I recently played a bunch of games against Omni and am starting to feel like that matchup isn't too bad. Game 1 of course we lose unless we land an early chalice.
This was my board for that playtesting session:
1x Choke
2x Ethersworn Canonist
2x Golgari Charm
2x Grafdigger's Cage
1x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Reclamation Sage
1x Vryn Wingmare
2x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2x Toxic Deluge
1x Umezawa's Jitte
(1x choke, 1x qasali in the main)
I'd board in Choke, Canonists, Rec Sage, Thalias, and Wingmare. This gives me 5 cards that when revealed off S&T stop them for the turn. In that 1 turn I need to find my 3x Zenith or 2x disenchant dudes. If not, well it depends what I showed in.
Wingmare was in the board mostly because a friend of mine was convincing me to play 3 thalia and I didn't wanna play 3 of a legend. It turned out to be pretty sweet but I don't think it is correct.
I'm gonna play a Teeg in the Wingmare slot because it seems very good in this meta and I kind of want a second.
The Golgari Charms did not come in because they basically only help in the situation that I stopped the combo turn and don't have dudes or zeniths to finish the job with. That might not be correct.
Thanks for the post. First, since I missed something here, what's your 2x disenchant creatures? I only see the rec sage?Originally Posted by apocolyps6
Also, what do you do when they SnT with more than 1 mana up? Or have Emrakul in hand already? Thalia DOES absolutely help but it still feels like a grind to win with her on the table but at least I don't get instantly blown out.
Golgari Charms should absolutely come in. While the glory-play is Ethersworn Canonist into Golgari Charm, a Golgari Charm alone can get there. Just wait for them to put their first spell on the stack and hope that their shields are down.
Probably a Qasali Pridemage in the main. It's at least what I personally sport and generally a solid option. Doubles as a great clock (3/3 for 2cc) and hate when you need it.
I bring in Golgari Charms. Sure, it's a mediocre out to Omniscience, but we have worse cards in the main. Besides, it deals with Young Peezy, which a number of Omni decks pack in the sideboard, as well as Blood Moon (a possibility against that deck).
The other disenchant dude was a Qasali pridemage.
You guys are right, I should have put in the charms. Especially so because they kill YP.
Tho their pyro is lame against us as their spells don't actually do anything fair and the strategy gets kind of splash-hated by the white chicks and chalices.
If the opponent has S&T with 1 mana up that 1 spell is often not enough to win the game. If they have more than 1, I'm hopefully able to waste a non-basic or land a choke. In the situation that they find their Emrakul I'm kind of screwed. The odds are not great, but now they are feeling more 40-60 than 20-80.
I have played against a few opponents who've brought in Young Pyromancer. It's definitely not the right play and I've won every time they went the Pyromancer route, but the bastard can(and did) catch you off guard since all targeted removal is usually boarded out, so I do feel that it's a relevant factor of Golgari Charm's utility.
That's an interesting choice, I like it. May I ask what you cut in order to make room for the Pridemage? I've always been a big fan of that card but I find the main is SO PACKED, I don't want to cut anything.
Thanks to all for the advice - I noticed a lot of people are running Slaughter Games but with any success? Feels slow to me but for some reason, I never draw it when I need to. Im sure a SG on SnT is basically game over but it never seems to work that way for me. Maybe small sample size...
You, and many others really wouldn't like what I took out, so I'm not tempted to answer your question. But safe to say that while Pridemage isn't necessary by any means, it's definitely a solid addition to the deck.
As for Slaughter Games, yeah, it costs 4cc and it can be seen as "slow", but it serves as a very effective mid-end game against combo and a variety of other things. And, unlike other 4cc bullshit like Night of Souls Betrayal or Cool Planeswalker #5 or my shitty Boil, it can't be countered. So long as you can live till turn three against OmniShow and have Slaughter Games in hand, you basically win the game. I'd say get a better sample size before you denounce it. I only run one unlike many others because I find its application to be too narrow, but Slaughter Games definitely gets the job done.
Ohhhhhhhhhhhh now I'm really curious :D but I understand if you don't want to share. I'm gonna guess Deathrite Shaman, but just a guess, don't have to confirm or deny lol!
Thanks for the info and fair point about slaugher games but don't you find 1 really hard to draw when facing off against Omni? I assume that's likely the only deck you bring it in for (naming SnT wins the game outright) but wouldn't the 2 in the SB give you at least some decent chance to draw it in your first 10 cards? I'm speculating of course, it just feels like an all or nothing card to me and I guess that's why I'm hesitant to dedicate precious sideboard slots to it. I've been debating cutting 1 leyline and going down to 2 -- while it's a rock against graveyard-centric decks, it's a pretty shitty top deck if you don't have it in play off the opener. 4 cc is far too slow against decks it wants to play against, however, the 3 gives me a greater certainly of having one in my opening hand.As for Slaughter Games, yeah, it costs 4cc and it can be seen as "slow", but it serves as a very effective mid-end game against combo and a variety of other things. And, unlike other 4cc bullshit like Night of Souls Betrayal or Cool Planeswalker #5 or my shitty Boil, it can't be countered. So long as you can live till turn three against OmniShow and have Slaughter Games in hand, you basically win the game. I'd say get a better sample size before you denounce it. I only run one unlike many others because I find its application to be too narrow, but Slaughter Games definitely gets the job done.
Overall though, I really like this deck - it's much stronger than I was expecting tbh
It wouldn't really be too thrilling of a conversation, and might actually be slightly harrowing.
"So, jelly, what was the change?"
"I did X."
"You're a fucking idiot."
"I know."
PM me the change if you don't want to share it. I certainly don't have enough experience with this monster to call you a moron for the change.
Let me call you an idiot. Plz?
In exchange I am gonna let you call me one, i took out 1 lili for a kologahns command :/
You're a fucking idiot.
But I'm still not saying. :V
In other news, Scavenging Ooze continues to wreck face and I love him.
Calling it now, you cut a Bobby and are trying to save face >:D
I just want to add I'm still on the Slaughter Games train, partly because this deck has the dubious distinction of probably being the "best Slaughter Games deck". We fit the color casting requirements and can cast it on turn 3 or even turn 2. Yes, its a silly card, but it can definitely be super good. I side it against all sorts of decks if I have definite cuts but am out of particularly relevant cards to bring in for that matchup.
He's one of my favorite creatures in the deck. Not only is he a good beater, with a way to gain life, he completely man-handles lands and other graveyard decks if he's left unchecked.
Huge fan, considering adding a second but I literally can't find a single card I want to cut (maybe the 2nd Barren moor?).
Better up the number on the Zenith count than the Ooze count no? You never want 2 in play anyway...
That feel when breakers put you at 18th. :(
Played at a small legacy side event this past saturday. Went 2-2, was super disappointed. Beat Merfolk and Omnitell and lost to Burn and this G/B hexmage/depths deck that played crop rotation, sylvan scrying, living wish, loam and crucible so he basically wasted me out of the game and then was able to make a 20/20 and kill me. He even had Not of this World to counter my Karakas activation.
I did try two changes, one in the main and one in the side.
Changes in the Main: -1 Liliana of the Veil, +1 Kolaghan's Command
Changes to the Side: -1 Engineered Plague, +1 Night of Souls' Betrayal
I only saw Kolaghan's Command once all day and that was on a Sylvan activation and I didn't even want to draw it as I didn't have access to red mana. I wanted to try it out as it's a nice value card but the fact that I prioritize red mana so low in the lands that I fetch up means that it's pretty much a dead card until the late game. I'll probably replace the command back with the Liliana.
I actually liked the Night of Souls' Betrayal and I had no issue with casting it so I'll keep in the board for some more testing.
I had meant to expand upon this when I came home, but totally forgot. Went 6-2 and made 18th after breakers at the SCG Worcester Sunday Legacy event.
25*Land
1*Forest
1*Barren Moor
3*Bayou
3*Grove of the Burnwillows
1*Karakas
1*Maze of Ith
1*Savannah
2*Scrubland
1*Taiga
2*Tranquil Thicket
4*Verdant Catacombs
4*Wasteland
1*Windswept Heath
13*Creatures
4*Dark Confidant
1*Scavenging Ooze
1*Deathrite Shaman
1*Gaddock Teeg
4*Knight of the Reliquary
1*Qasali Pridemage
1*Dryad Arbor
22*Other Spells
3*Liliana of the Veil
3*Punishing Fire
2*Green Sun's Zenith
2*Life from the Loam
2*Sylvan Library
3*Abrupt Decay
3*Chalice of the Void
4*Mox Diamond
Sideboard
2*Ethersworn Canonist
1*Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1*Engineered Plague
3*Leyline of the Void
1*Thoughtseize
1*Toxic Deluge
2*Golgari Charm
1*Maelstrom Pulse
2*Slaughter Games
1*Wear // Tear
Grixis Delver: 0-2
Knew the guy I played against. Really bad luck in both games. Lost the dice roll, saw no removal, and he found his singleton Kholgan's Command in a timely fashion in both games without the help of cantrips.
RW Painter: 1-2
Grindstone. Painter. Kill. Game two I wiped the floor with him. Game three I had a winning hand (Mox Diamond Abrupt Decay Fetchland), but he opened up with a turn one Blood Moon and I got wrecked.
MUD: 2-0
Game one he opened up with an extremely fast Wurmcoil Engine that brought me down to four life, but he stalled on land so I used a Green Sun's Zenith to grab Knight of the Reliquary to grab Maze of Ith and proceeded to Wastelock him with Maze of Ith stalling until I found enough Punishing Fires to burn out the Wurmcoil Engine and its subsequent tokens. Game two was a hopeless for him. Two Mox Diamond, Loam, and Wasteland. He went land->go and never made it into the game.
RUG Delver: 2-1
Game one he Wastelands and Stifles very carefully and I end up losing to a gaggle of Geese. Games two and three I do what I do.
Miracles: 2-0
A friend. I forget the details, but they're largely inconsequential anyway. Outside of one in a million god draws, he never had a chance, but we knew that as soon as we saw our names on the pairing board so we at least had a good bit of laughs while it happened. One highlight is that I used Maze of Ith on an attacking Deathrite Shaman for extra damage. Hardcore.
Merfolk: 2-1
Turn one Chalice on the play is great, right? Right? And then the first draw is another Chalice, so I lose game one. Games two and three I have Punishing Fires and sweepers galore and rain all over his parade. At one point, since our games had dragged a little bit, we had a crowd around us and they got to watch me hit three copies of True-Name Nemesis (Phantasmal Image) with one Toxic Deluge. We also had a good laugh when a player at the table next to us called over a judge and covertly asked "does this do with that what I think it does?"
OmniShow: 2-0
Knowing it's do-or-die, I almost shit my pants once I found out what he was running. His first plays of the game were two basic Islands and a Preordain, so it was immediately apparent, and I knew my only chance for victory was him bricking. Eventually he cast Show and Tell into Omniscience and I put a Gaddock Teeg into play. He looked at Teeg, frowned, and passed turn. Yaaay! Eventually I get there, but he revealed afterwards that Teeg did nothing other than deliver two damage per turn and that his hand was just naturally bricked with a bunch of counterspells. Game two I had hate for days. Thalia starts the early game while Ethersworn Canonist sits in hand. At one point when reaching for my graveyard I accidentally flip over Slaughter Games from the top of my library. We call a judge, I get a warning, and I sadly shuffle my deck... Only to draw Slaughter Games anyway a few turns later. I name Show and Tell while leaving a Karakas open for Through the Breech, and he concedes.
Miracles: 2-0
Game one ends before I can even figure out if he's playing Mentor or not, and game two confirms that he is playing Mentor when I sift through his deck with Slaughter Games for Terminus.
All in all, it was a great fukken day. All of my opponents were great people and I had a lot of laughs. Even my opponent who barely spoke English was a blast to play with. I, as said, didn't make top sixteen thanks to the damned breakers, but it was still a good run and I'm definitely happy with it. Props go out to Slaughter Games. I realized before I finished writing down my decklist that Boil was basically a counterable Slaughter Games that only really comes out ahead against Grixis/BURG, so I walked up to the dealers beforehand and bumped up to two copies of Slaughter Games.
Thanks very much for the tournament report, I enjoyed reading it.
Did you find Slaughter games all that helpful and which matchups did you board it in against? This is the one card I would LIKE to keep in my SB but can barely find the room (wow this decklist is tight).
Side note but cutting a chalice for the pridemage is an interesting choice ;) Did you find the pridemage helpful? Did you miss the 4th chalice?
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