[Deck] Deadguy Ale (B/w Confidant)

[Tokugawa]

Have you never revealed a Shriekmaw to Bob ? I know uncounterability is a thing but well...
How was the 1-of Council's judgment compared to a 3rd vindicate ? I cannot see a common use case where CJ > Vindicate (except a resolved Emrakul, hexproof guy which I consider mostly as a corner case) but maybe I'm missing something here.
I read your report and it seems that stone raining people have worked like a "charm".

I'm glad Bladehold shows up. I'm playing Sorin, LoI in its place to add further % against control & grindy matches.

I also like your SB, pretty well tuned against TC decks. After the GP, would you make changes, if any ? I'm playing with a second chains of Mephi because it synergizes so well with "Bob + Stone rain".

Council's judgment is for TNN-hate.

[Ralf]

Council's judgment is for TNN-hate.

3 liliana & 1 SOFI & Lingering are already nice answers to TNN.
But you might be right, I was overthinking anyway since I'm used to playing with 2 diabolic edict MD instead of shriekmaw, so that TNN is rather a non issue.

[Wilkin]

Sure, I have revealed Hero, Shriekmaw and Batterskull to bob. It happens. Even still, in the 5 or so years playing Dead Guy, I've died less than 7 times to Bob. He's won many more games than I have lost. And Shriekmaw is there for the "removal curve". lol. I don't play decay so I wanted a kill card at 2 mana. And I also wanted something that could be a threat, in this case a late game threat because I don't play that many threats.

Council's Judgment is a catch all for a few things like True Name, Emrakul etc. Also nice since it can get around MOther of Runes or Goblin Welder. Having said that, there were more instances where I wish the Judgment was a Vindicate than the other way around. With the meta the way it is now, people are less afraid of wasteland and land destruction in general.....so they are either skipping on land counts and/or not afraid of playing out all non-basics first. That's how I beat the First UR Delver guy. He ran out Delver off of a Volcanic Island turn 1....most people do that thinking the other guy probably won't waste it with a threat out. LOL, I'm not most people. My first competitive Magic deck had 4 Sinkholes, 4 Strip Mine, 4 Icequake, and 4 Ice storm.

I'm also guessing that's why the 2 12-post guys did well (I faced one late day 1 and the other day 2), less wastelands around is better for them in general.

I like Sorin, Lord of Innistrad. Considering adding one to board. Good for the grindy matchups and lifegain is alright. Elspeth probably better but Dread of Night and especially Sulfur Elemental are out there...

Changes to board.....Hmmmm..... Not sure. Treasure Cruise is a beating. It seems to me, whatever answer you try to run is inferior to the threat (Cruise). In game play, Relics and Deathrites were probably the most effective in reducing the Cruise Threat. Chains was ok but doesn't do much else than stop the draw silliness, and with many cards in hand already Bob Huang was able to use Cruise as a Faithless Looting esque kind of effect anyway. Didn't put Teeg in that much, except against the Sneak attack deck.

In hindsight, probably should have had a Firewalker or 2 and maybe less combo hate cards for more Delver hate. But if I played the GP again, my opponents could have been completely different. I played against One combo deck and one miracles. Lucky I only had to play against one burn and I heard there were a ton of MUD players. And I'm sure there were more stompy builds since Chalice of the Void was sold out.

[Ralf]

Sure, I have revealed Hero, Shriekmaw and Batterskull to bob. It happens. Even still, in the 5 or so years playing Dead Guy, I've died less than 7 times to Bob. He's won many more games than I have lost. And Shriekmaw is there for the "removal curve". lol. I don't play decay so I wanted a kill card at 2 mana. And I also wanted something that could be a threat, in this case a late game threat because I don't play that many threats.

I like Sorin, Lord of Innistrad. Considering adding one to board. Good for the grindy matchups and lifegain is alright. Elspeth probably better but Dread of Night and especially Sulfur Elemental are out there...

In hindsight, probably should have had a Firewalker or 2 and maybe less combo hate cards for more Delver hate. But if I played the GP again, my opponents could have been completely different. I played against One combo deck and one miracles. Lucky I only had to play against one burn and I heard there were a ton of MUD players. And I'm sure there were more stompy builds since Chalice of the Void was sold out.

I guess our variance is very different. Bob seems to always reveal the highest CMC card in my deck at a perfect timing....for my opponent.
Elspeth might be better save the mana requirement.
But as you point it out, I wanted to have other "non white" threats. You are playing Shriekmaw and me "Diabolic Edict", so Sorin was a must include as I am lighter on endgame threats. Not to mention, the lifelink ability of the generated token which has, a non zero amount of time, made me crawl back from behind. Even chain blocking until Sorin could use his ultimate has been stellar in some MU. At last, the synergy with Lingering has to be mentioned. Once, I was dead on board raced by a TNN, Sorin showed up, pumped 4 spirit tokens and I swang for lethal.

By the way, impressive performance.
Congratulations.

[Megadeus]

I'mwith Wilkin. The Times I've died from Bob (and it wasn't a desperation play off of like playing him to chump at 1 life) just by flipping over a pile of 4 amd five drops is almost 0. He'll hurt you, but generally if he gets active andyou aren't at like 5 life from the get go, he's awesome. Just remember, Greatness. At any cost. ANY COST.

I could see edict being solid, but I already have liliana. I'm also main boarding a single persecution now as well. Not only can it sweep an opponent nicely, but it can protect from nasty 2 for 1 forked bolts. I have honestly been wanting for another 1 drop removal. Deciding between either a path or a disfigure.

[Mirrislegend]

I guess our variance is very different. Bob seems to always reveal the highest CMC card in my deck at a perfect timing....for my opponent.

If you have room, try Sensei's Divining Top. Really smooths things out.

I'mwith Wilkin. The Times I've died from Bob (and it wasn't a desperation play off of like playing him to chump at 1 life) just by flipping over a pile of 4 amd five drops is almost 0. He'll hurt you, but generally if he gets active andyou aren't at like 5 life from the get go, he's awesome. Just remember, Greatness. At any cost. ANY COST.

I could see edict being solid, but I already have liliana. I'm also main boarding a single persecution now as well. Not only can it sweep an opponent nicely, but it can protect from nasty 2 for 1 forked bolts. I have honestly been wanting for another 1 drop removal. Deciding between either a path or a disfigure.

Go with a disfigure. It hits almost everything in the format and doesn't have a direct drawback. The few things it cannot hit (Goyf, Emrakul, reanimator targets) all get managed in a different way anyways.

[Ralf]

I'mwith Wilkin. The Times I've died from Bob (and it wasn't a desperation play off of like playing him to chump at 1 life) just by flipping over a pile of 4 amd five drops is almost 0. He'll hurt you, but generally if he gets active andyou aren't at like 5 life from the get go, he's awesome. Just remember, Greatness. At any cost. ANY COST.

I could see edict being solid, but I already have liliana. I'm also main boarding a single persecution now as well. Not only can it sweep an opponent nicely, but it can protect from nasty 2 for 1 forked bolts. I have honestly been wanting for another 1 drop removal. Deciding between either a path or a disfigure.

We have 1 to 3 liliana MD.
I play with:
3 liliana
2 Diabolic edict
4 Swords
3 Vindicate

This a lot of spot removal. Unless, if you are (like me) stone raining people, a lot.
Zealous Persecution MD is something I have to think about. Might be a very good call, right now.

[Megadeus]

My friends always berate me for using my vindicates as stone rain... I just like to get aggressive! I always waver on two or three of them..

As for liliana, I don't think I've ever changed from 3. It just seems right. The card is versatile and fine in almost every match up. And I'm usually against running persecution main because it is awful against the hard control decks and often the non elves combo decks, but I think it just feels right at the moment

My current removal suite:
4 STP
3 liliana
2 Vindicate
1 Zealous Persecution
SoFaI and Jitte have the ability to be removal.

Sb:
2 Perish
1 ZP
1 Shriekmaw
2 Disenchant

[Ralf]

If you have room, try Sensei's Divining Top. Really smooths things out.

Well, I used to be playing with top as a 2-of.
Then, I saw (six or seven months ago), Wilkin, playing with chrome mox.
I tested it out, never looked back:

T1:
DRS + Dual out -> enable wasteland + swords
T1 -> Bob / SFM
T1-> discard + swords
T1 -> HTT

or T2:
SFM / Bob daze proof -> Opponent brainstorm -> Discard (note you won't catch a competent player here but well...) !
T2 -> vindicate (stone rain) after a T1 discard
T2 -> Liliana

Etc..

Speed vs Consistency (Card quality).
I guess we could argue for hours. But, Wilkin has a lot of solid performances with it and I have yet to see a "top build" showing up such good results.
Sometimes, you have 2 mox in your opening hands and it sucks -> mulligan.
But overall, the deck needs free wins with such good T2 plans that are Bob/SFM or even, sometimes you have that kind of land denial & control opening hand that just needs to be beefed up to blow out your opponent. Chrome mox is just a huge boost in these particular cases.
Boost which tends to lead to victory most of the time you have it.

[Rizso]

Gonna start play maindecked Chains of Mephistophel. As well fixing the mana so that Abrupt Decay is able to be cast most of the time. There is afterall less wastelands then ever. Abrupt Decay is really strong right now.

[Megadeus]

I'm not denying the strength of chrome mox. I like it in theory, I just haven't tested it and I have had success with my build so I'm hesitant to change what has worked

[Rampart]

I'm not denying the strength of chrome mox. I like it in theory, I just haven't tested it and I have had success with my build so I'm hesitant to change what has worked

My brother was the other Deadguy deck that made day two and he also runs a pair of chrome mox's and swears by them. The speed the deck up and stabilizes the mana issues (he is not running DRS) this deck can have sometimes. I think it just creates some super powerful plays that he feels necessary. If he doesn't get them early he discards them to Liliana or filters them away with Top.

I would test them to see if you like them or not, whats the worst that could happen at your local weekly event, you go 1-3 or whatever for the week? Not saying i would just jam them at a large SCG event or the like. But it doen't hurt to explore different options

[maharis]

Wilkin's latest results have convinced me to give this deck a go with Chrome Mox + less lands. I probably won't play Liliana main but I'm definitely having her in the board, and playing ZP main and possibly Orzhov Pontiff. Also Hero of Bladehold. And maybe Blood Baron of Vizkopa. Could you imagine dropping that thing against BBD's list, haha. Nice Bolt, STP and Batterskull. But that's probably a pipe dream.

4 Souls seems like the place to be too, since most decks are playing x/1s and no way to beat x/1s for some reason. Could also see Pack Rat having a place. Wilkin has 7 discard main... 21 lands and 2 Chrome Mox... at least one Pack Rat to make those un-chaff seems OK. I might only do 5-6 discard main anyway. I like Therapy with Bob and 4 Souls.

On 1 cmc removal... Darkblast? You can do tricks with it to kill Delver, SFM and DRS. Wish we had something as cool to do with our GY as Cruise though. Delve doesn't play well with Bob unfortunately. Seems good with Matt's Reanimate/Unearth though. Discard their SFM, reanimate, get our skull, nice. Or mill our SFM, reanimate it. You can also use it with Top hilariously. Next 3 look like garbage? Tap, dredge, kill your Pyromancer, fresh 3 under SDT.

My brother was the other Deadguy deck that made day two and he also runs a pair of chrome mox's and swears by them. The speed the deck up and stabilizes the mana issues (he is not running DRS) this deck can have sometimes. I think it just creates some super powerful plays that he feels necessary. If he doesn't get them early he discards them to Liliana or filters them away with Top.

I would test them to see if you like them or not, whats the worst that could happen at your local weekly event, you go 1-3 or whatever for the week? Not saying i would just jam them at a large SCG event or the like. But it doen't hurt to explore different options

Can you get his list? No DRS is very interesting.

[Rampart]

Can you get his list? No DRS is very interesting.

its something like this I think, He moves the chrome mox count up and down from 1 to 2 a lot. not sure the exact qty for the GP

1 Chrome Mox
2 Tops
1 Batterskull
1 Fire and Ice
1 Jitte
4 STP
2 Vindicate
1 Darkblast
4 Liliana
3 Thoughtseize
3 Cabal Therapy

3 Lingering Souls
3 Grunt
3 Mom
3 Stoneforge
4 Dark Confy

21 Lands
2 Karakas
1 Urborg
2 Swamp
1 Plains
7 Fetch
4 Scrublands
4 Wasteland

Some sideboard crap

[Wilkin]

My brother was the other Deadguy deck that made day two and he also runs a pair of chrome mox's and swears by them. The speed the deck up and stabilizes the mana issues (he is not running DRS) this deck can have sometimes. I think it just creates some super powerful plays that he feels necessary. If he doesn't get them early he discards them to Liliana or filters them away with Top.

I would test them to see if you like them or not, whats the worst that could happen at your local weekly event, you go 1-3 or whatever for the week? Not saying i would just jam them at a large SCG event or the like. But it doen't hurt to explore different options

At first I was like "How do you know only 2 deadguy decks made day 2?". And then I read the metagame 2 breakdown on wizards. Hmmm.....black/white stoneblade. Well, at least it's better than Washington, I was listed as Junk. And my list from that year had only Deathrites and Bayou, not even a Gaddock Teeg.

[Rizso]

Once again thinking of trying out Cursed Scroll. With less knights and tarmogoyfs. Scrolls kills alot more creatures nowdays. Thought smash to smithereens is quite a card right now.

[Teluin]

A long time ago I talked about playing Bitterblossom in this deck. The card's awesome and can just win games. It gets even better later on if you've boarded in Zealous Persecution to fight Young Pyromancer decks - they're kinda popular. I know Souls is 'faster' but not by much if they're in your opening hand since BB costs 1 less to cast (by T3 when you cast Souls for 2 tokens, BB would have 1 token in play). GY hate and a higher CMC vs. a 2 cost that just keeps on giving is something to consider.

[Wilkin]

Used to play Bitterblossom. Once I went to Lingering Souls I never went back.

-Souls does cost more but it's like 2 spells in one. If they counter it the first time, you can just flashback. If they counter Bitterblossom it's gone.
-Growing opposing goyfs by 2 with Bitterblossom sucked. Really sucked.
-Lingering Souls has an immediate board impact whereas you have to wait a turn with Bitterblossom and also once you get the token it can't attack that turn.
-I've died to Bitterblossom more times than I have with Dark Confidant. And I haven't played Bitterblossom in like 2 years.


It's a good card for sure but I feel that Lingering Souls kicked it to the curb.

[Rizso]

I like Sorin, lorde of innistrad way more then elspeth in the deck. The emblem is beast with Lingering Soul.

I used to play bitterblossom as well. Great card when ahead worst card when behind. Lightning Bolts are everywhere. Engineered Plague is a card again with it removing 8/12 creatures from ur-delver. Dont want the faeries to be 0/0s :P

Gotten my hands on 3 chains of meph so time to rock them out :P

[tescrin]

I'd mostly run Bitterblossom if you're running Goyf. I use Sculler (partly) for the same reasons. If you *are* running goyfs, things like Sculler/Blossom beef him up to *huge* extremely fast. When you're 2-drop is outsizing reanimator targets, you know you're doing something right :)