[Deck] The Rock

[Mr. Safety]

How do people feel about Knight of the Reliquary? Garruk Relentless? I know deathrite fights for graveyars lands but knight can still be very strong. Garruk was a pet card of mine a while back that did a lot of good work, and I feel that he would negate plows/terminus.

[sdematt]

How do people feel about Knight of the Reliquary? Garruk Relentless? I know deathrite fights for graveyars lands but knight can still be very strong. Garruk was a pet card of mine a while back that did a lot of good work, and I feel that he would negate plows/terminus.

It's great against Miracles, but only okay against Grixis and god awful against Omni.

Realistically, if you want to beat Miracles, you play a combination of Teegs, Chokes, Needles, and Grips. Grip is likely your highest impact sideboard card right now since it also does insane work against OmniTell. They can't beat that card unless they have natural Emrakul. Teeg does tons of work against Miracles and against the DTT decks.

I'll post my most recent iteration in a few.

-Matt

[Mr. Safety]

Based on that, I would build my sideboard thusly:

1x teeg (one main)
2x choke
2x needle
2x lingering souls
2x zp
2x kgrip
2x surgical
2x scooze

I think that would be a little weaker to storm without a canonist. Maindeck souls would make room. I could easily cut a sculler and another card for souls main.

[sdematt]

Based on that, I would build my sideboard thusly:

1x teeg (one main)
2x choke
2x needle
2x lingering souls
2x zp
2x kgrip
2x surgical
2x scooze

I think that would be a little weaker to storm without a canonist. Maindeck souls would make room. I could easily cut a sculler and another card for souls main.

How many people play yard strats in your meta? 4 pieces is a lot.

-Matt

[BearsandSquires]

Matt, can you post your latest version if you get a chance

[sdematt]

On mobile, j'excuse.

4 confidant
4 drs
3 goyf
3 sfm
1 ooze
2 sculler

3 thoughtseize
2 therapy
4 decay
3 stp
3 souls
2 equips
3 sylvan learning center
2 gsz

22 lands with arbor

3 grip
2 ZP
2 Needle
2 choke
2 teeg
1 safekeeper
3 open (likely 2 canonist and another ZP since I feel like we are favoured against Miracles, and only okay against Omni. Id like to shore up the Grixis so at least we are okay against 2 of 3).

Safekeeper is a possible cut, but its very good. Cutting sfm down to 3 may be wrong. So cutting a goyf here to go to 2 may be okay since im at 2 zenith. Grixis just cant handle goyf. They have to play cut and other garbage removal, and ZP is game over for them

[Secretly.A.Bee]

Some time ago I requested help, was responded to, but I had some family matters to attend to. Thanks for the reply, Matt, sorry for not replying. Here is the 76, I only own one Choke, but I'm getting more.

4 DRS
1 Scooze
2 Sculler
3 Confidant
4 SFM
4 Goyf

3 L. Souls
1 BSkull
1 Jitte
2 GSZ
2 Library
3 StP
4 AD
2 Hymn
3 Thoughtseize

1 Plains
1 Swamp
1 Forest
1 Arbor
1 Village (I want to play Stirring Wildwood here, but idk if there is a reason not to)
1 Savannah
2 Scrubland
3 Bayou
2 Heath
2 Flats
4 Catacombs
3 Wasteland

SB:
2 Revoker
2 Canonist
2 Teeg
2 ZP
1 Choke
1 Vindicate
2 Grip
1 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Deed

Meta is 2-3 Merrow w/ Chalice, a SnT player (omni/demon rum), 2x mud, burn, delver (rug mainly), Esper Mentor, bug pod, junkblade w/out goyf, Grixis Twin (straight modern port, just adds Therapy), manaless Dredge, a collected company painter homebrew, Reanimator, and some randomness.

A quick note, this is my gf's deck, and she is pretty new to the game. I understand that Therapy is strong, especially post sb, but her knowledge of the format is lacking. Please avoid suggesting the card.

I feel like maybe I should be playing one or two more grave hate cards, Relics and/or Surgical Extraction comes to mind.

I have thought about changing a Deed to an Enlightened Tutor si I essentially have 2 Deed and 2 Choke. Would this be a good idea? It does have other synergies within the list, so there are probably worse ideas. Anyway, thoughts, criticisms, suggestions?

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

[Cire]

A mini-necro to talk about whether Wasteland Strangler adds anything to this deck:



Play's well with Sculler, DRS and STP (and enemy delve cards)

Brainstorm list

4 DRS
4 BOB
4 Goyf
3 SFM
3 Tidehollow sculler
2 Wasteland Strangler
1 Teeg
1 Ooze

4 Thoughtseize
4 STP
3 decay
3 Green Suns Zenith
2 liliana
2 sylvan library
1 Jitte
1 bskull

18 Lands

[iamajellydonut]

A mini-necro to talk about whether Wasteland Strangler adds anything to this deck:

I, as said multiple times in the spoiler thread, am a huge fan of this card. Off the top of my head, the biggest impact I could see it making would be in something of a Death and Taxes list. Cut Goyf. Go down to three Lilianas. Load up on this, Thalias, and Tidehollow Skullers and just make for slow-roll beats and incremental card advantage.

[Richard Cheese]

I, as said multiple times in the spoiler thread, am a huge fan of this card. Off the top of my head, the biggest impact I could see it making would be in something of a Death and Taxes list. Cut Goyf. Go down to three Lilianas. Load up on this, Thalias, and Tidehollow Skullers and just make for slow-roll beats and incremental card advantage.

You could start with something like my old Black+Taxes list and just find room for DRS.

[Megadeus]

You could start with something like my old Black+Taxes list and just find room for DRS.

I agree with this. Maxing out on early Exile Via DRS, Sculler, and STP seems probably correct. New guy is pretty powerful

@The decklist presented above, 18 lands probably ain't gonna cut it my friend.

[iamajellydonut]

You could start with something like my old Black+Taxes list and just find room for DRS.

I would play the shit out of a modernized version of that.

[Richard Cheese]

I would play the shit out of a modernized version of that.

The question is what to cut. Do you just drop Mom since everyone's trying to come up with a plan to kill a horde of white 1/1s now? Maybe Batterskull and go to 2 SFMs? Cut the Crusaders since they're the only 3-drop and lose the best beater?

I haven't played that deck in a while but I'm thinking about picking it up again.

[iamajellydonut]

The question is what to cut. Do you just drop Mom since everyone's trying to come up with a plan to kill a horde of white 1/1s now? Maybe Batterskull and go to 2 SFMs? Cut the Crusaders since they're the only 3-drop and lose the best beater?

I haven't played that deck in a while but I'm thinking about picking it up again.

With a backbone of x/2s and an asston of card advantage, I don't think cards like Golgari Charm could be seen as too much of a threat, but I'd still definitely be scared shitless of Punishing Fires and stuff like Toxic Deluge. Crusaders could definitely go and I've never been happy with majority Stoneforge Mystics+Batterskull unless I have Brainstorm. Mom I'm up in the air about. Mainly I just don't have experience with her.


Edit: It's a weird brew, but it's also 10pm and I'm just coming up with shit. Initial concept had 1*Aether Vial, 2*Lingering Souls, Umezawa's Jitte, 3*Thalia, 4*Tidehollow Sculler, 2*Green Sun's Zenith, and a Dryad Arbor (in order of perceived importance), but it turns out that I was waaaay over sixty so whatever.

25*Lands
1*Forest
1*Plains
1*Swamp
3*Bayou
1*Cabal Pit
2*Horizon Canopy
1*Karakas
1*Marsh Flats
1*Savannah
2*Scrubland
1*Tranquil Thicket
4*Verdant Catacombs
4*Wasteland
2*Windswept Heath

19*Creatures
1*Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4*Dark Confidant
3*Wasteland Strangler
1*Scavenging Ooze
4*Deathrite Shaman
1*Gaddock Teeg
1*Knight of the Reliquary
2*Qasali Pridemage
3*Tidehollow Sculler

16*Other Spells
1*Lingering Souls
4*Swords to Plowshares
2*Liliana of the Veil
1*Green Sun's Zenith
1*Life from the Loam
2*Sylvan Library
2*Abrupt Decay
2*Mox Diamond

[jrsthethird]

You could start with something like my old Black+Taxes list and just find room for DRS.

Find room for Flickerwisp. Plays too well with Strangler to not be in with it.

Mom I'm up in the air about. Mainly I just don't have experience with her.

I have experience with your Mom. She's great.

[maharis]

Gotta play devils advocate here-- I don't really see what problem matchups Strangler makes better. What makes it exciting? It rarely affects Tarmogoyf and is shrugged off by Batterskull and TNN. It is completely dead vs. combo other than being a slight improvement on Scathe Zombies. Plus the condition is no guarantee at the times the card is good (I guess the dream is on the play we drop DRS, they fetch into a Delver/DRS of their own, and we windmill this turn 2 and don't get blowed out by Daze.)

Other than that it's mana-negative removal for any relevant creature it could hit with a body that gets dominated by most decent decks.

Aren't there better 3-mana sorcery speed cards that already don't make the cut? Like you could just play KOTR if you aren't already and fetch Cabal Pit for a similar effect. Or e-wit back a used removal spell. Or play Raven's Crime, Loam, Mentor.

[iamajellydonut]

Gotta play devils advocate here-- I don't really see what problem matchups Strangler makes better. What makes it exciting? It rarely affects Tarmogoyf and is shrugged off by Batterskull and TNN. It is completely dead vs. combo other than being a slight improvement on Scathe Zombies. Plus the condition is no guarantee at the times the card is good (I guess the dream is on the play we drop DRS, they fetch into a Delver/DRS of their own, and we windmill this turn 2 and don't get blowed out by Daze.)

Other than that it's mana-negative removal for any relevant creature it could hit with a body that gets dominated by most decent decks.

I'm definitely not trying to pretend like it's going to revolutionize Legacy or even Rock itself, but I've personally never liked Tarmogoyf (dumb beater) and have always wanted something to push Tidehollow Sculler over the top, so gaining a replacement for Tarmogoyf and an enabler for Tidehollow Sculler all in one go is just like a dream come true for me. Sure, the card itself isn't outrageous against combo, but neither is Abrupt Decay or half the other crap in the deck. The card just makes fair matches (which typically comprise the largest portion of any meta) even even better, and that's not a terrible thing.

[sdematt]

Any thoughts on the new Vampire Nighthawk person? It obviously seems better in Ale, but I'm running 3 Souls, so....It also is a card against Delver.

-Matt

[Warden]

Gotta play devils advocate here-- I don't really see what problem matchups Strangler makes better. What makes it exciting? It rarely affects Tarmogoyf and is shrugged off by Batterskull and TNN. It is completely dead vs. combo other than being a slight improvement on Scathe Zombies. Plus the condition is no guarantee at the times the card is good (I guess the dream is on the play we drop DRS, they fetch into a Delver/DRS of their own, and we windmill this turn 2 and don't get blowed out by Daze.)

Other than that it's mana-negative removal for any relevant creature it could hit with a body that gets dominated by most decent decks.

Aren't there better 3-mana sorcery speed cards that already don't make the cut? Like you could just play KOTR if you aren't already and fetch Cabal Pit for a similar effect. Or e-wit back a used removal spell. Or play Raven's Crime, Loam, Mentor.

Thank you. Somebody feels the same way I do. I see this new card as Gatekeeper of Malikar pt. 2...it's okay in the right "I live the dream" situations, but just 'meh' overall. I don't want tidehollow in rock unless I'm doing some next level deadguy. I need to see it in action, but right now it's just another new card. And yes, KotR is the better 3 drop.

[bakofried]

Thank you. Somebody feels the same way I do. I see this new card as Gatekeeper of Malikar pt. 2...it's okay in the right "I live the dream" situations, but just 'meh' overall. I don't want tidehollow in rock unless I'm doing some next level deadguy. I need to see it in action, but right now it's just another new card. And yes, KotR is the better 3 drop.

Having played the shit out of Gatekeeper back when it was more common...that's not an insult to me. I'm not pretending it's revolutionary, but at the least it's a 3/2 that nixes most creatures in Legacy right now. Does it kick out Lili, Souls, or Knight? Probably not, but it probably goes into a more creature driven strategy - where stuff like Thalia and Sculler become much better.