I'm gonna add 2 path to the main by cutting a ooze and moving teeg to sb. So that's a lot of removal but the sb is mostly combo hate so we have rearrangements post board. The mtgo meta is a ablaze with blue otherwise carpets would be something more useful.
Also, I'm cutting choke from sb. I would rather have something else in the sb. Containment priest and garruk relentless may get a go of it.
Regarding sequencing, I won't make that specific mistake against reanimator. I disagree about T1 Explorer being forbidden in all cases. If you're on the play, it's fine - I have no problem with someone wasting a Force of Will on it. This is especially true when running stoneforge mystic, as it increases your odds of getting a Turn 3 Batterskull. If it's game one and I'm on the play, I wouldn't even have had their first land drop to clue me in to what I should name with Therapy. On the draw you're absolutely correct, unless you know what you're playing against.Originally Posted by Echelon
My meta is hugely diverse - Seattle has one of the healthiest legacy scenes out there - with a lot of players switching between Tier 1 and 1.5 decks every week (I wish - I'm much more limited in my card availability). This week, everyone brought combo because they were bored with the grind-fest of Miracles and Shardless mirrors.
My list, as played this Monday (see my earlier post for my proposed updates)
4 Veteran Explorer
1 Deathrite Shaman
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Siege Rhino
1 Titania, Protector of Argoth
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Living Wish
2 Pernicious Deed
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Hymn to Tourach
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull
3 Bayou
2 Savannah
1 Scrubland
3 Forest
2 Swamp
2 Plains
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Windswept Heath
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Dryad Arbor
SB:
2 Carpet of Flowers
1 Hymn to Tourach
1 Karakas
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Council's Judgment
1 Engineered Plague
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
2 Grave Titan
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Path to Exile
I'll probably run Nic Fit minus the stoneforge package next week, just to try something a little bit different and to give Meren a test run.
That is an escape clause for anything.
In the end there is no ultimate answer to everything, but only G1 OTP against an unknown opponent playing Veteran Explorer is fine, but but but... it depends on your hand, how are you planning to develop. Also are you a kind of person that goes bluffing by casting that Cabal Therapy? Those kind of plays make an impact on the game on a entire different level. Does your opponent think that you know what he plays? Is he gonna risk that or counter the therapy? If, not, missing your guess (Brainstorm as the most likely hit) you get to see if your Veteran was gonna eat a StP. Etc etc..
On the other hand you say that Force of Will on your T1 Veteran is fine. Well in theory the trade is fine 1-2. But if that means you are/get crippled and miss development then that single FoW could have costed you the game on the spot. Everything changes when you know what your up against, but if not, i'd say go for safe. I have lost and learned that the hard way by letting my precious Veteran eat a Stp or FoW/Daze and lost the game for getting behind.
Kagu-Tsuchi カグツチ (Jund NicFit)
Rhino's Abbondanza (Junk NicFit)
4c Aggro Loam
I have been testing two paths and they have won me games. I run 2 paths 3 decays 3 deeds 1 councils judgement (+1 pulse in the sb for the jtms mu). I'm really satisfied with this removal suite. I run 1 cj to have a chance vs an early tnn and because it can get hex proof dudes. In the online meta you must have at least 2 removal spells for jtms (vs him all the other spells are useless ofc).
I play teeg and qasali in the main and i have to say that, playing online, teeg is really good especially when you know the opponent has jace in hand. Plus storm is common online.
Carpet might very well be the most useful sb card, seriously. It has gotten me far ahead vs blue decks so many times that I'll never cut it. And at first i put it in the sb nearly as a joke.
I tried ajani mentor, following your list, but i have to say that imo 5cmc garruk is better because it shits 3/3 beasts and actually can DRAW lots of cards in the late game. Plus can be a nightmare against miracles
There's nothing wrong with whiffing on a blind T1 Cabal Therapy if that'll let you know what you're up against. If your Therapy misses, at least you know what's going on and what you need to name the following turn. Worst case scenario, you end up with your opponent discarding his most important card and 3 mana left to do as you see fit.
Playing T1 Veteran to also draw out STP is also not a bad play, depending on what's in your hand. It really just depends on the rest of your hand. Explorer pass can be perfectly fair, as can Cabal for, say, Brainstorm/STP/FoW/Jace.
Carpet isn't a terrible sideboard card at all, it's just that, in and of itself, it does nothing against Miracles. It lets you cast stuff, sure, but I want high impact "get rolled, loser!" cards against them so I don't have to spend 50 minutes playing Magic against THAT deck.
The Path part of the removal suite is quite good, which is why I don't want to cut it for more fat like Baneslayer. I like 4 Decay/2 Path/2 Deed/2 Deluge right now in Junk.
-Matt
If I can ask, why 2 deeds? Because of the clunkyness? It often feels like the best card to me..
What are you using as a sb tech vs the pesky miracles mages?
Because of the Delver decks. Even though it's an excellent card, it's much slower to activate. Sometimes, you really don't have the time to activate it and you need to clear the board right now. As well, against decks like DnT, they can Revoker Deed even in Game 1, and then the matchup is more uphill than you want it to be. Deluge solves a lot of problems, some of them the same, and some different than Deed. The split has been nice.
Sideboard tech? Slaughter Games, Needle, Walkers, Grip, and sometimes even Teeg. Sylvan Safekeeper is quite spicy if you're up to it. Multiple Sigardas, as well. I basically don't want to ever lose that matchup.
-Matt
Yea i dont want to lose to them as well, im willing to build the sb with only them (and storm) in mind..i will try the 4-2 split
I think my board right now is something like:
2 Slaughter Games
2 Golgari Charm
2 Pithing Needle
2 Krosan Grip
2 Ethersworn Canonist
3 Thoughtseize
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Gaddock Teeg
-Matt
No extirpate/se for the storm mu?
E: sorry for all the questions mate, I ll shut up now :D
His plan is to slow down the storm player w/ discard & cannonists until he can cast Slaughter Games.
With Jund Nic-Fit at least the Miracles are good match up and you want more lands to play more PFire.
Sure, it helps the mircal player if he gets more land. We have more thearts in nic-fit and they only thing that are dangours is the mircales gets more angels. But we usally have deed and tosic for that.
TL;DR
We still win more then we sac Veteran.
No we don't.
What's the verdict on Dryad Militant as graveyard hate? Is having GY hate that GSZ can find worth the vulnerability to removal and shutting off half of Therapy?
Ive been using it for quiet some time it does wonders vs storm and dredge and is lackluster vs reainamtor.
I've been wondering people's thoughts on how many vets and therapies they leave in against miracles.
I like playing SFM so I'm comfortable deploying major threats at 2 mana and then curving out. Soo usually board out the whole package and add in two of the thoughtsiezes from my board so I have that option.
What does everyone else do? and why?
Veteran -2 or -3, leaving 1 MD. This so i have access to be able to have it in rare situations where you actually want the trigger. Nowadays i run 2 Carpets.
Therapy depends on the play (3-4 md) or draw (2-3 md) AND how i board in total. I never have a fixed plan, but go as feel fit. I wanna know my MU strength and weaknesses by heart instead of using a pre planned cheatsheet board plan. Miracles, can often be just a draw go game and have time to develop your manabase. I always leave the innitiative to the miracles player and be the control deck until i can hit him hard. This is for PFire. With Junk you can take more innitiative and drain him. This also depends on the Miracles build offcourse (Mentor/SFM/RiPhelm/Legends/Regular).
Also Therapy is better against the Legends or SFM builds.
Kagu-Tsuchi カグツチ (Jund NicFit)
Rhino's Abbondanza (Junk NicFit)
4c Aggro Loam
I replace them with at least 2 carpets..people often even force it when I play it turn 1
And also, people in here used to run tsunami. Does that change the way you play it? Do you let them fetch up a bunch of lands off your vet triggers so you can tsunami them away, or do you just let them find them naturally and then pull the trigger?
@bobmans, as far as I'm concerned working out a cheat sheet or memorising the matchup are the same thing, you always should be willing to deviate from it on the spot depending on the game you're opponent
And that's what I used to do, leave one as a gsun target incase I need it and then bank my therapies until I wanted to resolve something. That said, I've never played draw-go against miracles, punishing fire is sweeeet.
@rubblekill, truth. I need to try them.
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