[Primer/Deck] Nic Fit

[sdematt]

Dies to decay, etc. Not strong enough. A threat out of Nic Fit should always try to avoid popular removal or have evasion or both.

[ylekaikyle]

How about tasigur (spelling?) Has anyone tested?

[Firepaw3]

How about tasigur (spelling?) Has anyone tested?

I have been playing him as a 2-of in scapewish recently and he has been amazing, aside from the obvious card advantage he can generate, with tops you can manipulate what goes into your yard aswell as clearing the top without a fetchland, and is a great blocker against tarmos for just one mana. I put him in the place of maindeck slaughtergames/abrupt decay

[ylekaikyle]

The last one on my mind was synergies between wasteland, titania, and crucible. Has anyone had a go with that?

[grandemagopiccolo]

Hi guys... yesterday I tested my Punishing Fit against ANT (2-0 new legacy player) BUG (0-2) jund (2-0)

this is my current list:

CREATURE (12)

4 veteran explorer
1 thragtusk
1 scavenging ooze
1 huntmaster of the fells
1 thrun, the last troll
1 eternal witness
1 deathrite shaman
1 primeval titan
1 tasigur (test)

SPELL (25)

2 liliana
3 punishing fire
3 abrupt decay
3 pernicious deed
3 sensei's divining top
1 maelstorm pulse
2 thougtseize
4 cabal
4 zenith

LAND (23)

SIDE

2 slaughter games
2 surgical
3 red elemental blast
2 golgari charm
1 massacre
1 gaddock
2 krosan grip
1 pulse
1 relic of progenitus


I think test 2 Tasigur (main) maybe cut 1 thoughtseize
for Side? suggest? Pulse or toxic deluge?

Thanks and sorry for my bad English

[Bobmans]

Is Tasigur really that good to have 1 or 2 non zenithable in your liat

[grandemagopiccolo]

Is Tasigur really that good to have 1 or 2 non zenithable in your liat

I test it... 4/5 body ..low casting cost... and great ability... 1/2 maindeck maybe is good, but i will test whit another deck.. vs jund Tasigur won a game for me!! :)

[Bobmans]

I test it... 4/5 body ..low casting cost... and great ability... 1/2 maindeck maybe is good, but i will test whit another deck.. vs jund Tasigur won a game for me!! :)

Did his ability created the conditions to win or did the 4/5 body gave you the win? Jamming 1 in my current list could never hurt to test ofcourse.

[MD.Ghost]

I think test 2 Tasigur (main) maybe cut 1 thoughtseize
for Side? suggest? Pulse or toxic deluge?

Thanks and sorry for my bad English

Tasigur has his pros and cons:

+Nic Fit can support this guy without "max" Delve
+Nic Fit can use his Ability as a manasink and will most of the time get "bomby" cards besides Veteran Explorer
+4/5 is solid enough to fight gofy etc (if decay + deed isnt enough - sometimes it isnt!)
+Tasigur doesn't die to decay or our own Deeds

-non tutorable with Zenith (but even if he would be green, delve + zenith doesnt work)
-no "enter the battlefield" trigger
-can only be a beater, which can't overrun Gofy or True-Name Nemesis
-most Nic Fit builds (without blue) doesn't run many spells + fetches (compared to blue cantrip shells), a turn 3 Tasigur for 1 mana seems like a dream and if you have to cast him for more than 3 mana he seems not so good anymore - Nic Fit has enough solid 4 drops!

If you play with Tasigur, i wouldn't cut stuff like Thoughtseize or Decay, because cutting "Spells" will result in a (Delve)less effective Tasigur. My latest Scapeshift (and i test Tasigur in every shell) build with him looks like:


4x Burning Wish
3x Cabal Therapy
2x Thoughtseize
1x Garruk Relentless
4x Green Sun's Zenith
3x Pernicious Deed
2x Abrupt Decay
2x Scapeshift
3x Sensei's Divining Top

1x Eternal Witness
1x Huntmaster of the Fells
1x Primeval Titan
2x Sakura-Tribe Elder
1x Tasigur, the Golden Fang
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Thragtusk
4x Veteran Explorer
1x Wood Elves

2x Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
4x Verdant Catacombs
2x Stomping Ground
2x Swamp
4x Taiga
1x Karakas
2x Mountain
3x Badlands
2x Bayou
2x Forest

Sideboard
1x Dryad Militant
3x Carpet of Flowers
1x Scapeshift
1x Cabal Therapy
1x Thoughtseize
1x Duress
2x Slaughter Games
1x Innocent Blood
1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Massacre
1x Pyroclasm
1x Toxic Deluge

Current flexslots are (with 61 card) Tasigur and Karakas - the land will also work with Tasigur, but i included it against all the annoying legendary stuff (reanimate, sneak show etc.)

[Ralf]

@ Ghost

This reminds me my old Scape list:
1) Dryad
2) Karakas MD (three birds one stone vs S&T as karakas/Primeval/Scapeshift are an out)
3) 1 CT in the side to virtually have 7 CT and make sure Veteran dies !

Although, I'm not sold at all on only 11 black sources.
As I stated a lot we suffer from not having a black source in our opening hand vs combo.

12 is a bare minimum. I would cut a stomping ground for another bayou.
10 mountain is not 11. But I think Titania can fix this for us in grindy MU.

Tasigur vs Titania:
- Titania is green and gsable
- Titania can bring 10 to the table when you GSZ or cast her.
- Titania can bring back a mountain/a fetch/a karakas/a valakut etc...
- Titania can be used with scapeshift even when you don't have 7 or 8 lands in play (my best play is scapeshifting with 5 lands in play & Titania and getting karakas..guaranteed blowout)
- Tasigur can be cast for 1 and can shrink Tarmo (delving P.deed most likely & PW)
- Tasigur doesn't fear bolt
- Tasigur can generate card advantage/card quality over the long term.

My two cents.

Happy to see that you are still playing Nic Fit :D

[Bobmans]

Tasigur vs Titania (in scapewish):
Titania recurs lands in a land dependant deck and is zenithable, so an instant win for me.

[dave78pdx]

If I had to pick between Tasigur and Titania, I would go with Titania. You can GSZ for her and get ETB value plus synergies with fetch lands. Also, possible to feed her through Courser of Kruphix , not to mention Topping in to a good draw step with a land as your second card for Courser to play off the top of the library. I am just starting to play with those two in the deck and they play together well.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Ralf]

I have also forgotten another interesting point for Scape Fit.

Yesterday night I came across a weird situation against S&T where my opponent resolved S&S putting in an Emrakul and me putting Titania.
His main issue was that during my turn, I played another 2 permanents (+ the fetch that Titania gave me back) and I was at 7+ permanents. He just could not attack because of the annihilator trigger without facing a lethal board (5 lands).

Hilarious. Period.

[MD.Ghost]

@Ralf / Scapeshift:

It is no accident that my list contain some rememberable elements for you. I mentioned our great discussions about the deck and i also hate to lose against degenerate stuff like Show&Tell - so most of my decks get some ways to "fight them back".

Scapeshift overs a strong game 1 plan against most non-combo decks, but the price (of the wishboard) is one of the weakest Nic Fit versions against Combo (note that Nic Fit already struggle against combo anyway), with Karakas you have another (very unexpected) answer against Show&Tell and Reanimate (and Dark Depths Combo) decks and the tutorable Dryad will help against Storm-based combo decks. Scapeshift seems the only Nic Fit build which can run the Dryad without any complications (wish will be exiled, general low spells and profit from graveyard) - my Main has 5 Discard Spells, which get completed with 3 more single Discard Spells and 2 Slaughter Games (best Spell against Miracle) lurking at Side.

Thanks to the discussion about Tasigur vs Titania yesterday, i adjusted my test build a little bit:
-1 stomping
+1 bayou

-1 garruk
+1 huntmaster (still unsure about both)

-1 tasigur
+1 titania (i already snap buyed one at release because i was sure she is usable)

The only thing i dislike at the combination of Titania + Scapeshift is the low(est compared to other Nic Fit versions) amount of effectively usable Fetchlands.

------
Punishing Fit - Tasigur vs Titania:

The Nic Fit build i played most of the time - i also switch between two test builds the last time. One has Titania as another fast finisher (6 fetches!) and 1 flex slot (2nd Huntmaster; 1 Garruk Relentless; 3 drop etc.). The build has Kessig Main (still a solid plan with Thrun and Primeval Titan) with a lurking Karakas at Side (see above).

The other test build go with 2 Tasigur (over Titania and Flexslot) - Tasigur at Punishing can also work, because the yard is filled with more stuff (compared to Scapeshift) counting removal, discard from our own lilianas, fetches etc. He works as an early (cheap) threat (decay+deed immune!), which allows to fire one of the "endless" removals and still get some pressure at the battlefield the same turn.

With a pair of Tasigurs at Punishing the deck can play more aggressively compared to Titania. The Elemental-Lady fits the more traditional game plan: hard control, smash anything your opponent get on the battlefield and once the dust settles deploy a bomby-creature to win the game (and winning within a given time is always one of the problems with Punishing Fit).

I will see if Titania (love her as a finisher with bug fit) is also the right direction with Punishing Fit.

-----

@Ralf: Biggest problem is still finding enough time to play all the decks - besides the different stuff you can try with Nic Fit, i also like to roll over a tournament with my elves etc. But i always watched the usefull discussions here!

[Bobmans]

@Ralf: Biggest problem is still finding enough time to play all the decks - besides the different stuff you can try with Nic Fit, i also like to roll over a tournament with my elves etc. But i always watched the usefull discussions here!

For that reason i sold a large portion of my paper card collection (and bought a new car with it) leaving myself with 5 playable archetypes. Still this leaves me with that difficult choice of what to play i mostly focus on one archetype and play it for a month and then change. With GP Lille coming in July i will focus on PFire NicFit for the coming period.

[grandemagopiccolo]

For that reason i sold a large portion of my paper card collection (and bought a new car with it) leaving myself with 5 playable archetypes. Still this leaves me with that difficult choice of what to play i mostly focus on one archetype and play it for a month and then change. With GP Lille coming in July i will focus on PFire NicFit for the coming period.

Hi bobmans... Can yuo post your Punishing fit list?
I also play punishing and I compare my list

Thanks

[Bobmans]

..

Currently it is:
3 Veteran Explorer
4 Deathrite Shaman
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Eternal Witness
1 Courser of Kruphix
2 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Thragtusk
1 Rampaging Baloth
4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Punishing Fire
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Vraska the Unseen
3 Liliana of the Veil

4 Grove of the Burnwillows
4 Verdant Catacomb
2 Wooded Foothills
2 Bayou
1 Taiga
1 Badlands
3 Forest
2 Swamp
1 Mountain
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Phyrexian Tower

Side:
3 Carpet of Flowers
3 Extirpate
2 Pyroblast
2 Thoughtseize
2 Slaughter Games
1 Krosan Grip
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Golgari Charm

Flexslots are: Courser and Vraska. Courser and SDT are pretty cool. I like Vraska, because she provides multiple utility and can actually win the game. Also i could potentially destroy an Emrakul or a Jace.
Rampaging Baloth in the slot of PrimeTime. The Baloth provides a bit more impact to the board then PrimeTime. When you have a Courser on the board it does get you so much pressure.
Charnelhoard Wurm is pretty awesome to in that slot, but cmc=7 is pushing for it.

For me the board is pretty much fixed. If i MD slaughter games then Garruk Relentless becomes an option. Also sometimes i swap 3rd Carpet for 1 Choke.

[Dzogchen]

Hello! Long time reader, first time posting. I finally feel like I've gotten 'ok' enough with the deck (greatly with the help of the fine folks on this forum) to post some results and get feedback. Went 3-1 for third place in our FNM last night so here's the run down.

First, the list:

2x Windswept Heath
1x Marsh Flats
4x Verdant Catacombs
1x Karakas
1x Phyrexian Tower
1x Cavern of Souls (this should probably be Volrath's but I don't have one, and occasionally the uncounterability has been relevant)
2x Plains
3x Forest
3x Swamp
1x Scrubland
2x Bayou
2x Savannah

4x Veteran Explorer
4x Siege Rhino
1x Thrun, the Last Troll
1x Sigarda, Host of Herons
1x Deathrite Shaman
1x Thragtusk
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Reclamation Sage
1x Eternal Witness

1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Golgari Charm
1x Recurring Nightmare
3x Pernicious Deed
4x Green Sun's Zenith
4x Cabal Therapy
2x Sensei's Divining Top
3x Path to Exile
4x Abrupt Decay

SB: (A bit for my local meta)
1x Massacre
1x Memoricide
1x Krosan Grip
2x Toxic Deluge
2x Rest in Peace
4x Thoughtseize
1x Gaddock Teeg
3x Choke

Round 1 vs Infect

Game 1: I knew the player and this is what he was on but it was a terrible game one. I never saw any cabal therapies and very little removal. He Force'd my Path and won the next turn with invigorate + berserk.

Game 2: I sided in 4 thoughtseize, the K-Grip, and the memoricide. I had a decent opening hand with a thoughtseize, a therapy, a decay, and some lands. I thoughtseize'd away his Glistener elf turn 1, then next turn cabal therapy got his brainstorms. Seemed like it was going good. I drew another decay, but he crop rotated for an inkmoth eot and then into another invigorate + berserk kill.

0-1

Round 2 vs Loam (I WOULD say Loam/Pox, but I didn't see Pox)

Game 1: I kept a 2 land hand, didn't draw any more, and very quickly got a Ghost Quarter/Wasteland/Loam lock going on me. Interesting card I saw was 'Spreading Algae'. That was a very annoying repeatable source of land destruction. He had goyfs (which were definitely held off by Veteran Explorer for most of the game).

Game 2: I sided in 2 rest in peace, 1 memoricide, 1 K-Grip for his Mox Diamonds. He mulled to 5, seemed to eventually keep lands and a goyf. He played a Bob...which flipped Worm Harvest. I eventually played 2 vets and a pernicious deed, blew up the board, and then played Sigarda. She quickly went to town.

Game 3: We were down to about 8 minutes on the clock. I had one of those really close opening hands but decided to keep it because it was THE NUTS against him. It was vet, vet, rest in peace, green suns, cabal therapy, rhino, windswept heath. Turn one he just played a land and passed an my first draw.....was swamp. Got there. It quickly snowballed into vet, cabal, vet, cabal, rhino, green suns for sigarda and a two turns later I was on the board.

1-1

Round 3 vs Punishing Jund

Game 1: I feel pretty good in the Jund matchup. I managed to decay and path his opening Bob's, Vet explorer held off his Goyf until I could sac it and play Rhino. Punishing Fire doesn't match up well against Rhino so eventually it just values him out.

Game 2: In this game I saw his interesting card choices. Things were playing out normally until he put down a Varolz the scar striped. I didnt immediately have removal but didnt thing too much of it since he was at 7 and I was at 18. I swing with Rhino to put him to 3. He plays (and then sacrifices) a Phyrexian Dreadnought, scavenges it and a goyf onto Varolz, and swings for 18 exactly.

Game 3: I have a fast veteran explorer with phyrexian tower into a green suns for sigarda. She goes to town pretty fast and when I win the game he shows me a hand with two Liliana's in it.

2-1

Round 4 vs Death and Taxes

Game 1: I kept a decent opening with no action but a good bit of removal; it was 2 decay's, some lands, and a vet. It ground out for a while where I killed his first two plays, he played a revoker naming my top, but eventually I was able to cabal therapy his swords to plowshares, flash it back to take a flickerwisp, and then play rhino which does the job.

Game 2: I sided in 2 Toxic Deluge, 1 massacre and 1 k-grip. He builds up a fast and impressive board. I get lucky and am able to k-grip his stoneforge'd batterskull, but he still has fliers to get me down to about 9. I rip a toxic deluge for 3 (putting me to 6 but cleaning the board), he plays a Mirran Crusader, I play a rhino to put me back to 9, he swings in putting me back to 5....and I rip the second deluge, play it for 2, go down to 3....but he draws blanks and rhino finishes off the match.

3-1

I really have to say how amazing of a card Sigarda always is. People are usually surprised to see her, but its so hard to deal with that she just claims games all on her own. The two deluges in the board are amazing. I never got to play a memoricide, but I can see how with our ramp it would be awesome to just name what kills you ahead of time. Thanks to everyone on this forum who has answered questions and made suggestions in PM's for me. Its greatly appreciated! Next week SCG is coming to town and I'll be playing the legacy there so when I have some results I'll post them as well.

Cheers everyone!

[sdematt]

Go to 61 and add a Top. Where are you located? I can send a stronghold, but not sure youll get it in time.

[Dzogchen]

I'm currently at 61 (unless I mistyped something but I think it adds up). I only have two tops. I suppose I COULD go out and invest in a third top and a Stronghold. I just don't/didn't have them for last nights event. I'm sure one of the stores around here has them (Glendale, CA) so there's a few around.