You name show and tell not boseiju ;)
Originally Posted by iatee
I'm pretty sure the land is not what's beating us, but the spell cast with the land...
As a matter of fact, 2 meddling mages would mean they can't win (Show and Tell and Cunning Wish)
*I'm also a little sad Pithing Needle is useless vs. Boseiju. That would had been swell if they interacted.
So you fight Boseiju by adding Meddling Mage to lock the card Show & Tell.. Seems like a paradise scenario!
If you want to fight Boseiju, counter their cantrips and lock them ASAP with CB.
We have the best cards against Show & Tell, red blasts and flash creatures for clock
We just talked about this like 2 pages ago, but yes meddling mage is probably the best option for Omnitell that is also good in other matchups. Also, keep in mind there are no cards in omnitell that win the game if resolved off a bosiju. Whats the worst case sencario? A show and tell putting in emrakul? First, they usually only have 0-1 Emrakuls in their decks so this is rare, but we also have around 8+ answers to that maindeck. Maybe show and tell into Omniscience is worse. But again, that doesn't win the game and now their bosieju is turned off. All your counters and REBs (on omni) all work now.
The way i see this matchup e very similar to Sneak & Show.
I have in fact tried many things including Meddling Mage, Ethersworn Canonist, Humility and Pithing Needle.
Meddling Mage
You tap out to cast it, name Show & Tell and they kill you with the enchantment and vice-versa.
Omnitell will just adapt and do the same with Dream Halls.
Ethersworn Canonist
You manage the game while you have counterspells then canonist betrays you and we lose anyway.
Pithing Needle
You just never know the correct card to name Griselbrand/Sneak Atack and they can win anyway.
Humility
You cast it or drop it with Show & Tell and they resolve Jace or Echoing Truth.
Or they just resolve Sneak Attack and you finish the game looking at humility in your hand.
I'm not saying you will not have some free wins with these cards but they will not win you the majority of the games anyway.
In general you don't want many of these (1-2) in your 75 so you will not have them most of the time.
If you add a lot of these cards then you start losing to other important matchups and that is not where we want to be.
In the end, the way i have most success against Show & Tell strategies is to execute our main gameplan (CB * TOP) ASAP and drop a threat as soon as possible.
Snapcaster T2 is being just fine for me because the main problem of our deck against them is not having pressure.
Without a threat, countering a Show & Tell is just a 1 for 1 trade.
Last edited by JBMage; 03-19-2015 at 07:10 PM.
Omni-Tell have mostly cut all their bad combo parts (ie. Enter the Infinite, Dream halls) and are just trying to make a deck as consistent as possible.
The reason the deck is (suddenly) tier 1, is Dig through Time. NOTHING else changed.
Also, worst case scenario is Boseiju > SnT > Omniscience > Emrakul.
*A t2 snapcaster is fine, and if you have a 2nd in t3, that's perfect. You want to make their boseiju and ancient tombs bad plays.
Bear with me here... what about an Iona naming blue? I mean, if they have the Emrakul we're dead even if we have Nevermore/Meddling Mage naming him and they cheat in an Omniscience. At least with Iona we can prevent them from casting ANY of their spells aside from big dude, meaning they have to essentially topdeck Emrakul while at the same time facing a 2-3 turn clock. Or, if they SnT an Emrakul and we still throw in the Iona, it gives us first act and we can either try for a Terminus to reset them or dig to a Karakas.
It's not like any of the creatures we bring in against them are going to be hardcasted most of the time anyway.
For example, currently (for my meta) in my SB I have:
1x Iona, Shield of Emeria
1x Moat
1x RIP
2x Flusterstorm
2x Vendilion Clique
1x Venser, Shaper Savant
1x Blood Moon
1x Pyroclasm
2x REB
1x Supreme Verdict
1x Wear//Tear
1x Pithing Needle
Whenever I play against OmniTell, I bring in:
- 3 StP
- 3 Counterbalance
- 2 Terminus
+ 1 Iona
+ 2 Flusterstorm
+ 2 Clique
+ 1 Venser
+ 2 REB
From what I've seen a few Omnitell builds are running 1-2 Slaughter Pact to deal with a reanimated Iona then just combo off. Yea sure you can just save FoW for that but it is an out for them.
That still requires them to have it in hand, meaning it dilutes their combo plan by replacing a potential cantrip/Cunning Wish with a card that might not even hit anything.
And even if they are running Slaughter Pact, I doubt they'd bring it in against us seeing as most of the time we'd have Humility or other non-creature permanents.
Yeah, I could see Iona winning games but is she worth a sideboard slot? That is the bigger question I think.
I know she could see some use against other decks but other than Show and Tell resolving with her in your hand or an exhume when she is in your graveyard (if your opponent is dumb) she will NEVER get into play otherwise.
I just think there is better tech unless your meta is being dominated by Omnitell.
Are we discussing the possibility of adding one card in our sideboard, for one matchup, that in case our opponent casts a Show & Tell, if we have our one sideboard card in hand (just as our opponent has 1Emrakull), we maybe can win the game?
Is this a serious discussion? Are you guys really testing these ideas, like in 20-30 games how does it work? In the worst case scenario i would prefer to have my Emrakull, this way at least i could use it against Grindstone strategies and never lose..
It's not just for the OmniTell MU, it can also be brought in against SnS (present in my meta).
And there's one dude playing UR Landstill though getting to 9 mana and casting Iona is something I want to be doing, especially not when his deck is mono counterspell.
I'd play the second venser before adding an iona I'm not planning on casting. Venser is a perfectly workable card in that matchup, and he soft-locks them if you have the karakas. I prefer that to running an emrakul I'm not going to cast, since it least it has some other applications (I get the painter-stone application, but there's other ways to fight that combo that are also flexible - like needle, etc). I definitely don't cut counterbalance in that match... at least never on the play (I'd cut it on the draw if I know they're on daze/pierce). They really need to resolve cantrips to reliably get boseiju, omni and show in their hand. Sometimes they just have it all, but that's not that high a percentage, and the longer it takes them to combo the more likely you are to have venser or karakas (against show:emrakul) to mess them up.
Last edited by dysent; 03-20-2015 at 12:18 AM.
How is Iona good vs. SnS?
They don't require spells to win, if they resolve SnT. Either they drop Grizzlebees, Emrakul or Sneak Attack - Iono doesn't stop anything from that point.
Most of the time they'll drop a GBrand, meaning you can still name blue and StP him and save your counters for Sneak Attack.
Just as a note, if they show and tell, and you want to put in pithing needle, you get to see what they're putting in before you need to name something. It gets harder if you're just trying to blindly name something T1 or whatever.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
if blind, you don't have karakas, and you have no additional information about the number of red sources available to them, i'd snap name grisel 10/10.
Unless you like forgot to sideboard out your swords and terminus, there's no point in needling grisel over sneak attack. If they get a 7/7 into play you will have a hard time dealing with it outside of jace. Naming sneak attack is always correct unless it's off of a show and tell and they play grisel. We have 5+ more hard counters for show than we do sneak and sneak usually just kills us, show we can sometimes answer the fatty.
Also, Iona? Are we really discussing this?
Vendilion Clique is like the best card possible against all the Show variants. You can take the second piece out of their hand, and its a fast clock.
Containment Priest has been great for me vs Sneak Attack too.
You don't need to play terrible things that are only good if your opponent cast's SnT (Iona). That's a waste of a slot. Seriously?
Edit: Needle goes on Sneak Attack blindevery time. We're way better at fighting Show and Tell.
Are you still on the Meddling Mages in the sideboard? I've been playing to reasonable success (consistent 3-1s in a 30-40 person field of real decks) Ein's list -1 Snapcaster, -1 CB (only have 3 Chinese ones), +2 Clique main, -1 Fluster, -1 Clique, +2 Meddling Mage in the board.
Meddling Mage has been great for me in so many of the random matchups. So good against combo to board out all the Miracles and turn into a fish deck. Also seems like it has been decent in the mirror.
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