All B/R update speculation.

[Whitefaces]

Blood Moon would be pretty obnoxious.

[Megadeus]

RIP wallets.

Right? Suddenly every deck needs 12 or more duals. Hello $1000 revised underground seas

[Lord_Mcdonalds]

If fetches were banned, I don't think I could buy enough wastelands

[nedleeds]

What pushes fetchlands over the top? Dual lands. So ban the enabling dual lands ...

Sigh, the ignore function only helps so much. Yes fetches are busted so lets ban every deck manipulation spell as well as actual lands. Stop defending Brainstorm with straw men and go back to 'I'd quit if they banned it.', 'They killed vintage.', 'Skill intensives' and the time honored 'Pillar of the format'. Terminus is obscene because Brainstorm is inexplicably not banned, the end. You could hardly justify playing 4 of those 6cc bricks without it.

[Dark Ritual]

Did someone actually say that yawgmoth's will would be safer than survival of the fittest a page or two back? In a format with 4 burning wish, 4 demonic tutor, 4 lotus, 4 dark ritual, and 4 lotus petal? I don't give a shit how good gravehate gets. They could print this and I would still sling will in legacy:

Tormod's recall 0
Instant
Exile all cards in target player's graveyard. Draw 3 cards.

Ban fetchlands, yeah let's make manabases horrifically bad and weak to wasteland and blood moon. Sounds good. While we're at it, how many dual lands do you own? Because I know a guy who owns over a 100, and sea being worth the same amount as power 9, workshop, bazaar, etc. etc. sounds terrific for those with dual lands but for those without...yeah no one would ever be getting into the format again.

Ban original duals? Play modern or legacy without reserved list cards included, if you ban duals in legacy the format is heavily likely to die due to how pissed off the playerbase would be and it would be chronicles level of outrage on a gallon of steroids.

Unban earthcraft and mind twist? Yes. Has been yes for a long while on both. Will it happen? Sure, when the next treasure cruise/DTT is printed.

Black vise will never, ever, EVER have the correct meta for it in legacy for it to be oppressive as fuck. Delver just shits on the card as it's black vise that isn't conditional in a format with such good cantrips and brainstorm as well as a fantastic complementary suite of countermagic and other efficient dudes. It's really hard to push delver out of the metagame and obsolete it.

[nedleeds]

<golf clap for mini rant>

Yeah for starters unban about 4 cards that are literally shitcakes compared to Brainstorm, Ponder, Show and Tell and Delver. Like Earthcrap, Mind Twist, Recruiter and even Frantic Search at this point.

[Lemnear]

Sigh, the ignore function only helps so much. Yes fetches are busted so lets ban every deck manipulation spell as well as actual lands. Stop defending Brainstorm with straw men and go back to 'I'd quit if they banned it.', 'They killed vintage.', 'Skill intensives' and the time honored 'Pillar of the format'. Terminus is obscene because Brainstorm is inexplicably not banned, the end. You could hardly justify playing 4 of those 6cc bricks without it.

Putting words into peoples mouth, wanting cards banned because you dont run them and wanting the culprints stay because you use them yourself. Its like pointing to Entreat just to distract from Counterbalance/SDT/Terminus. Intellectual dishonest at its best only topped by the legendary Dr.Jones

Did someone actually say that yawgmoth's will would be safer than survival of the fittest a page or two back?

No one did. No one ever would.

ban fetchlands, yeah let's make manabases horrifically bad and weak to wasteland and blood moon. Sounds good. While we're at it, how many dual lands do you own? Because I know a guy who owns over a 100, and sea being worth the same amount as power 9, workshop, bazaar, etc. etc. sounds terrific for those with dual lands but for those without...yeah no one would ever be getting into the format again.

As if people realistically still get into the format at these times of ridiculous card speculation.

The joke is that Sam rants about sculpting perfect hands and dodging discard in terms of brainstorm, but dont wants to see that sculpting perfect mana and dodging landdestruction with fetchlands is the same optimization just in another gamezone, which is intellectual dishonest, especially given the fetchlands are the reason SDT, Brainstorm, Ponder, etc are actually playable.

You can pick the Yawgmoth's Will/SotF joke as an extension, where using a broken yard-engine seems fine to some people if its about Retainers+Emrakul/Grisel/Iona, but not if its about Tendrils of Agony. We dont need either in legacy

[Sidneyious]

I'm curious about what decks these "ban enablers dot Dec" play.

[nedleeds]

Do some of you actually post from branches? A land can be played as a special action, Brainstorm requires a blue mana. There is a colossal difference. We all accept the mostly true need to play lands because they are the primary resource as defined by the fucking creator. Stop comparing the two, its apples and oranges. #banislands ...

[Ronald Deuce]

Who knew so many Legacy players hated good cards so much?

[CptHaddock]

Do some of you actually post from branches? A land can be played as a special action, Brainstorm requires a blue mana. There is a colossal difference. We all accept the mostly true need to play lands because they are the primary resource as defined by the fucking creator. Stop comparing the two, its apples and oranges. #banislands ...

I think you are being nedleedlessly trolled.

[thefringthing]

Wait, aren't you complaining about the rise of AD due to Countertop/Chalice? And yet your solution is to print more stuff like it?

What doesn't make sense about this? People feel railroaded into playing Abrupt Decay because it's the only way to fight the current lock-based metagame. The format might be made more fun and interesting if there were a better diversity of options.

[iatee]

People play Abrupt Decay because it's a really flexible card that can be easily fit into any deck that already plays the best 1 mana creature in legacy. It is an answer to the vast majority of threats in the format, not just Chalices and Counterbalances. If you feel 'railroaded' into playing Deathrite Shaman and Abrupt Decay, you should blame Wizards for printing cards that are so much better than the alternatives.

[thefringthing]

Not everyone who plays Abrupt Decay plays Deathrite Shaman. And again, the problem isn't that Abrupt Decay is too much better than the alternatives, it's that the alternatives are so bad, and the stuff you need Abrupt Decay against is so good.

[Lemnear]

As I wrote in my big, previous post: I do think the format would be a lot more open if the most viable safety net against countertop/chalice would not lock people into BG

[rlesko]

Spell snare answers both cards very cleanly...just pray you have it when they cast it

[Megadeus]

As I wrote in my big, previous post: I do think the format would be a lot more open if the most viable safety net against countertop/chalice would not lock people into BG

I actually agree here.

[ahg113]

Blood Moon would be pretty obnoxious.

I hear that and am confused, as if Counterbalance isn't already obnoxious. If not counterbalance, then Terminus, or show'n'tell.

[Lemnear]

I hear that and am confused, as if Counterbalance isn't already obnoxious. If not counterbalance, then Terminus, or show'n'tell.

... or Loam+GhostQuarter

[Whitefaces]

I hear that and am confused, as if Counterbalance isn't already obnoxious. If not counterbalance, then Terminus, or show'n'tell.

I meant that in regards to fetchlands being taken out of the format.