning: patience is a virtue.
Deck List is Ein's most recent build. I realize there are board plans on Ein's primer, but I didn't have access to it and tried to suss out strategies as I went.
Played: BUG Lands, Charolbelcher, RUG Delver
Rd. 1: John Williams playing BUG Lands
He managed to resolve Crucible and Exploration G1 and get his Marit Lage combo online. I knew I could prolong the game and try to find an answer, but I chose to concede, as time would end up being an issue, and I wanted to get the other games in.
Game 2, I resolved an early Jace that he couldn't answer. An ultimate later, and a timely Terminus through his last turn Marit Lage cleaned the game up. All game he was taking out my basics with recurring ghost quarters, and I managed to utilize my last white source to land a rest in peace, stopping his shenanigans.
Game 3, Keranos got there. That card is crazy good. Clique saved me from his 20/20 and let me close out the game.
My board plan took a long game approach, and a board control approach. This is as close to what I remember boarding:
IN:
2x EE, 1x Keranos, 2x Vendilion Clique, 1x Disenchant, 1x Council's Judgement, 2x Rest in Peace
OUT:
2x Counterspell, 2x Counterbalance, 2x Swords to Plowshares, 1x Snapcaster Mage, 1x Force of Will
Rd. 2: Aaron O'Connor playing Goblin Charolbelcher
I was pretty sure of what he was on, because someone in the room decided to be a dick and ask him how he was doing with Charolbelcher. I mulled for a force of will game 1, and it sealed the deal. Game 2, I mulled to 5 looking for one, but kept Flusterstorm, Ponder, Brainstorm, Island, Scalding Tarn. He didn't go off turn 1, and I drew into a set of forces. Yes. 4 of em.
The board plan was to become as reactive as possible, while still allowing me to get CB online. One of the worse things you can do in these matchups is slam CB on turn 2 without knowing what's on top, specifically if you have a flusterstorm or counterspell in hand. You want to stay as reactive as possible, and never give your opponent an opening.
IN:
2x Flusterstorm, 2x Vendilion Clique, 2x EE
OUT:
2x Terminus, 2x Swords to Plowshares, 2x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Rd. 3, Mark MacGregor playing RUG Delver
Game 1, he lands a mongoose, and I dig and dig, and never find a terminus, council's Judgement or a snapcaster mage. It ends up single-handedly taking me down.
Game 2, he goes goyf. I swords it, he goes goyf. I terminus it, he goes goyf. Well, shit. I make a HUGE misplay next, which is why I had a learning, and mainphase a clique to try to clear the way for a Rest in Peace. I had more than enough mana that he couldn't soft counter my RIP if I had just jammed it, and he had already played 2x forces that game. I ended up cliqueing away a spell pierce, which he replaced with the topdeck brainstorm, and I proceed to get rolled.
Had I waited a turn, or just jammed the RIP, he likely would have lost in the long run, given the sheer number of lands I had in play, and I would have nerfed his beater.
Sideboard plan here was to try to deal with his threats as efficiently as possible, and protect mine. Also, I wanted to minimize his LD plan, thus I brought in zero red cards, keeping the 4x swords.
IN:
2x Engineered Explosives, 1x Council's Judgement, 2x Rest in Peace, 2x Flusterstorm
OUT:
4x Force of Will, 2x Counterspell, 1x Counterbalance
Conclusion
I think, overall, I like the way I boarded, and I really like the build. I do think I need to become a more patient player, and I can't let the psychological pressure of a threat on the board make me make hasty decisions. Use shuffle effects wisely, save what you can for the late game, and know how to manage your life total. If taking an extra hit from a goyf is the difference between resolving or not resolving a RIP, you likely want to wait it out, as long as you stay out of bolt range ;)
I look forward to future events with this deck.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
Hi guys,
I don't really post on these forums but you might know me from my stream over at twitch.tv/mattiasnl
Recently I've had a lot of success with my thopter miracles deck so I figured I'd post it here.
The deck uses the thopter foundry + sword of the meek combo along with maindeck stoneforge mystics to substantially improve the miracles, bug and d&t matchups.
I am currently 26-3 in matches on magic online with the following list:
4 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Entreat the Angels
2 Ponder
2 Terminus
4 Brainstorm
1 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
2 Spell Pierce
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Batterskull
4 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Sword of the Meek
2 Thopter Foundry
3 Counterbalance
1 Academy Ruins
1 Arid Mesa
4 Flooded Strand
4 Island
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Plains
2 Polluted Delta
1 Scalding Tarn
4 Tundra
2 Volcanic Island
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Counterbalance
2 Terminus
1 Entreat the Angels
1 Engineered Explosives
4 Leyline of Sanctity
3 Pyroblast
1 Luminarch Ascension
1 Sulfur Elemental
The 4 Leyline of Sanctities are to help in what I feel are pretty bad matchups in storm and burn. Everything else should be fairly self explanatory.
I don't get it. You make podcast(s) with the elf guy who constantly whines about Miracles, complaining about how the MU is not fun, or Top or CB should be banned. This elf guy you hang with is not being constructive when he talks about Miracles.Originally Posted by MattiasNL
Leyline makes little sense to me. It doesn't stop Eidolon, Flame rift, Price, Vortex. Most people would only care about White Leyline because Liliana is rampant at their local meta. If Storm's a problem, most people would just SB in more Canonist or Meddling Mage. Sounds like a waste of 4 SB slots to me. Your list is closer toward the BBD and Blood Moon heavy route, but you don't run it neither. Overall just makes little sense to the paper players, probably would work for MO.
I've never really thought of Burn or storm as bad matchups. CounterTop lock is essentially game over for both decks, and having access to things like flusterstorm and clique out of the board definitely help hedge the bets in our favour.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
Leyline leaves burn with maybe 12-15 relevant cards, 8 of which can be dealt with by leaving in creature removal. Price can be played around fairly well too.
The problem with the storm matchup is that game 1 the only card that beats them is counterbalance and you're not going to mulligan to it in the dark. Then all they have to do is draw the right mix of decay/discard in game 2 or 3 and it's over. Leyline dodges decay and pretty much just wins on the spot. I'm 5-1 in my last 6 matches with storm against miracles, it's a pretty solid matchup without dedicated hate from the miracles deck (no meddling mage does not count, canonist does though).
If storm and burn are not a large percentage of the metagame then I would agree with playing other cards and no leylines.
One thing that does stand out to me regarding this is that you only have 3 counterbalances in the main deck, which I can see leading to a worse matchup against these decks.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
Well the game 1 storm matchup is bad even with 4 counterbalance so I just focus on winning the postboard games. Against burn the maindeck stoneforge mystic -> batterskull (before they have smash to smithereens) more than makes up for the loss of 1 counterbalance.
Yeah, Batterskull is damn near impossible for burn to beat. That being said, Batterskull can help a lot in the storm matchup as well. Every hit you make is an extra 2 spells they need to cast before killing you.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
Yes, but it's never going to connect before turn 4. That's not really storm insurance, more like the perfect window to die in.
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
Why do people (who play Venser) only play one Venser? I find him to great great for all kinds of things. When I play 1 I don't see him in half of games. He is also often killed quickly so I definitely have use of at least 2. I figure that either I play 2 or I play at least 0 - Either I want to see him or I don't.
How is your reasoning when you only play 1?
Venser is not useful when you don't even have 4 lands. How useful is Venser when the storm player is trying to go off before you have 4 lands in play? Now, how easy is it to get to 4 lands? Well..., between Wasteland and Stifle from RUG Delver (and occasional BUG Delver), it's not easy to say the least. There, I just named 2 MUs in which Venser might not matter until it's too late.
Because it's great in some MUs, you can hedge by having 1 in the SB and just bring that one in for those favorable MUs.
Finally ended up playing Miracles at my local game store today. I went 2-2 so not as good as I would like but that's okay since I'm still learning a lot about how to play this beautiful deck. There is one dilemma though. It would appear there were two 12post decks in the room today. Thankfully, I dodged them both. I am worried though if both players are playing at my meta consistently I might not be able to play miracles at my local game store for a little while. Is there anything I can do to shore up 12post or should I just accept it as an autoloss? I'm playing Schonnegger's 75 to start out minus the Keranos for a third Rest in Peace to fight Dredge.
In regards to Legacy:
I have the same issue locally (and a lands deck) so I run Blood Moon and Humility. Oh and I finished building this last night about an hour before kick off. 2/1/1. Was happy with that.
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
12posts:
Blood Moon and keep your hard counters for his Repeal.
This should be enough along with the third Entreat
Just accept 12 post as an autoloss. They have a lot of other bad matchups so, just hope to dodge them. Blood Moons and Humilities don't do a whole lot. They play 4 Repeals and countermagic of their own. Having Vensers + Karakas helps, since you can bounce a land every turn and just dont let them cast primeval titan and they lose. Or sometimes a fast end of turn 4-5 entreat pressures them enough to have to get off the "ignore everything else and get 13 mana + eye of ugin" plan. The matchup will probably never get more 25/75 though.
Blood Moon helps, but only so much. They can still curve into primeval titan, and if they know you have it, they'll likely be fetching forests. Pithing Needle can do some work against both lands and 12-post as well.
One huge problem with the 12-post matchup is that their late game is so much better than ours, and they can absolutely go over-top of us.
I realize this is TOTALLY out of left field and probably absolutely horrible, but if you have a lot of Lands and 12-post decks in your meta, why not adjust your game plan accordingly? See if you can find room in your sideboard for 2x wasteland, 1x Crucible of worlds. Those along with a quick clock from, say, vendilion clique, and the card selection you get from Ponder, Brainstorm, and Top should be able to help you slowly cut their mana down.
OR, maybe try a 1-of Dwarven Miner or Ruination?
Dwarven Miner actually seems kinda spicy, besides needing him to stick around for a full turn to do anything, and dying to punishing fire.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
I've never even been matched against a 12-post deck, but In Modern, I board in 2 Aven Mindcensor against Tron. The frustrating thing with Eye of Ugin decks is that the Eldrazi packages were designed to beat countermagic. You have to clock them if you can't outscale them, so I try to make sure my sideboard cards for that matchup can attack for damage. I think the Legacy Ugin decks might even be weaker than the Modern ones to Mindcensor; their entire deck revolves around abusing search effects. Of course, even with them only searching the top 4 they're still 17% to hit an Eldrazi with 46 cards left in deck, so be prepared to do a lot of swearing.
You beat me to the idea. It's never a bad idea to board in Flash and Flying creatures, since most decks would just SB-out Bolts and Swords when they see Miracles. Since they cannot Blast/Spell Pierce this bad boy, you are almost guaranteed to hit your opponent's Liliana/Jace when you play it EoT. Oh, and it's an emergency blocker against a Flipped Delver, can't do that with Snapcaster.
If you are seriously concerned about 12post in your meta this is the card you should be playing. Not Moon. Ruination is also great against GBx decks, MUD and other random stuff.
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