I'm going to call this deck Brainfart. Basically it's a combo deck involving Grand Architect and Pili-Pala to generate infinite mana and mill them through Blue Sun's Zenith. If anything I can also use Increasing Confusion if needed through the graveyard/flashback. And if anything, I can draw 40 for my own deck and beat counter wars. I think it's a bit slow, and I don't know how to stop something like Pithing Needle. Don't know where to fit in any creature hate either. With enough digging, and unlimited mana, it can go off turn 4. Which is a bit slow... so any suggestions to make it one turn faster?
Anyways here's the most updated deck.
//Lands
10 Island
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Chrome Mox
//Spells
2 Blue Sun's Zenith
4 Brainstorm
3 Treasure Cruise
4 Force of Will
4 Ponder
3 Daze
3 Spell Pierce
2 Pact of Negation
4 Misdirection
1 Increasing Confusion
//Creatures
4 Grand Architect
4 Pili-Pala
Last edited by Jacemindbreak; 11-10-2014 at 10:09 PM. Reason: Changed the Name after suggestions
Cut the Braingeyser and play 4 Zeniths..
That allows you to win Instant speed as soon as you get priority and both creatures are on the field. Braingeyser doesn't allow you to alt win
Can't you target the opponent and make him draw 60? Or screw it since the deck gives you unlimited mana in the first place and it doesn't matter? Fetchlands with Brainstorm or do you think it's unneeded?Originally Posted by Poron
And I'm thinking of putting Chrome Mox to speed it up a bit.
Agree, instant speed is a must IMO; if you're in all-blue and infinite mana of any color, you may as well.
Second, I think since your infinite mana is colored, you should have a secondary win condition. I'd consider looking at Omnitell's win cons (Eldrazi, Release the Ants combo, Lab Man)
Third, you should note that you're vulnerable to everything but Land hate basically. Pact of Negation is a must, Fetches for Brainstorm are a must, more Cantrips (since you didn't max BS) would be good. I'd drop Cruise, Depths to do the above.
I'd then consider a non-targetted win condition as a 1-of, like Exsanguinate (possibly in the side as a wish-board or some such.)
Basically. Copy what Omni-tell does and then do it your own way. You don't have Halls, Omni, Enter, or Show clogging the deck, but you do have Zeniths, Pila, and Architects; and you're both on 3-card wincons. The fact yours may require less dead cards in exchange for more possible interactions may be worth it. It'd be nice if Pila didn't have to survive a full turn in a meta of Decay. Consider finding a way to solve this that functions naturally so it doesn't become a 4-card combo. Possibly win-conditions that happen to protect him; possibly Temporal Mastery since taking extra turns, even off of a brainstorm, would potentially increase your clock artificially. Similarly, your (average) card quality here is low, so Chrome Mox or Mox Diamond are potential winners. I'd also consider Sol lands but they are likely not good given Arch's mana cost.
To combat decay, you *need* to be able to push your critical turn to T2 IMO with Chrome Mox (or Diamond) since then you going-first or them making a play like Goyf means you just win.
E.G. christmas-land
T1, land, mox, pila pala with Force backup
T2, architect, win via cantrips->win con
I'd definitely include a single lab-man though; getting around sanctity is a thing.
Thanks! I took a look at Omnitell, and they have tons of free counters. I think I'll take this to a FNM and playtest this deck as is. Forget the sideboard for now, I'm just figuring out the deck.
//Lands
12 Island
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
//Artifact
3 Chrome Mox
//Spells
4 Blue Sun's Zenith
4 Brainstorm
4 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
3 Gitaxian Probe
3 Ponder
3 Preordain
3 Spell Pierce
//Creatures
4 Grand Architect
4 Pili-Pala
1 Laboratory Maniac
Hi, your deck looks intresting, hope you pull of some combo wins at your tryout!
Creature based combo is always tricky in legacy though since there is so much removal. i think the most weakest point in the combo is that Pili-Pala needs to be in play a full turn before you can activate his ability. Your deck might benefit from Lightning Greaves, it will allow you to combo off if you already have the architect in play and draw the pili-pala and protects your creatures from removal. Architect's second ability does not target so this should not be a problem (just make pili-pala blue in responds to the equip or before you equip) another option for protections is Spellskite.
The counterspells are not to great i think. you need to tap out to play your creatures and therefore you won't be able to cast counterspell. It might be ok if you don't have any creatures in hand though, trough this is a situation you prefer to not be in i suppose. i would replace them with Daze's or preferably Pact of Negation.
Another option might be to play Ęther Vial, this allows you to play your creature uncounterable, at the end of their turn and leaves your mana open for your own counterspells.
A few copies of Cavern of Souls could be added to protect your creatures from counter. Most other spells cost only 1 blue mana so i should impact your manabase to much.
Laboratory Maniac should be in your sideboard, and should come in only if you expect or have seen leyeline of sanctity. is too often a dead card in your deck.
owh and as an alternative wincon maybe Banefire?
Hope this helps a bit!
Arne
Edit: To stop Pithing Needle you should play Echoing Truth or Chain of Vapor in your sideboard.
Two card combo where both combo parts are creatures? And in which both combo parts are basically worthless on their own?
This can really only cut it in "casual" Legacy because there's no reason to play this over, say, Painter-Grindstone combo.
It's a 3-card combo since it also needs stroke, and you forgot the part where it has summoning sickness.Two card combo where both combo parts are creatures? And in which both combo parts are basically worthless on their own?
Since it's creatures setting up the combo, I almost feel like it should be in some "Faerie Stompy/Controllish" Shell instead. You can drop a Chalice 1 and Pili-Palla is an easy T1 drop with Sol-Lands as well. You can use Chalice/3sphere/FoW to protect and Tezzerret the Seeker, Transmute, Merchant Scroll or different tutors to get combo and just flat out win. Tezz also gives you benefit of dropping Ensnaring Bridge out of nowhere. Food for though..
May your suffering equal your weakness--Ihsan's Shade
Few ideas off the top of my head:
Why run 4x Zenith when you could run Merchant Scroll and/or Cunning Wish in most or all of those spots?
Imperial Recruiter can search up all your guys, but requires a second color.
Trinket Mage can search up Pili-Palla, and if Architect is in play he can cast it too.
AEther Vial would let you EOT flash Pili-Paella, your turn flash in Architect.
I think the biggest thing is the deep seeded emotional understanding that the right play is the right play regardless of outcomes. The ability to make a decision 5 straight times, lose 5 times because of it, and still make it the 6th time if it's the right play. - Jon Finkel
"Notions of chance and fate are the preoccupation of men engaged in rash undertakings."
I was on hiatus from MTG when Pila came out so let me ask what is likely a dumb question. Does summoning sickness effect an untap ability? Because if not, maybe springleaf drum would make it faster?
I really don't see how that would make it faster
About the Lab Maniac, he should be only on sideboard and sided in against decks that run sanctity. In G1 he does nothing, drawing it would just suck.
Aether Vial sounds really cool, as it may make the combo "invulnerable" to sorceries and also uncounterable.
As for the all-creatures-combo problem, I think you should play Spellskite, at least on the sideboard. It makes the deck a little more slow, but then again, decks with creature removal usually are slower and don't beat you in the spot.
I think some bounce in the 75 may be worth a try. Maybe Repeal, as you don't lose card advantage? It may be used EOT in some hate like pithing needle just before you combo. Repealling a flipped delver is also a win, as for the Marit Lage token. Also, repealling your creatures in response to removal is not optimal, but it gives you card advantage and assures you that you won't need to find the combo piece back again. The real problem about repeal is that it use to be reeeeeally mana-intensive.
I would also play more fetchlands. Fetchlands with brainstorm and ponder are just great! The 1 damage isn't that significant as you must search for card quality, and putting back 2 bad cards and shuffling is just great. I would play at least 12 fetchlands.
Yes - it's mentioned in rule 302.6.
Aslo, Springleaf Drum taps to activate, so it doesn't work at all for this combo.
1-2 - Burn - Once he figured out to take out Pili Pala, it was over.
2-1 - Death and Taxes - Comboed out in turn 5 game one, and comboed out turn 3 in Game 3. Dunno if that's a good thing or bad thing.
0-2 - UR Delver - Just too fast and too many bolts/counters
1-2 - Jund - Comboed out first game, couldn't combo out game 2 and 3.
2-0 - Zoo - Havne't seen Zoo in forever, but after a few hits and countering a path or so, I went off.
Here's what I thought of... when this goes off it's great, especially when you Blue Sun yourself to get a huge hand, then blue sun them with counter backup. and it's great against slower decks, but itself is too vulnerable. Maybe I might add black for disruption and protection. and like you guy's suggested with a control shell. I'm thinking of trying Aether Vials and Tezzeret the Seeker and make it into a Tezzerator control deck with Mishra's Factory to help fight.
so any deck with abrupt decay you auto lose to...this does not seem well thought out.
i feel like you would have better luck abusing mind over matter. it was once banned for a reason.
Play 4 Card Blind!
Currently Playing
Legacy: Dark Depths
EDH: 5-Color Hermit Druid
Currently Brewing: [Deck] Sadistic Sacrament / Chalice NO Eldrazi
why cards are so expensive...hoarders
I've been tinkering the deck more, and I've been trying Black to deal with removal using discard. And I've been much happier. I've been able to discard some decays and bolts that were hindering me. I also added Baleful Strix to help with big creatures like Goyf, draw a card, and give me some defense against Delver/Swiftspear. It's also much better protected. It's definitely slower, but it's been working out nicely. It also lets me open up to creature removal.
I'm trying to find a way to stick in Merchant Scroll though for my BSZ 5-8, like Dreamhalls for Omnitell. Any suggestions? Or screw it and go with Dig Through Time, and try to just dig through everything?
5 Island
4 Polluted Delta
3 Flooded Strand
3 Scalding Tarn
4 Underground Sea
1 Swamp
//Spells
2 Blue Sun's Zenith
4 Brainstorm
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Force of Will
4 Ponder
3 Thoughtseize
3 Spell Pierce
2 Pact of Negation
3 Dig through Time
//Creatures
4 Grand Architect
4 Pili-Pala
4 Baleful Strix
Here's a UG Version I concocted ... I feel the mana needs to be tweaked a bit though.
60 Main
4 Island
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Tropical Island
1 Forest
4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
2 Blue Sun's Zenith
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
4 Living Wish
3 Pact of Negation
3 Grand Architect
3 Pili-Pala
7 Side (so far)
3 Raven's Familiar
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Laboratory Maniac
1 Pili-Pala
1 Grand Architect
Interesting Note You don't immediately need access to USZ to win: merely chaining the good cantrips (and Raven Familiar through Living Wish) is pretty good once you've assembled the perpetual mana engine.
Another, Less Fortunate Note The big thing this deck lacks is speed, and I'm at a loss for how to make it work. The deck requires 3UUU to go off in one turn, and takes at least until turn 4 if playing pieces individually.
As some other people mentioned, the combo is very hard to assemble and protect because it has 3 pieces and 2 of them are creatures. That being said, I think it would work better in shell like aggro/ramp to wurmcoil or stompy, where comboing off could be a plan B. Not sure how you would build that, but here are some interesting cards to consider:
---Small creatures---
Vedalken Certarch
Etherium Sculptor
Kira, Great Glass-Spinner
Treasure Mage
---Fatties---
Memnarch
Steel Hellkite
Platinum Angel
Wurmcoil Engine
---Other combo pieces---
Staff of Domination
PS: I like the idea of having 1 Memnarch in the deck, because if you ever end up drawing your own deck, you cast it and steal all your opponent's permanents! Winning in style! :P
No Eldrazi? Infinite colorless mana seems really good with them and other high cost bombs. Might be potential for show and tell to be used here as well.
If you are casting stuff with the combo:
The combo makes infinite any-color mana, so stuff that outright wins is better than bombs (blue sun's zenith, staff of domination, memnarch, fireball variants, etc).
If you are casting stuff without the combo, but with architect:
The large amounts of colorless mana can only be used on artifacts or activated abilities of artifacts, which is why all the bombs I suggested are artifact creatures. Two of them do benefit from infinite mana though: Memnarch and steel hellkite.
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