[Deck] Dragon Stompy

[Clark Kant]

I am just throwing the idea out there. If the card has already been tested as a sideboard option against black based aggro, Fairie Stompy and all sorts of random aggro, feel free to ignore me.

But couldn't it replace Pyrokinesis. The main nongoyf creatures that see play are Fairie Stompy's Flyers and Sui Blacks Dudes. FTK still 2 for 1 against either of these two decks as well as all sorts of other randomness (affinity etc). You already have enough tools against Matron Storm decks, and Cephalid Breakfast seems to have fallen out of flavor. So I'm not positive Pyro is superior to FTK.

But if you don't want to replace Pyrokinesis could you make due playing three of each of the cards you listed along with 3 FTK?

I was just wondering if the card has been tested recently at all by anyone.

[bladewing019]

I was just wondering if the card has been tested recently at all by anyone.

Flametounge Kavu was used before Tarmogoyf was printed.

As for the rest, Pyrokinesis is free, instant speed, and is better against things like Goblins. 4 mana is a lot, especially for a creature that gets its ass kicked by Goyf.

[Clark Kant]

I guess my point is, when you are talking about versus Fairie Stompy or Black based aggro...

FTK 2 for 1s your opponent (you take out two creatures for the price of one card).
Pyrokinesis 2 for 1s yourself (you lose two cards to take out one creature usually).

[Kuma]

I guess FTK is a decent sideboard option if your meta has no graveyard-based decks, no thresh, and no combo. But you should already be stomping MBA, and I don't see what matchups FTK improves that aren't already awesome except for other chalice aggro.

[Clark Kant]

Well, FTK would be replacing Pyrokinesis.

How is Pyrokinesis good against Thresh? You will be siding in Trinispheres, versus thresh, but I see no reason to side in Pyrokinesis.

You already have a lot of options against Matron based combo, Chalice, Trinisphere etc.

[Happy Gilmore]

How many ppl have been testing Akroma, AoF in this deck? The card is the stone cold nuts. This deck has can easily get the 8 mana to hard cast Akroma and has no issues with the morph cost most of the time. Seathing Songs becomes even more threatening with Akroma's inclusion (uncounterability is lete). Its morph cost can be played as early as turn 2, and best of all , your opponent wont know if your playing a Gathan Raiders or an Akroma ;). If you can generate enough mana to abuse dragon, instead cast a creature that is practically unkillable, has trample, and unconterable IMO.

[b4r0n]

FTK 2 for 1s your opponent (you take out two creatures for the price of one card).
Pyrokinesis 2 for 1s yourself (you lose two cards to take out one creature usually).

Seriously? Do you honestly think that card advantage is a driving force behind Dragon Stompy? The entire premise behind the deck is speed and power, not long term card advantage. Every time you play a Seething Song, pitch a Simian Spirit Guide, imprint on a Chrome Mox, or flip a Gathan Raider, you 2 for 1 yourself. It's not about losing cards. It's about the effect that you're able to achieve. Along those lines, the ability to play free, versatile removal at instant speed is a lot more important than getting a 4/2 body. It's foolish to evaluate FTK and Pyrokinesis solely in terms of card advantage when there are clearly more important factors involved.

Also, what in the world is "Matron based combo"?

[Clark Kant]

It's removal plus a solid clock that your opponent is forced to answer. Your F. Stompy opponent trading a second creature with FTK at the very least means they can't use that creature to chump block your Pit Dragon.

I meant Warrens based combo.

As for Akroma, I don't know, it eats up two turns to cast, and even then is significantly harder to unmorph than any of your other creatures.

And it's not even that fast of a clock really.

[Kuma]

I was thinking of FTK as a replacement for Tormod's Crypt or Trinisphere. Pyrokinesis is just too good to cut from the sideboard. Helps you get hellbent and kills multiple guys. I wouldn't cut it for FTK.

[n00bas4urus_r3x]

I really like Akroma from my testing with her. I only play one at the moment, so she doesn't show up too often. When she does however, it's gg. She has proSTP which is huge obviously, and she is very playable off of Seething Songs and other accel. First turn morph into second turn Akroma off of a Song continues to be a jaw dropper. A lot of people don't expect her as well, so you can easily play that into your advantage. I don't think I'd go over 2 however because she is very mana intensive.

[scrumdogg]

It's removal plus a solid clock that your opponent is forced to answer. Your F. Stompy opponent trading a second creature with FTK at the very least means they can't use that creature to chump block your Pit Dragon.

I meant Warrens based combo.

As for Akroma, I don't know, it eats up two turns to cast, and even then is significantly harder to unmorph than any of your other creatures.

And it's not even that fast of a clock really.

Faerie Stompy...yeah that sees widespread play. Assuming your F. Stompy opponent (all one of them, if they show up) doesn't have their critter equipped with Sword of Pro-FTK or Jitte, you might actually hit them. 2-1-ing them is pure fantasy, of course, since they will equip someone with either of the 'oops I fly & then shank FTK' equipments but you deal much better in deck fantasy than reality anyway. The point of a SB is to answer weaknesses of the maindeck - FTK does not do this effectively enough, which you might have realized had you read the thread.

Akroma has been very good to me as a 2 of. It has allowed me to win games versus blue based decks that I have no business winning (ask the Dreadstill guy from Hadley) as well as sucking out a removal when I would rather Gathan Riaders resolve. As for it being a slow clock, 3 turns is slow why? That's faster than Goyf most of the time, which a reasonable modern standard.

[bladewing019]

I guess my point is, when you are talking about versus Fairie Stompy or Black based aggro...

FTK 2 for 1s your opponent (you take out two creatures for the price of one card).
Pyrokinesis 2 for 1s yourself (you lose two cards to take out one creature usually).

Do you realize that black based aggro runs a bunch of things with low toughness, like Confidant and Shade? You can pretty easily get 2 creatures with a Pyrokinesis.

I thought it was general consensus that Sulfur Elemental > Akroma.

[FoolofaTook]

Has any attempt been made to fatten Dragon Stompy by removing some of the acceleration for additional 3cc disruption?

The topdeck problem if the opponent manages your first disruption and threat is really an issue. For me at least this has been due to the great chance of drawing unnecessary acceleration and not seeing another threat for several turns.

[Zork]

I occasionally board out acceleration against decks where disruption is stronger, but maindeck I would only do it in a really combo-heavy meta and all I would do is cut maybe one song and/or a SSG (along with something else non-accel).

[DrewliusMaximus]

Just because its more fun playing R'Akromas, I tried playing this build casually for a few games:

10 Mountain
4 City
4 Tomb
4 Mox
1 Lotus Petal
4 SSG

4 Chalice
4 Blood Moon
4 Magus

2 Blazing Shoal
4 Seething Song

4 Gathan Raiders
4 RPD
4 Slogger
3 Akroma

Probably not as solid as with Jittes, but the Shoals do help hellbent and abuse Akroma's (and Slogger's) cc from time to time (and are red). Adding two red cards also made me more comfortable trying a single Lotus Petal to tip balance a little towards mana production so that playing Akroma would happen a little more often.

Still, it was fun playing for a couple of games.

[Nihil Credo]

So, I had a decent showing, getting 14th place out of 94 at the tournament I mentioned earlier. Here's my thoughts on the deck after these weeks of testing and the tournament itself:

1) This deck seems to get more consistent (and fun!) the more you practice it. When I first tried the deck mostly because of budget concerns, I was mildly annoyed at all the one-trick-pony games I was playing. With time, I discovered how the optimal opening was not nearly as obvious as it seemed - in particular, it takes a while to gauge when it is appropriate to just slowroll your threats. Doing so drastically improves your mulligan rate, too.

Also, as can be seen in the report, being in an actual tournaments and getting all sorts of hints as to what you are playing (from actual scouting to off-hand remarks) can be decisive to your play.

2) Akroma is completely worth a slot in the maindeck. What she's got to offer over Mauler and Elemental is instrumental in pulling you out of many, many no-win situations (Landstill, anyone?), whereas it's much less likely that having a Grey Ogre rather than a 3/2 or a Mauler loses you the game. I think the second copy is only appropriate in a fairly slow metagame, and is probably best in the sideboard, but I'm recommending the first one to basically anyone.

3) Mauler kicks the shit out of Sulfur Elemental. Simply put, I've had Maulers countered several times; if our favourite 3/2 didn't have Split Second, it would only get countered once in a blue moon.

After some time playing with Mauler, the arguments in favour of Sulfur Elemental seem incredibly weak: it hits DoJ tokens? Mauler is much better at not letting them stabilize to the point of cycling DoJ for 3+. It kills en-Kor dudes? Aside from how little play that deck sees nowadays, you have So. Many. Ways to stop them from going off - especially postboard, when literally everything hurts them. It surprise-blocks Mongoose? Which one would you rather have against Threshold in the first place - and more importantly, how often do you want to block in the first place?

The vast majority of times Mauler is a blank, Sulfur is too. If the opponent can shrug off a 2/2 without playing a single spell, there are good chances they could shrug off a 3/2 as well. Even against a 3/3 Mongoose, if it's late in the game, they probably can't attack without you winning the race despite having a smaller creature - and that's if they don't cast any more spells.

4) Jitte is awful every time it isn't a life-saver. I honestly don't know what to do of this card; it's hurting the deck's consistency more than any other slot (Slogger and Akroma included), but cutting it would not be an improvement for any metagame with a honest Red presence. I'm strongly considering putting it in the SB for my next tournament, which theoretically should feature a comboish meta. Or perhaps I'll try Sword of Light and Shadow, which at least does something against control.

[b4r0n]

Congratulations on the finish, and great report! In response to your points:

1) Just out of curiosity, do you have any examples of this? I'd be interested in hearing some of the non-obvious plays you encountered.

2) I can understand why people would want Akroma due to the outs that she provides, but in my experience, she seems too hard to cast or even flip. I assume that you didn't find that to be the case.

3) The more I play with the deck, the more I agree: overall, Mauler is generally better than the Elemental. Unless you're playing lots and lots of Breakfast and Landstill, Mauler is stronger.

4) How did you find Jitte to be awful, and how would Sword of Light and Shadow be any better? I've found Jitte to be amazing in almost every matchup, and would never cut it.

[Nihil Credo]

1) Just out of curiosity, do you have any examples of this? I'd be interested in hearing some of the non-obvious plays you encountered.

There aren't many actual tricks with the deck - one time I cast Slogger a turn later so I could pitch SSG to it and surprise-trade with Goyf, and that's about the most sneaky it's ever gotten (if you don't count stuff like bluffing your opponent to not block Pit-Dragon while both your cards in hand are Songs or apes).

By 'non-obvious', I mean that you learn to tailor the explosiveness to the opponent you're facing. For example, Eva Green is short on removal, runs discard, and has a tendency to drop very early Tombstalkers, so the absolute priority is to put that fat on the table ASAP, pitching with total abandon (exception: turn 1 Chalice on the play, if Wasteland doesn't rape you). Against Thresh, it's generally much better to play conservatively, saving SSG as Daze protection - unless they've got a three-creature opener, or play Thoughtseize.

4) How did you find Jitte to be awful, and how would Sword of Light and Shadow be any better? I've found Jitte to be amazing in almost every matchup, and would never cut it.

Awful in the "oh great, I've spent four mana and my two-turn clock is still a two-turn clock, and just as vulnerable" way. Killing creatures off with Jitte counters was a fairly uncommon occurrence in both testing and tournament; it tends to only happen when I find myself without any of the 13 fatties, which rule the combat phase without need for equipment.

I'm interested in try out Sword of Light and Shadow because 1) against aggro, I was primarily using Jitte to win life races anyway and 2) against control, SoLaS should give me the same damage bonus of Jitte over two turns but also provide protection from spot removal and recur threats in case the opponent topdecks a sweeper. Not having to pick between losing Hellbent and losing two cards should also be a very minor, but very welcome side benefit.

[mercenarybdu]

Although Jitte has been a part of the deck, I find that the Swords have given the players the edge most of the time due to the stable boosts that it out fits the creatures in most situations.

[Clark Kant]

With so many over powered creatures, Lightning Greaves could work.

You can play it turn one off an Ancient Tomb, and it will later on give your pit dragon haste (killing them one turn faster). and will protect it from removal