[Deck] bUrg Tempo

[laserstone]

If you have the resources Belcher or Oops all spells would dominate your meta.

We get 18-20 people each event, and the other 10 are solidly blue. Chances are, I'd go between 2-2 and 0-4. Three months ago, when the entire store was playing Death and Taxes, I'd have agreed with you :)

[Lormador]

I had a great tournament down at the LGS, 26 players. Mini-report.

Round 1 (Merfolk) 2-1

Great opponent, he seemed to know what to play around at all times. He almost got me. G1 he mulled to 5 and I start with a DRS. He got land and started playing things ( into 2 Daze). I flooded out a little despite cantripping, but he kept playing lands and, eventually, TNN. I was out of Dazes at this point but got a Delver going, so we were off to the races. The land flood paid off when I hardcast Force of Will to get rid of a Phantasmal Image, but he had a second. I built up my Lightning Bolt collection and found the last one just in time.

G2: Kept 1 land with Brainstorm, Cursecatcher foiled it. Chalice of the Void came down and I didn't get mana to deal with it quickly. I discarded Ancient Grudge to hand size, but it got Dazed. On to game 3.

G3: First DRS, double Delver. He countered the Brainstorm that would have flipped both but they flipped naturally anyway. He still got me into a tight race with some big fish, but Delvers took away most of his life. A bolt and a drain finished the job.

Round 2: UG Cloudpost 1-1

This guy always used to beat me last year. I was out for revenge, but we ran out of time on game 3 (we both had slow hands). Game 2 was a very close thing. I could probably have won if I had used Pyroblasts more aggressively to fill my graveyard and drain him, but I was fearful to waste them on something that wasn't Show and Tell. He eventually used Candelabra and Cavern to put in a Primeval Titan gained a bunch of life, and that was that. Damned if I did, damned if I didn't.

Round 3: Junk 2-0

This guy had an interesting deck with Sinkhole, Vindicate, Goyf, and the usual suspects. G1 I got a Deathrite through his barrage of hand disruption spells, got into a race with a 4/5 Goyf and Dark Confidant, and won that race on the back of a few drains, Delver, and a pair of Lightning Bolts. In the second game, he Abrupt Decayed my first Sylvan Library but didn't have an answer to the second. His deck stalled on lands while the library started putting out 2 cards each turn.

Round 4: DnT 2-0

I Forced an Aether Vial on T1 (losing the roll), and it turned out that my opponent had kept a 1 land hand. Daze kept the scary stuff away until I could get a TNN. There was a race with a Spirit of the Labyrinth until Lightning Bolt and an unflipped Delver chump block sealed the deal. Game 2 I faced double Vials, Thalia, and Flickerwisp with 4 lands and a hand of Brainstorm + fetch. Brainstorm found the 1-of Forked Bolt and I was back in the game. DRS and cards that did things followed.

Round 5: Enchantress 2-0

In game 1, triple Daze really inconvenienced my opponent while Delver attacked him. He lost an Enchantress' Presence and GSZ X=4 to the Dazes. After that it was took late. I boarded out the Dazes for game 2 and he carefully played around them. Force killed one GSZ X=2. He landed an Enchantress (Pierce paid for) and Elephant Grass, but by then it was too late. Delvers and drains would kill him before he could untap with this stuff to use it, and that was the match,

Props: Sylvan Library, Forked Bolt and True-Name Nemesis. No one wants to get into an attrition war against an active Library, and it was also great against the control deck that didn't care about my life total. Forked Bolt turned a loss into a win nearly by itself, and TNN put me in races that I won against decks that could have blocked / swung through Goofy.

Slops: I kept a couple of one-land hands today, and this could have gone badly. I should work on my mulligan skills.

Overall, I certainly can't complain, I did a lot of winning in this tournament. It was a blast. I'd forgotten to switch out one of the TNNs for a Tasigur like I'd planned, but it worked out. I faced a Karakas deck, so perhaps it was for the best.

[Manipulato]

I had a great tournament down at the LGS, 26 players. Mini-report.

Round 1 (Merfolk) 2-1

Great opponent, he seemed to know what to play around at all times. He almost got me. G1 he mulled to 5 and I start with a DRS. He got land and started playing things ( into 2 Daze). I flooded out a little despite cantripping, but he kept playing lands and, eventually, TNN. I was out of Dazes at this point but got a Delver going, so we were off to the races. The land flood paid off when I hardcast Force of Will to get rid of a Phantasmal Image, but he had a second. I built up my Lightning Bolt collection and found the last one just in time.

G2: Kept 1 land with Brainstorm, Cursecatcher foiled it. Chalice of the Void came down and I didn't get mana to deal with it quickly. I discarded Ancient Grudge to hand size, but it got Dazed. On to game 3.

G3: First DRS, double Delver. He countered the Brainstorm that would have flipped both but they flipped naturally anyway. He still got me into a tight race with some big fish, but Delvers took away most of his life. A bolt and a drain finished the job.

Round 2: UG Cloudpost 1-1

This guy always used to beat me last year. I was out for revenge, but we ran out of time on game 3 (we both had slow hands). Game 2 was a very close thing. I could probably have won if I had used Pyroblasts more aggressively to fill my graveyard and drain him, but I was fearful to waste them on something that wasn't Show and Tell. He eventually used Candelabra and Cavern to put in a Primeval Titan gained a bunch of life, and that was that. Damned if I did, damned if I didn't.

Round 3: Junk 2-0

This guy had an interesting deck with Sinkhole, Vindicate, Goyf, and the usual suspects. G1 I got a Deathrite through his barrage of hand disruption spells, got into a race with a 4/5 Goyf and Dark Confidant, and won that race on the back of a few drains, Delver, and a pair of Lightning Bolts. In the second game, he Abrupt Decayed my first Sylvan Library but didn't have an answer to the second. His deck stalled on lands while the library started putting out 2 cards each turn.

Round 4: DnT 2-0

I Forced an Aether Vial on T1 (losing the roll), and it turned out that my opponent had kept a 1 land hand. Daze kept the scary stuff away until I could get a TNN. There was a race with a Spirit of the Labyrinth until Lightning Bolt and an unflipped Delver chump block sealed the deal. Game 2 I faced double Vials, Thalia, and Flickerwisp with 4 lands and a hand of Brainstorm + fetch. Brainstorm found the 1-of Forked Bolt and I was back in the game. DRS and cards that did things followed.

Round 5: Enchantress 2-0

In game 1, triple Daze really inconvenienced my opponent while Delver attacked him. He lost an Enchantress' Presence and GSZ X=4 to the Dazes. After that it was took late. I boarded out the Dazes for game 2 and he carefully played around them. Force killed one GSZ X=2. He landed an Enchantress (Pierce paid for) and Elephant Grass, but by then it was too late. Delvers and drains would kill him before he could untap with this stuff to use it, and that was the match,

Props: Sylvan Library, Forked Bolt and True-Name Nemesis. No one wants to get into an attrition war against an active Library, and it was also great against the control deck that didn't care about my life total. Forked Bolt turned a loss into a win nearly by itself, and TNN put me in races that I won against decks that could have blocked / swung through Goofy.

Slops: I kept a couple of one-land hands today, and this could have gone badly. I should work on my mulligan skills.

Overall, I certainly can't complain, I did a lot of winning in this tournament. It was a blast. I'd forgotten to switch out one of the TNNs for a Tasigur like I'd planned, but it worked out. I faced a Karakas deck, so perhaps it was for the best.

Gratz! Decklist?

[Lormador]

I worked for weeks tweaking a Grixis Delver list, and I had it working pretty well... then I tried Petr Sochurek's 6th place GP list and it was just a lot better. TNN is the army I have, so the switch of Goyf for these was made. That's what I played. There's only one other change I'd like to make to the list to fit my own personal taste (switching out one TNN for a Tasigur), but I forgot to make this change for the event.

I think the decks that run TNN instead of Goofy should take a hard look at Tasigur and the zombie fish, the tempo mirrors have been pretty rough without them. RUG was wrecking me before I put in a Tasigur.

[Manipulato]

# Goddik & Einherjer: Any new results or interesting points about 4c Delver or 4c Midrange?

[Goddik]

Not playing alot of magic at the moment, so no new developments.

Will be happy to provide advice on
-Build
-Matchups
-Sideboarding

Let me know if there is something specific you would like. I have fairly detailed thoughts on most of these.

[Manipulato]

Not playing alot of magic at the moment, so no new developments.

Will be happy to provide advice on
-Build
-Matchups
-Sideboarding

Let me know if there is something specific you would like. I have fairly detailed thoughts on most of these.

I thought about this 4c Midrange list (Without Delvers) because I want a better game against Miracles & Goyf/TNN does not die to bolts which are heavily played at the moment.
Sadly I had no chance to test it...What do you think? I´m not sure about the manabase, especially about the number of the wastelands...

Maindeck: 60 Cards

12 Creatures
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Deathrite Shaman
2 True-Name Nemesis
2 Snapcaster Mage

29 Spells
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
3 Thoughtseize

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Dig Through Time
1 Sylvan Library

4 Lightning Bolt
2 Abrupt Decay

19 Lands
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
2 Tropical Island
1 Taiga
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Polluted Delta
2 Wasteland

Sideboard: 15 Cards
2 Pyroblast
2 Golgari Charm
1 Grafdiggers Cage
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Forked Bolt
1 Dread of Night
1 Thoughtseize
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Null Rod
1 Pithing Needle
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Sylvan Library

[Goddik]

4 Deathrite Shaman
3 True-Name Nemesis
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Snapcaster Mage

4 Force of Will
3 Daze
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Dig Through Time
3 Thoughtseize
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Abrupt Decay

4 Underground Sea
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Tropical Island
2 Volcanic Island
3 Wasteland
1 Badlands
4 Polluted Delta

2 Envelop
1 Thoughtseize
3 Pyroblast
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Golgari Charm
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Abrupt Decay
2 Life from the Loam

Here is my current list. The two loams are flex slots that need to do something in grindy matchups.

I think the differences in the maindeck are almost self-explanatory. The two wastelands are certainly defensible. I tend to board my wastelands out anyways.

A few notes on our sideboards
-gg charm versus toxic deluge. Toxic Deluge is much much more versatile. -2 is much better than -1. If i could play 4 i would instantly cut my gg charms. Tey are simply much better against any matchup that plays stoneforge mystic or deathrite shaman. I originally started playing it when i noticed that i kept loosing games to stoneblade decks on board states where they had a shaman and a stoneforge mystic. With toxic you can often survive a landed batterskull. I have often considered cutting the gg-charms for massacres, but as long as pyromancer is around i guess i will keep them.
- my sideboard is more focused. This is generally a result of playing Jace, which on the 1 hand allow me to grind out nearly every midrange matchup, but on the other hand also requires you to have relevant cards in your deck to allow you to brainstorm to victory. I therefore try to avoid narrow cards like dread of night. If you are not running jace this is more defensible
-Pithing needle and null rod: These i had originally, but have gradually started to cut as the jaces + digs allowed me to murder miracles easily without them. If you are not on the jace plan then these hold alot of value against dnt and miracles and i can certainly get behind them. Do you really need these 2 + ancient grudge?
-Gravyard hate: I am not a fan. The cards i want to hate on are life from the loam and dig through time. Neither can really be easily hated on with the gravyard hate available to us. Nemesis is way better against loam anyways
-Anti spell cards: here i would really consider envelops. They are generally amazing against all kinds of combo and miracles, and are even excellent against elves.

[Goddik]

The tarmogoyfs are btw. amazing against grixis and rug. They singlehandedly turn those matchups around, by letting you put on some sustainable preassure, as compared to the delvers which tend to die instantly.

[Manipulato]

4 Deathrite Shaman
3 True-Name Nemesis
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Snapcaster Mage

4 Force of Will
3 Daze
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
4 Dig Through Time
3 Thoughtseize
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Abrupt Decay

4 Underground Sea
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Tropical Island
2 Volcanic Island
3 Wasteland
1 Badlands
4 Polluted Delta

2 Envelop
1 Thoughtseize
3 Pyroblast
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Golgari Charm
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Abrupt Decay
2 Life from the Loam

Here is my current list. The two loams are flex slots that need to do something in grindy matchups.

I think the differences in the maindeck are almost self-explanatory. The two wastelands are certainly defensible. I tend to board my wastelands out anyways.

A few notes on our sideboards
-gg charm versus toxic deluge. Toxic Deluge is much much more versatile. -2 is much better than -1. If i could play 4 i would instantly cut my gg charms. Tey are simply much better against any matchup that plays stoneforge mystic or deathrite shaman. I originally started playing it when i noticed that i kept loosing games to stoneblade decks on board states where they had a shaman and a stoneforge mystic. With toxic you can often survive a landed batterskull. I have often considered cutting the gg-charms for massacres, but as long as pyromancer is around i guess i will keep them.
- my sideboard is more focused. This is generally a result of playing Jace, which on the 1 hand allow me to grind out nearly every midrange matchup, but on the other hand also requires you to have relevant cards in your deck to allow you to brainstorm to victory. I therefore try to avoid narrow cards like dread of night. If you are not running jace this is more defensible
-Pithing needle and null rod: These i had originally, but have gradually started to cut as the jaces + digs allowed me to murder miracles easily without them. If you are not on the jace plan then these hold alot of value against dnt and miracles and i can certainly get behind them. Do you really need these 2 + ancient grudge?
-Gravyard hate: I am not a fan. The cards i want to hate on are life from the loam and dig through time. Neither can really be easily hated on with the gravyard hate available to us. Nemesis is way better against loam anyways
-Anti spell cards: here i would really consider envelops. They are generally amazing against all kinds of combo and miracles, and are even excellent against elves.

Thx for the detailed answer! Here are my thought´s & experience´s:

- I really found Toxic Deluge way to clunky in a delver deck, sure we would not play delver anymore but on 2 we kill everything exept for Goyf (Including our own TNN) which I found to be suboptimal. Especially against DnT I was never able to cast this thing...I find Golgari Charm superior to TD because it has 3 good modes. Destroying a Library, CB, regenare a creature to AD, Bolt + instant speed is really really sweet. I think 2 Chram + 2 Deluge are really a overkill.

- I tried Envelop because I thought it is really great against Elves & Miracles, but at the end of the day I was always wishing it was a Pierce/Flusterstorm because I played not against those 2 decks and it was really bad against everything else... I think its a really specific kind of narrow card...I like having flexible cards like Pierce/Flusterstorm or Charm...Maybe we have different phylosophies here

- Jace is great against all these BGx MU or Miracles but currently I´m really afraid of opposin Pyroblast which are everywhere...And he´s not thaaat great against YP or Mentor token...Especially Mentor is heavily played in germany and I will not bring in Deluge to handle those...But ok he´s worth a slot...

- The Grafdiggers Cage can pe replaced for sure, I never boarded it in, not even in 9 Rounds of legacy in Lille. But I really liked the Nihil Spellbomb because it shuts down Loam, P. Fire, slows down opposing DTT, shrinks Mongeese etc...

- I really like your plan of cutting delver because its the weakest creature in the deck and a bad lategame card. Especially because it die´s to EVERYTHING...Goyf + TNN are just panzer which roll over the opponent and are difficult to handle in this Bolt/Blast meta...

[jedi_gof]

Nice list Goodstuff Goddik :-)

One question though : is the 62 cards intentional? :-)
Which cards are represented in too large a quantity

[Jonathan Alexander]

Played this list in the Jelly Jam and couple local tournaments:

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
1 Snapcaster mage
3 Tarmogoyf

1 Sylvan Library

2 Abrupt Decay
4 Brainstorm
4 Daze
3 Dig Through Time
4 Force of Will
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Spell Pierce

2 Flooded Strand
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
2 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
3 Wasteland

4 Ponder

Sideboard:
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 True-Name Nemesis
2 Dread of Night
2 Dismember
1 Electrickery
2 Flusterstorm
1 Golgari Charm
3 Pyroblast
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

The deck in general feels nice but I hate 16+3 lands. 3 copies of Wasteland seems correct, but in no way is it necessary to play this many lands. The deck feels a little light against combo but is alright otherwise.

[ironclad8690]

Anyone testing Jace, Vryn's Prodigy? Some guy is doing well on modo with him and after eternal weekend I am curious to test, but $60 on standard cards doesnt sound fun.

[Secretly.A.Bee]

Seems good. I'd give it a try if I were you. Looter effects have historically been strong in tempo lists, and his other effects are mostly relevant.

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

[AfroSmile]

Anyone testing Jace, Vryn's Prodigy? Some guy is doing well on modo with him and after eternal weekend I am curious to test, but $60 on standard cards doesnt sound fun.

Yeah, I was asking myself the same question. What does it really bring to deck?
The list remove a land and a dig for 2 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy. And the sideboard choice seems weird to me.

Kolaghan's Command is cool but ma be hard to cast in matchup like death&taxes.
Scavenging ooze is not too mana intensive for the deck?
Grafdigger's Cage and playing snapcaster mage + 2 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy aren't a good synergies. In some matchup, you may want both. (Flash backing forked bolt or bolt in matchup like elves is really good.)

I need some explanation.

[Contract Killer]

Yeah, I was asking myself the same question. What does it really bring to deck?
The list remove a land and a dig for 2 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy. And the sideboard choice seems weird to me.

Kolaghan's Command is cool but ma be hard to cast in matchup like death&taxes.
Scavenging ooze is not too mana intensive for the deck?
Grafdigger's Cage and playing snapcaster mage + 2 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy aren't a good synergies. In some matchup, you may want both. (Flash backing forked bolt or bolt in matchup like elves is really good.)

I need some explanation.

I've been looking at the list and thinking about trying it out myself with some minor changes. I think not playing 4 wastes is hypocritical when you're playing daze. Like why are you bothering playing that type of deck when it needs 4 of each of those cards to operate well. I'm 100% certain the playing the 4th waste over the 9th fetch is better.

The advantage to jace in it is that it's a snapcaster for 2 mana so long as it tables. Which is really good since snapcaster despite being what tempo decks want is mana intensive anyway you look at it with it being effectively 3cmc. The nice part about jace that I don't think many people have noticed yet is his -3 is not strictly flashback.

This is marginal but it does let you cast force from the bin for it's alternate cost. I haven't played this deck (I play rug delver), but that seems extremely helpful by allowing you to sequence your threats such that jace -> table -> flip activate -3 to allow you to play out another threat with force back up from the bin.

As for his sideboard I think it's fine. The scooze is a bit slow, but it's the 4th goyf with an up side in most match ups where you want it. The cages I'm pretty sure are just for actual graveyard hate match ups. They're good vs elves too, but I don't think that's what he was packing them for. That aside even vs elves I'm pretty sure I would board the following:
- 2 pierce, - 4 daze // + 2 cage, + 2 charm, + command, forked bolt

The main reason why I came over to this thread was to see what people thought of this list. I'm thinking about picking up some of the jaces next chance I get. The list seems really solid. The new jace I think is a more flexible snapcaster and a better fit for tempo decks that have been trying to jam snap. It's less mana intensive and has some interesting upsides with force or submerge. In addition to that despite him having to table with 4 deathrite, and 4 delver they only have so much removal and jace is just a 2 of so I don't think his body is that big of a problem.

[Griselpuff]

Surprised it's taken this long for this deck to enter DTB. I like this deck even more than I liked UR Delver. It's a really midrangey deck that also has explosive UR Delver like draws. Noah created a monster

[iostream]

Surprised it's taken this long for this deck to enter DTB. I like this deck even more than I liked UR Delver. It's a really midrangey deck that also has explosive UR Delver like draws. Noah created a monster

Great job at Legacy Champs! Just wondering: what's your opinion about the list you played versus the European-style lists that are more like "BUG Delver with Bolts"? I've wondered if the extra greed is worthwhile.

[Dragonslayer_90]

Surprised it's taken this long for this deck to enter DTB. I like this deck even more than I liked UR Delver. It's a really midrangey deck that also has explosive UR Delver like draws. Noah created a monster

I am also surprised Grixis Delver wasn't represented in some fashion in the DtB till now. However, isn't this the wrong thread for that deck? It seems like this thread it more for the full on 4C decks, which atm are basically BUG Delver with bolts and blasts. Not really a big deal, but it seems like it would be good for Grixis Delver to have its own thread.

[ironclad8690]

I am also surprised Grixis Delver wasn't represented in some fashion in the DtB till now. However, isn't this the wrong thread for that deck? It seems like this thread it more for the full on 4C decks, which atm are basically BUG Delver with bolts and blasts. Not really a big deal, but it seems like it would be good for Grixis Delver to have its own thread.

Tcdecks counts Grixis Delver as Grixis Pyromancer, which is the only reason "Thieves" is in DTB (it doesn't have near the kind of paper representation needed to be a DTB). Don't try to talk about Grixis Delver in the Thieves thread though, you will be shunned.