Here's how I boarded:Originally Posted by FNTwin
-1 Plains
-2 JTMS
-2 Entreat the Angels
-1 Council's Judgment
-2 Dig Through Time
+1 Wear//Tear
+2 Flusterstorm
+1 Izzet Staticaster
+2 Ethersworn Cannonist
+1 Engineered Explosives
+1 Pyroblast
Fluster might be wrong, but I want to force them to slow down and poison me in increments of 1 or 2. Could be right to have more blasts to handle Blighted Agent / fight over cantrips - hard to judge. Could probably trim another land if I wanted to. I might be taking out too many win conditions too, but they're all so slow and you need to make sure you don't die first.
If you have Needle, Tsabo's Web, Blood Moon, etc to handle Inkmoth bring them in - most games you lose are to that annoying land.
Most games you lose are when they draw too many creatures, especially the lands.
Ponder builds have a much better matchup than legend builds because you can keep up with the speed they're going at more easily.
Why do you side out Entreat vs Infect?
I feel that also 1 single flying angel is great in that matchup. The ability to be sure to block and possibly kill an Inkmoth not fearing Teferi'z Response.. is great.
It's like Terminus 5-6
It is very difficult to find room to resolve ETA even for X=1.
I've found that too, I cut both entreats.
My SBing vs infect the past couple of weeks.
-1 Counterspell
-1 Pyroblast
-2 Jace
-2 Entreat
+3 Vendilion Clique
+1 Wear // Tear
+1 EE
+1 Aethersworn Canonist
In hindsight, I'm not a fan of the canonist. It makes their Vines hard counters and is such a nonbo with Snapcaster. It slows them down, sure, but has cost me some games. I'd prefer to keep Jace in.
List for reference.
3 Snapcaster Mage
1 Counterspell
1 Pyroblast
1 Dig Through Time
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Council's Judgment
2 Entreat the Angels
4 Ponder
4 Terminus
4 Counterbalance
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Arid Mesa
2 Plains
3 Tundra
3 Volcanic Island
4 Flooded Strand
4 Island
4 Scalding Tarn
SB:
2 Red Elemental Blast
3 Vendilion Clique
3 Flusterstorm
1 Wear // Tear
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Counterspell
1 Council's Judgment
1 Pyroblast
1 Aethersworn Canonist
1 Relic of Progenitus.
That actually makes a lot of sense, I'll have to give that plan a try.
I really need to find room for a Pithing Needle somewhere
What's the Wear//Tear for? What do they bring in? Needle/Null Rod? Library?
Canonist is definitely awkward in a Snap list, but I feel preventing them from being able to pump before damage is a better trade off. And if you're worried that it turns their Vines into hard counters, don't use Swords until they make the first move. I also feel that Snap is better off as a flash blocker because it'll force them to waste a pump spell or fear losing their creature to an ambush viper.
Needle, Null rod, & Library I've seen. More importantly though, Inkmoth is an artifact creature.
Snapcaster would at most block 1 out of 3 threats, so that doesn't really happen. (Inkmoth flies, blighted agent is unblockable). It only blocks Glistener Elf. That's not good enough.
It's mostly for Nexus as it's the hardest threat for us to answer, but like you said, Null Rod and Library are cards that see play in their SB too. It's a nice catch all, and plays great with CB.
Miracles is a reactive deck, so we're forced to make the first move in a lot of spots. If they have a creature in play already, putting a Canonist on the table is very risky as they can just attack and hold up Vines/counters in safety. Even a Canonist played on an empty board gets trumped by an Inkmoth.
You can't rely on Snap as a blocker. Like alphastryk said, it only blocks Glistener Elf, and Pendelhaven negates that plan too.
There's currently no needle in my SB, but having one for Nexus would make the MU a lot easier.
The nice thing about the matchup is you're able to play slow enough to blank the dazes. Don't go jamming a CB T2.
Last edited by Whitefaces; 06-30-2015 at 12:16 PM.
Hi guys, been a long time lurker. Just wondering if anyone here is going to Lille? (except Philipp of course)
At least I am going! It's gonna be my first GP ever, and legacy above that. Maybe a bad deck to choose since I've only been playing for a little bit over half a year. But I haven't been enjoying a deck like this since Esper control return ravnica.
I've seen there have been a big talk about the more consistens version, 4 ponder Miracles. However, I have been enjoying the legendary build to a decent success. After playtesting on modo with 4 ponder, I find myself to include some on my list. Yuuta Takahashi's list was my template, in this list, I wanted to include a Cavern and (at least) 2 snapcaster mages. After SCG Baltimore, Bernard made top8 with a 2 ponder list which has made be come to a conclusion to this:
1x Arid Mesa
1x Cavern of Souls
4x Flooded Strand
5x Island
2x Karakas
1x Mountain
2x Plains
4x Scalding Tarn
1x Tundra
1x Volcanic Island
4x Brainstorm
1x Counterspell
2x Dig Through Time
4x Force of Will
2x Pyroblast
3x Swords to Plowshares
1x Entreat the Angels
2x Ponder
4x Terminus
2x Snapcaster Mage
2x Vendilion Clique
1x Venser, Shaper Savant
4x Sensei's Divining Top
4x Counterbalance
2x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
SB:
1x Counterspell
2x Ethersworn Canonist
2x Flusterstorm
1x Izzet Staticaster
2x Monastery Mentor
2x Red Elemental Blast
2x Relic of Progenitus
1x Venser, Shaper Savant
2x Wear / Tear
What do you guys think? Things I want in main but don't know what to. An extra ponder, an extra Venser, extra Clique? Maybe someone have arguments of not having the second venser main? Maybe this list is actually really bad?
I would lose the 5th Island (to 4) for the 3rd Ponder.
You don't want 2 Vensers main. I'd cut the SB Counterspell for a Containment Priest since you're not running any RIP effects, making Priest the next best thing.
I have actually not tried 3 ponder 21 lands before. Do you think it will be a little loose? Especially since I run 2 Karakas.
I'm not sure about Priest, I ran her before and wans't fond of it.
Fifth Island for Ponder is reasonable.
Counterspell and Priest fill two quite different roles, and there are already two Relic of Progenitus for the GY. I don't think it's needed honestly. What matchups would you bring it in vs that your MD can't handle?
I'd suggest at least one copy of Council's Judgment. It's clunky, but a very useful catch all. It also ups the 3CMC slot for CB with a flexible card.
Other than that the list looks solid, a nice mix of Ponder and Legends.
I played a 3 Ponder/Legends build for three rounds this past Sunday, and was happy with it.
2 Snapcaster Mage
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
4 Brainstorm
3 Ponder
4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Counterbalance
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Terminus
1 Entreat the Angels
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Dig Through Time
1 Council's Judgment
4 Force of Will
1 Counterspell
4 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
1 Arid Mesa
3 Tundra
2 Volcanic Island
4 Island
2 Plains
1 Karakas
SB:
2 Red Elemental Blast
2 Pyroblast
2 Wear // Tear
2 Monastery Mentor
2 Flusterstorm
1 Pyroclasm
1 Blood Moon
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Izzet Staticaster
Beat Omni 2-1, Deathblade 2-0, and then got smashed by Aggro Loam 1-2. The one win against Loam was when he mulled to five, and I was able to establish Counter-Top-Jace after he had already Decay'd two of my Counterbalances. The highlight was playing against Omni. In G2, a Venser in my hand (which he knew about due to Gitaxian Probe) blanked his Emrakul+Show and Tell hand and Snapcaster beats got there. G3 we fought over his Show and Tell, both burning through double FoW + blue cards. But I knew about a Clique on the top of my library, so I flipped Top and Clique'd away his Omni. Show and Tell resolved, letting me put the Counterbalance that was still in my hand into play. His hand was perfect when he went off too (Show and Tell, Omni, DTT, Wish, FoW, FoW, 2x blue cards).
I suppose in his list he doesn't need Priest. +1 on the Council's Judgment.
Very nice!
I had a similarly cool game at my LGS last night. I was tired too, so made a few misplays, but the end result was quite interesting.
I had Top + CB and a Jace ticking up, but couldn't find any three, and quite a cold deck in general despite multiple fetches and Ponder shuffles. He cast a SnT, and I knew my top cards were Pyroblast, DTT and Terminus from a Brainstorm + top activation. If I go for Pyroblast on the SnT I just lose to a FoW, so I figured having a 1 and 8 on top of my library could fight through an omni, then next turn the pyro can destroy it. Cold to a wish > Wipe Away, but not sure the other options were better. Anyway, so much for that plan, as he puts in Omni, casts another Omni then casts Emrakul. Crap. He starts his extra turn, and casts DTT. A spin from the top reveals my DTT to counter it (thank you Jacestorm!). He then attacks with Emrakul, but makes a mistake of attacking me rather than Jace (which would have forced me to Terminus mid combat, allowing him to know there's a 1CMC on top of my library and holding a Ponder. He assumes I'll bounce Emrakul next turn and he can just recast it). I sacrifice down to 1 land and go to 2 life. Second main he plays ponder, I reshuffle top putting Terminus to the top and flip it on top counting the Ponder and putting Emrakul on the bottom. So, he has 1 card in hand, and it's safe to assume it's either a blank or a cantrip. Jace starts fatesealing and I counter every cantrip I leave him with CB.
G2 was slightly less interesting, I aggressively Flusterstormed his Wishes and Clique in resp to 2 Show and Tell, taking an omni both times. I ended the game with 2 Pyroblast and a Snapcaster in hand.
Next round was against a very good TES player. He took G1 with 18 goblins turn 2 after Duressing me. G2 and G3 were long but I had enough disruption and Snaps/Cliques closed them up. The second game, carpet of flowers was generating so much mana he almost killed me with Tendrils despite not a single spell resolving through 2 CB! Was just one storm off from 16 life. Scary stuff.
Round 3 and 4 were against Death and Taxes. Terminus happened.
SBing plans
VS Omni
He was playing Grixis, black splash for Thoughtseize. I wasn't sure if he'd bring in Pyromancers, so I'd bring in 2x Terminus if I saw them game 2.
+
2 Red Elemental Blast
3 Vendilion Clique
3 Flusterstorm
1 Counterspell
1 Council's Judgment
1 Pyroblast
1 Aethersworn Canonist
-
2 Entreat the Angels
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Terminus
1 Ponder (probably should have been second plains out instead, wasn't thinking)
1 Plains
VS TES
+
3 Vendilion Clique
3 Flusterstorm
1 Wear // Tear
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Counterspell
1 Aethersworn Canonist
1 Relic of Progenitus
-
1 Pyroblast
1 Dig Through Time
1 Council's Judgment
4 Terminus
2 StP
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
VS DnT
+
3 Vendilion Clique
1 Wear//Tear
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Council's Judgment
-
1 Pyroblast
1 Counterspell
4 Counterbalance
Any criticisms are welcome, I've not been playing Miracles for that long, I'm just quite familiar with it from playing against it and watching/reading a lot of Legacy content.
If you keep SB-in Clique in so many MU, why not just MD it?
Because it's quite weak against all the red decks packing bolts etc. I just so happened to play against 2 combo decks and 2 SFM decks.
I don't think reasoning like that would convince Lossett and other Legend Miracles players to move Cliques to the SB. If Bolt is not targeting the Cliques, would you care to guess what bolts would be targeting? If Decay is not targeting Clique, what would be Decay's target?
Sure, but I'm not playing a Legends list. You are right, Cliques do come in a very large amount of the time, but they're generally a swap for Jace and Entreats as I need to keep the win condition count up. In the same vein, I don't think people like Phillip would buy an argument like what you put forward to play Cliques in the main. There's no Karakas in the 75, the MD is also very tight. What would you cut?
3 Snapcaster Mage
1 Counterspell
1 Pyroblast
1 Dig Through Time
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Council's Judgment
2 Entreat the Angels
4 Ponder
4 Terminus
4 Counterbalance
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Arid Mesa
2 Plains
3 Tundra
3 Volcanic Island
4 Flooded Strand
4 Island
4 Scalding Tarn
Thanks for feedbacks guys! Any pros/cons for having Council main/side(if it's worth to run in side)? I used to run Council before, it was indeed a nice catch all, but the clunkiness felt really bad.
What do you suggest to remove for Council?
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