@Matt, you can't beat a charging rhino in a race, that I will acknowledge :P
I like thrun a lot (hexproof threat and fantastic ground staller (once blew up a moat from miracles and regenned him to attack for the win)) or Meren in the 4 slot. But I hvnt tried master, he might be the golden ticket. On the todo list
@Brael, yea I'm not running tracker, card can be super slow and mana intensive, I'd rather draw the exact card I want now for 3 mana. So instead of tracker ewit and truths, just running ewit. I'm not professing it's correct yet, but I like the idea of it. Eternal witness is one of my favourite cards to draw, when you have the mana it's like a snapcaster on crack. And when you don't you can still get the card back. Ideal card for a control deck and adds some major consistency.
Junk and Stoned Rhinos.
If this card wasn't legendary, he'd be fine. Alternatively, if it grew when it flipped into wolf side as well, it would be worth the risk. But, he is, and he doesn't, so he's very likely to not be good enough imo.Originally Posted by Brael
I played 2 leagues on sunday and it seemed liked it went fairly quickly.
Current Build: Punishing Rhinos http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...l=1#post927726
Of course, here is the list of my NicFitDrazi (I was thinking about it when I posted):I am not quite sure which lists you play but the 8post deck in the 'new developing decks' thread is leaning towards a GB eldrazi mix at the moment. seems he could fit there and some more thoughts are more than welcome to the thread
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Eye of Ugin
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Swamp
1 Wastes
3 Bayou
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Forest
4 Llanowar Wastes
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Reality Smasher
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Thragtusk
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
3 Matter Reshaper
3 Primeval Titan
3 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Veteran Explorer
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Abrupt Decay
1 Diabolic Intent
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Green Sun's Zenith
SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 Pithing Needle
SB: 3 Thoughtseize
SB: 1 Nihil Spellbomb
SB: 1 Toxic Deluge
SB: 2 Obstinate Baloth
SB: 2 Warping Wail
SB: 1 Krosan Grip
Basically, from the version of Arianhod (wich I played before) with posts, the amount of mana late game doesn't change a lot. Four llanowar wastes give stability (here it's a 3 "colors" land) and four Eldrazi temples give explosivity (for TKS/Reshaper/Smasher).
For me, there is no comparison between Ulamog, Ceaseless Hunger and the two others (Big Koz and new Emrakul). I do not play Emrakul v1 anymore cause it's 15 mana and if you can cast him, you have alreday win the game.
A 10 ccm Eldrazi is nice cause we can cast him just after a primeval titan (6 mana + bring eldrazi temple + eye of ugin). So Big Koz and Emrakul v2 (ccm between 9/10 in my list) are ok. I run only one nuclear weapon actually so no question, Ulamog, Ceaseless Hunger is the strongest one among the "when you cast". But if I would run a second, I think Emrakul v2 is a good option because it's basically write "when you cast him, game is win" which is not completely true with big koz. The goal with Emrakul v2 is like Ulamog v2 is (if the opponent has good hand) we can deal with opponent board and (after his additionnal turn but I don't really care about it) finish him with theorically titan + Emrakul + others...
Last edited by benoasan; 06-21-2016 at 05:28 AM.
as we discussed in the other thread (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...t-8Post/page13) the deck is very interesting and I sleeved it up as well but need more testing. especially matter reshaper into deed is great.
Yes, there are a lot of tricks with matter reshaper (Deed ofc, phyrexian tower, cabal therapy, diabolic intent and in addition you can filter with SDT). This guy (T2 cast with temple) just wait for our powerful late game.
Last edited by benoasan; 06-21-2016 at 10:34 AM.
I've been brewing lately with some of Arian's ideas and I came up with something I want to share.
Abzan Control Fit
(22 lands: 15G / 14B / 13W)
1 Karakas
1 Plains
2 Bayou
3 Forest
2 Savannah
1 Scrubland
3 Swamp
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
1 Phyrexian Tower
(14 creatures)
4 Veteran Explorer
1 Avabruck Mayor
1 Sakura Tribe Elder
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Eternal Witness
1 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Master of the Wild Hunt
1 Mystic Enforcer
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Thragtusk
(4 Planeswalkers)
2 Liliana of the Veil
1 Garruk Relentless
1 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
(2 artifacts)
2 Sensei's Divining Top
(3 enchantments)
3 Pernicious Deed
(5 instants)
3 Path to Exile
2 Abrupt Decay
(11 sorceries)
2 Painful Truths
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Maelstrom Pulse
Sideboard:
2 Deathrite Shaman
1 Ethersworn canonist
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Engineered Plague
2 Surgical extraction
3 Abeyance
1 Golgari Charm
1 Krosan Grip
3 Thoughtseize
Here are some additional information:
1) Cards in "Italic" can be replaced:
- Mayor has been chosen for the synergy with Master and Garruk
- Tireless has replaced Painful n°3 but might not be needed at all. I also like very much the synergy with some other cards (KoTR for example)
- Mystic Enforcer is there to be a pain for any Marit Lage deck. It also has some collateral damage against other difficult MU/creatures (Eldrazi, Griselbrand etc...) but I know from experience that keeping the threshold might not be that easy.
2) Planeswalker's choice:
- Garruk shall not be presented anymore.
- Sorin, lord of Innistrad > Daddy Sorin. Since the day I pulverised a MUD player with his ulty, this guy has never ceased to impress me in any Abzan control build.
- Liliana. She is the best non blue PW ever. She also represents "inevitability" against MUs we usually struggle big time; combo and better control decks.
3) Land's configuration:
- 7 basics. That is the optimal config (to my taste) when I'm playing 4 Vet + 1 STE. One can replace the 3rd forest for another Savannah to fulfill the 14 white sources. Anyway, I tend to believe that having access to 14 W sources is not mandatory even if we could need a T1 white source for a STP/PTE.
- Each time I play with Liliana in a Nic Fit build, I play 3 swamps. I like fetching early for basics in a Control Fit build. Forest and Swamp. Having 3 swamps, let you play Veteran first, followed by a therapy and a potential Lili in the same turn.
4) Path to Exile or STP. One can elect the one he likes better. STP might be an overall better choice.
5) Abrupt Decay: Since the inclusion of Enforcer, the 3rd PTE/STP might not be needed any longer. So, one can choose to play a mix of 3 decay and 2 PTE/STP.
If you have any question, feel free to shoot.
Last edited by Ralf; 06-21-2016 at 12:35 PM.
Legacy & Homebrew **ONLY**
Brown Stax
Rainbow SWAT
Dimir Mill
Morph my Ride
Wally Wallah
Corona Syndrome
How does the deck and your card choices perform?
Junk and Stoned Rhinos.
I like the Mayor of Avabruck idea. I've been messing around with 5c Humans in vintage (because if I can't have fun with Mana Drain, nobody else is allowed to have fun either), and Mayor has impressed in that shell. Obviously it's not quite the same here, but both halves of the card are relevant in this deck as well: pumping Veterans to 2/2s for G seems fine, as does making the Master himself a 4/4, which dodges Bolt (Master's biggest problem by far).
I just went and checked and unfortunately Elspeth SC only makes Soldier tokens, not Human Soldier tokens. For some reason. Oh well, Sorin LoI's -2 is enough value with her, anyway.
Pretty well.
The curve is almost perfect but it needs more tests (and more players to share tests) to get a better idea.
Not to mention that my Combo MUs are not so bad.
Give it a try and see by yourself.
Legacy & Homebrew **ONLY**
Brown Stax
Rainbow SWAT
Dimir Mill
Morph my Ride
Wally Wallah
Corona Syndrome
To be perfectly honest, I worship "Scab Clan Berserker" since it is out.
I've tried many times to make it Legacy valuable to some extend. This includes a good activity in the Zoo thread of this very forum (and the Zoo list in my signature).
I saw the 5c Human in Vintage a few weeks ago and I started brewing again. The deck is still very raw but the results are very promising.
I will update my signature with its last iteration to not pollute this thread with list that does not belong to it...
Cheers,
Ralf
Legacy & Homebrew **ONLY**
Brown Stax
Rainbow SWAT
Dimir Mill
Morph my Ride
Wally Wallah
Corona Syndrome
Hmm ... does Eldrazi Displacer have a place in JunkDrazi Fit? On one hand, it seems safer than Recurring Nightmare in terms of graveyard reliance and lack of timing restrictions. On the other, the build meant to use/abuse it would require four types of basics to run effectively.
I unfortunately don't have time to test most of the lists posted on here along with my own ideas. I tend to only try ones that have posted some results or have been consistently discussed for a while. Like rhino fit, rhino fit with red, SE fit and I'm looking to try Ulysse's enchantment build as my next thread-inspired testing. I like that it blanks a lot of what the format is attacking right now.
That said I have done testing with Planeswalker builds and though they seem fine, that's all they seem. Planeswalkers are expensive and slow (outside of lili) and prefer my nic fit with more flexibility in costs and it's card advantage/selection. Hence SFM and Eternal witness. They give you more options than planeswalkers (do I make a 1/1 vampire for my 4 mana investment, or a 1/1 vampire?) But that's my preference at the moment :) not a rule I would inflict upon others.
Last edited by Jain_Mor; 06-21-2016 at 06:02 PM.
Junk and Stoned Rhinos.
Does anyone have a Lands matchup that isn't abysmal? I have no real way to interact with Thespian's Stage, and I don't think a few sideboard cuts are going to fix it. I faced the deck twice last night.
I did have a very interesting game. My board was Thragtusk, Liliana, Jace, and a ton of land, at 23 life, against his board of Stage, Forest, Taiga. I had ultimated Liliana the previous turn and she was at 2 counters, and Jace was at 12. He is at 20 life. I pass to him, and he dredges Loam, finding a Dark depths. He loams, puts the depths into play, and passes with mana up to make a Marit Lage and 3 cards in hand. What do?
I ended up brainstorming with Jace, looking for a Baleful Strix or more cantrips to find the Strix. I got one, playing it as well as another swagtusk, hit him for five, ticked up Lili, and passed. He made a 20/20 at my EOT and swung at jace, which I chumped with the Strix. On my turn I ticked Lili up, putting him to two cards in hand, and ulted Jace, leaving Jace at 1 counter and Lili at 4. On his turn he kills Liliana, passing with one card left in his library. I uptick Jace leaving him with only one turn and no outs. I did lose the match, however.
The 3rd Ponder was awesome all night and I don't think I'll go back. I think I will add a second needle to the board.
Lands is always going to be something of an issue because our clock isn't super fast.
The usual solutions to Lands (mostly out of the sideboard) are:
- Surgical Extraction / Extirpate
- Price of Progress
- From The Ashes
- Path to Exile / Swords
- Pithing Needle
- Celestial Purge
- Blocking with Strix / other fliers, preferably with Meren or Nightmare or other recursion
- Getting life total above 20, then using sorcery speed removal like Liliana and Innocent Blood
It's an awkward matchup.
Needle on Stage is alright. Slows them down.
I've basically given up on trying to beat Lands -- it now occupies a space in my mind similar to Reanimator. I've have some splash hate in the board, sure -- maybe some game I'll get lucky and Path their dude and Surgical Dark Depths and it'll be great. But having a dedicated plan to win that matchup? I'd rather focus on beating everything else.
I have no idea what Lands' bad matchups even are, these days. That deck has become absolutely obscene as cards have been printed.
Ooze is a not so bad answer to any grave strategy.
With strix + Jace + Liliana + some counterspells you should be able to endure the first Marit attempt and make sure there will be no other before you kill him.
I have also included a few month ago a 1-of echoing truth and it has been really great. That's another card that messes up with eot Marit.
Obviously it is even better post board...
The last training session ended up with 7-3 for me after 10 matchs against land.
Obviously my list and SB strategy helped a lot.
Take this with a grain of salt as the sample is too small to draw any meaningful conclusion but at least it could give you some ideas
Legacy & Homebrew **ONLY**
Brown Stax
Rainbow SWAT
Dimir Mill
Morph my Ride
Wally Wallah
Corona Syndrome
Why didn't you Jace bounced the token or use a leaving Lily to make him sac his token??
It's a true question since I don't have all the game details.
From what I see:
You up Lily to put him at 2 cards. You ultimate Jace (bye Jace).My board was Thragtusk, Liliana, Jace, and a ton of land, at 23 life, against his board of Stage, Forest, Taiga. I had ultimated Liliana the previous turn and she was at 2 counters, and Jace was at 12. He is at 20 life. I pass to him, and he dredges Loam, finding a Dark depths. He loams, puts the depths into play, and passes with mana up to make a Marit Lage and 3 cards in hand. What do?
He EoT put Marit into play, has no hand and two cards on library.
His turn, he draw one (cant't even dredge).
Has no choice but attack Lily (bye Lily)
Your turn, whatever.
He draws his last card, attack you putting your life at 3.
Your turn, whatever.
He can't draw and loose this game of Magic the Gathering.
No?
It sounds like you're on BUG where I am on a junk list but I am basically running a "Big Maverick" version that uses Vet+Therapy and lands doesn't seem to be too bad. With Knight you're able to tutor for wasteland to disrupt their lands or you can tutor for karakas at instant speed to bounce their Merit Lage. Gaea's Cradle helps with tabernacle and scavenging ooze helps own their graveyard. Add on top a 1 of life from the loam to help fight their wastelands or recur our own.
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