Merged the "Tips on Playing MUC" thread from "Forum Discussion" here. Shit may be a little confusing above with the merge.
I had a plan with this prototype but my original didn't quite work due to budget cuts, so when I do find the funding I might end up building this plan if the format doesn't shift drastically yet.....
8 Island
4 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
4 Lonely Sandbar
4 Quicksilver Dragon
4 Spire Golem
2 Vesuvan Shapeshifter
4 Spellsnare
4 Stifle
4 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Serum Visions
4 Daze
2 Shackles
SB
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Pithing Neddle
2 Spell Snare
2 Echoing Truth
3 Is. Scepter
....I have not much of a clue of how the deck will fair against the field but with everyone's ideas we could put this on the top of the standings one of these days or perhaps make it a premier.
@ mercenarybdu
basically you have just posted a decklist that looks totally different to anything that has been posted previously. The decks that have been listed contain cards that have been discussed (at length, even with things that would normally seem obvious like 4x brainstorm, have been talked over), have been tested and have been fiddled with in terms of numbers of those particular cards.
You can't just post a list with a radically different layout and ask for us to contribute and make it a deck that will win you tournaments. For that you should really be posting in the new and developmental forum.
If you would like to have a MUC deck that will fair well against the field, might i suggest you take a look at what has been put together by peope who have posted before you.
Don't get me wrong. There is nothing wrong with innovation - but you should explain why you feel that spire golem or quicksilver dragon deserve a place in the list.
here are some questions about your list which should really have been addressed by you in your post:
what is quicksilver dragon doing in there? has he proven to be invalueable in certain matches?
same question applies to spire golem ^^
the lack of card draw would seem to be a problem... am i wrong?
low land count, even if you were going to play the lonely sandbars as lands - MUC and dedicated control lists in general run large numbers of land.
your list does not include any board sweepers like engineered explosives or powder keg - how do you not lose to aggro?
has the tempo loss caused by daze not caused you a great deal of problems?
by now i'm testing Guile as my only finisher, running 3 Cryptic command, 4 Propaganda and 3 Shackles by maindeck to have a large number of tempo spells against aggro and aggro-control.
Anyone have tested it before?
Guile is useless it's just a 6/6 that comes down with UUUUUU.
there are far better WC
Everybody knows it. Tell me why it is useless if you have tested it.Originally Posted by Poron
Would you play an unblockable Sea Monster in MUC? If no,then don't play Guile. If yes, then relearn how to play magic.
because a Morphling is far better? Meluko is 4 times bigger? Even Rainbow Efreet is better then Guile here
@slobad23
I put the Dragons in there as it gave me some tempo in the early game as I later threw in the Shapeshifters as something to throw off my opponent. The Dragons have won me games in the past when I still played T2 and Extended, and I intend to repeat the trend here as a midranged creature in the plan. The golems are there for the same reason as it gave me tempo.
Sandbars are just mainly there just to cycle for more card bringing my amount of card drawing tools to 12.
I put a set of Daze in the plan since I liked ambush tactics so Force of Will won't be so obvious as I would have 14 blockades.
Opps, I made an error when typing up that SB. As it should be....
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Pithing Neddle
2 Echoing Truth
3 Is. Scepter
2 Capsize
....I had some other ideas for this plan which included:
Foil
Jushi Apprentice
Sword of F/I (when I had a lot of creatures to boot)
Perlious Research (I thought it was a pretty good trade off for two mana and a permanent)
Additional Capsize
Boomerang
Voidmage Prodigy
Dimir Guildmage
Izzet Guildmage
Sea Drake (I put the dragons in over this option after doing an analysis about the entire card)
Gifts Ungiven
Intuition
I never imagined to see:
Morphling
Fact or Fiction
....in a format of limitless options to construct, I find every opportunity to try to make the deck better and better from my original plan.
My plan started out as a monoblue aggro, then it shifted to aggro control and soon I just found myself with a control deck that wasn't quite there. Afterwards I dove this straight into making it work in this format with my own take on the plan. Although my original has been long dismantled, I still have ambitions for the plan.
In fact I need to do a bit more renovation with it as this was just a draft of mine.
MB mods:
-2 Spellsnare
+2 Perilous Research
-2 Stifle
+2 Echoing Truth
Your manabase looks like a mess especially since your playing an one color deck. You technically do not really need cycling lands with all of the utility spells blue has to offer in the draw mechanic department. Cycling lands prevents you from consistently capitalizing on the usage of shackles while not running back to basics is a big mistake as well.
I read again the thread and I still haven't understood why CounterTop wouldn't be hot here...
I find it very strong, at least Top is (very) strong even on its own with CounterBalance it just win some matches alone and anyway gives us BIG utility as draw engine and control tool...
we have just to dedicate 8 slots
This is the decklist I'm trying now
4 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
4 Spell Snare/Rune Snag (I would stay on the first perhaps...)
4 Counterbalance
4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Brainstorm
4 Impulse
4 Vedalken Shackles
3 Back to Basics
16 Islands
4 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
3 WC (Guile, Morphling, Meloku, Rainbow Efreet, etc.)
SB:
4 Arcane Laboratory
4 Trickbind (storm matchups)
3 Wipe Out
4 Propaganda (+ Back to Basics, gg Threshold, Zoo, etc.etc.)
I think CounterTop is still worth here
So what, you scoop to Nimble Mongoose? You have nothing that actually draws cards, nothing that removes permenants, and, in-turn, a much worse matchup against control. You traded away everything that makes MUC good for a tempo tool you can't utilize in any real way. Does that sound like a good option to you? If it does, go play Threshold. They make infinitely better use of Counter-Top then MUC ever could. If it doesn't, then cut Counter-Top and play a good MUC list.
Not only do you scoop to a single Mongoose, but what do you plan to do postboard?I find it very strong, at least Top is (very) strong even on its own with CounterBalance it just win some matches alone and anyway gives us BIG utility as draw engine and control tool...
O: "I play Grip - target: CB!"
You: "In response... - lol? DANG! I lost all my heavy CA and Removal to a card that sucks because I am not even able to blindly hit with it."
It takes up too many slots - 8 (!) in your build. So you are missing the tools to handle the things that slip through before your Engine is going. You even cut the pure carddraw which usually is the heart of every MUC. You will run out of gas sooner or later.
No question, it might be amazing if you get it going (but not as amazing as it is in ******** / Baseruption) but is too weak in MUC imho since you can't abuse it like the other decks.
So long,
Doks
What do you guys feel is the minimum amount of counterspells to play in MUC, regardless of meta? In my current build, I run 16 (used to run 15). I see that in Kadaj's latest build, he runs 10. I'm thinking of trimming it down to 12 so that I can fit more permanent-based solutions in my deck.
Here's the absolute-must-have counters:
4 Fow
4 Counterspell
But what about after that?
IMHO, The best hard counters (Of spells, excluding Stifle-type things) after the two listed are Spell Snare, Annul, and Dissipate. Snare probably gets the nod due to how insanely good it is on the draw. Annul or Dissipate would probably only get the nod in certain metagames.
I do think that Annul is getting stronger and stronger as the metagame evolves. However, any counter that can't stop a threat in a deck that dies to threats has problems.
I think Forbid could also be a strong contender. You may never buy it back, but its still a versatile hard counter.
I actually kinda like force spike in this deck. Its the best 1st turn play I think. Running that or spell snare along with disrupting shoal seems good too because it lets you counter 1 cc for free. Like nimble mongoose and lackey.
i pLayed a Lot Spikes and now i turned to Cryptic Command on maindeck, because if you run at least 3 or 4 copies of propaganda GobLin became a not too bad mu. I' ve noticed that running AV the deck could handle well midlate games withuout getting ever tapped to cast FoF and meaning that you are able do did a good threat with cryptic: it is at the same time an hard counter, an answer to aether vial (bouncing it), a Fog effect against aggro and, however, it recicles itself. So i think that it will be useful to play another fast counter like Spike if you are as well capable to deal without it against goblin and all other decks.
This could sound stupid but to build my current decklist i took inspiration from extended and from standard Sonic Boom over the old legacy building.
I'm thinking of a 12 counter/14 permanent board solution & win condition/10 draw config.
4 Fow
4 Counterspell
4 Spell Snare
4 Brainstorm (or AV since I'm running less counters and more permanent solutions)
3 Impulse
3 Fact or Fiction
3 Back to Basics
3 Powder Keg
3 Propaganda
3 Vedalken Shackles
1 Morphling
1 Meloku (or Rainbow Efreet)
20 Island
4 Quicksand
So, I'm going to play this deck once again in a fairly large tournament. Here's my decklist.
The thing with this list is that I don't run many permanent controlpieces:
3 Propaganda
2 Powder Keg
2 Vedalken Shackles
2 Back to Basics
I would probably like 1 more Shackles, 1 more B2B, and 1 more keg/ganda. I don't know what I'll cut though, and which card's best of those cards I mentioned.
Any tips?
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