UW Sanctuary (Helm/RiP combo)

[alphastryk]

Hey guys, I've been doing a lot of work on this deck, and I figured I would share my current list and some thoughts.

First, the list (As of today):

Card Selection / Tutors:
4 Brainstorm
3 Ancestral Vision
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Enlightened Tutor
Combo Pieces:
4 Rest in Peace
3 Energy Field
2 Helm of Obedience
Protection:
4 Force of Will
3 Spell Pierce
2 Vendilion Clique
Control Elements:
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Counterbalance
3 Swords to Plowshares
1 Detention Sphere
Manabase:
3 Tundra
4 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
6 Island
2 Plains
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Karakas
1 Academy Ruins

Sideboard:
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Luminarch Ascension
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pithing Needle
1 Cursed Totem
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Flusterstorm
2 Supreme Verdict
1 Porphyry Nodes
2 Counterbalance
1 ?

I started with more of control shell, closer to Miracles and the list from Carsten Kotter's article. I found that some of the cards there just did not pull their weight, so I've been moving away from that.

This list is currently setup with a blue-heavy metagame in mind. Ancestral Vision is hugely powerful now, as the format is for the most part pretty slow. It lets you out-card Miracles, and you already have too many 'must counter's for them. I feel like I have a decent match-up against most decks, with the major exception being Pernicious Deed / Abrupt Decay decks. The combo has been relatively easy to assemble and protect, and gives you such a powerful endgame compared to Miracles. This deck has a lot going on, and the ability to take different lines and play control or combo as needed honestly feels like a Vintage deck to me.

Please let me know what y'all think, I'd be happy to discuss any card choices, changes, etc.

[Darkenslight]

I'm genuinely curious as to why the Ruins is in there. How are you finding the nonbo-ness once RiP is out?

[alphastryk]

I'm genuinely curious as to why the Ruins is in there. How are you finding the nonbo-ness once RiP is out?

So, I genuinely realize it looks awful, but I've had a lot of games vs control where you actually win by slowly milling them out with Helm, and having the ruins gives you that inevitability. I don't think it really costs you much to have the colorless land, and I can't think of anything else I want more.

Also, I left out the maindeck detention sphere form my list in that post. Edited now.

[Darkenslight]

So, I genuinely realize it looks awful, but I've had a lot of games vs control where you actually win by slowly milling them out with Helm, and having the ruins gives you that inevitability. I don't think it really costs you much to have the colorless land, and I can't think of anything else I want more.

Okay, that makes sense. Thanks for answering.

[Pelikanudo]

I've been testing the Akatsumis list lately and seems strange to me how this works that it works,
(4 E.Field 4 RiP 4 balance, 1 p.nelde, 1 P.Nodes, 2 D.Sphere, 4 E.Tutor 3 S.Pierce, etc..)

I think the idea of redundancy always will be ok even with those A.Decays, I mean:
If A.Decay targets C.B. the it will not target RiP, simple and effective.

I even think that the side is great tunnig the deck into a Miracles.
I will probably put up the number of Terminus OR maybe switch to Verdic.

I'm considering playing Redirect in side as 2 Of Opinions? Misdirection maybe?
Also considering in putting in Standstill as 2 Of as or anything to get C.A. like more Jaces.

The thing is that is we next tune the deck into miracles the idea is to make Permanent Hate useless and Terminus seems good in conjuntion to Senseis and Brianstorm And SnapcasterToBrainstorm And Jace and we'll need more spaces.

How has been the testing vs BUG? any idea on how to handle?

[Fropper]

This deck just won the Dutch legacy championship a few hours ago. I have no list yet but I'll post it when I get it.

[Greenpoe]

Standstill sounds entirely awful in this deck. If there's a threat on the board, you want to deal with (or invalidate) it through RiP/Field, Nodes, etc. If there are no threats on the board, you want to lay down your locks or strengthen them. If your locks are down, you want to win the game. Standstill doesn't help with this plan. Plus, Standstill is awful against any Vial deck or any creature deck that can drop a threat on turn 1 (or 2). What were you planning on using it against, anyway?

I think the side-into-UW Miracles could be a good idea, at least it would make the deck strongrt vs. BG decks, but is that worth devoting more than half your SB to? But, at any rate, I still think Stifle is really good as a 2-of or 3-of, sicne a well-placed Stifle can be absolutely critical (Stifle pridemage/Deed/Rector, etc.), and Stifling their fetch will secure easy, easy wins as well. Stifle targets are everywhere (Miracle cards, Matron, Explorer, Stoneforge, Witness, Oblivion Ring/Detetion Sphere, Wasteland), and against so many cards, it's pratically a 1-mana counterspell. Also, if they ever have a Chalice@2 (and not at 1), you can cast your 2-mana spell then Stifle the Chalice.

[alphastryk]

...
Also considering in putting in Standstill as 2 Of as or anything to get C.A. like more Jaces.
....

I've been very happy playing Ancestral Vision in that role.

[Fropper]

Here's the decklist that won the Dutch Legacy Championship yesterday

//Instants/Sorceries
3 Terminus
4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
3 Spell Pierce

//Enchantments
1 Detention Sphere
1 Back to Basics
4 Rest in Peace
4 Counterbalance
3 Energy Field

//Artifacts
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Helm of Obedience
1 Pithing Needle
4 Sensei's Divining Top

//Lands
4 Flooded Strand
2 Marsh Flats
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Karakas
1 Seat of the Synod
2 Tundra
2 Plains
7 Island

//Sideboard
1 Disenchant
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Humility
1 Luminarch Ascension
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Porphyry Nodes
1 Terminus
1 Detention Sphere
4 Flusterstorm
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Pithing Needle

[Koby]

Here's the decklist that won the Dutch Legacy Championship yesterday

//Instants/Sorceries
3 Terminus
4 Enlightened Tutor
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
3 Spell Pierce

//Enchantments
1 Detention Sphere
1 Back to Basics
4 Rest in Peace
4 Counterbalance
3 Energy Field

//Artifacts
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Helm of Obedience
1 Pithing Needle
4 Sensei's Divining Top

//Lands
4 Flooded Strand
2 Marsh Flats
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Karakas
1 Seat of the Synod
2 Tundra
2 Plains
7 Island

//Sideboard
1 Disenchant
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Humility
1 Luminarch Ascension
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Porphyry Nodes
1 Terminus
1 Detention Sphere
4 Flusterstorm
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Pithing Needle

This list looks must like how I would have liked to play it when I did about 3 weeks ago at a SCG IQ. Nice to see it win the whole enchilada!

[Griselpuff]

Anybody know how many people/what other decks Top 8'd? I'd love to see a link with that info.

[MVC]

118 people.

Top 8 consisted out of:

UW Blade
Esper Blade
UW Countertop
RUG
UW Sanctuary
ANT
TES
TNT

[gkraigher]

118 people.

Top 8 consisted out of:

UW Blade
Esper Blade
UW Countertop
RUG
UW Sanctuary
ANT
TES
TNT

Doesn't surprise me that he won, with a top 8 consisting of 2 deck with wasteland. I really like his deck, he trimmed a lot of fat. But I don't think it could win a grand prix unless he gets rid of the seat of the synod and puts the karakas in the board.

I am debating playing RUG delver, High Tide, or Rest in Peace at the next big tourney. I believe all of these decks are Tier 1. Yes, this Rest in Peace deck is TIER 1.

All RUG delver decks must play thought scour now, with null rod, ancient grudge, and pyroblasts out of the board to battle this deck. This deck is a really bad match up for them because rest in peace renders everything but delver useless. I don't think there is anyway for High Tide to beat this deck, not with all the hate. Rest in Peace has an interesting effect of making their Time Spirals worse, because you lose your cycling cards like brainstorm, preordain, and ponder but keep islands in the deck.

[lochlan]

Doesn't surprise me that he won, with a top 8 consisting of 2 deck with wasteland. I really like his deck, he trimmed a lot of fat. But I don't think it could win a grand prix unless he gets rid of the seat of the synod and puts the karakas in the board.

You think that with 8x fetches and 9x basics (not to mention 4x Brainstorms and 4x Top), two measly non-basic lands (out of four non-basics total, excluding fetches) are going to ruin his game plan against a large field because..."Wasteland"? That just doesn't make any sense.

[gkraigher]

I've made this argument before, but I don't see what Seat of the Synod and Karakas do for the deck. Energy Field is designed to beat decks that run 4 wasteland, so the more non-basics you play, the more likely you are to lose a key energy field. I don't see why opening yourself up to losing a great card is worth splashing a land you can enlightened tutor for. If anything, I believe Seat of the Synod should be Land Tax. Its enlightened tutorable, and has a much better effect on the game than Seat of the Synod. If you have to enlightened tutor for a Seat you are keeping a bad hand and desperate for lands but have access to a white mana.

[lochlan]

I've made this argument before, but I don't see what Seat of the Synod and Karakas do for the deck.

1) Seat of the Synod can be tutored by E.Tutor
2) Karakas bounces Gaddock Teeg, which prevents you from playing your win condition. It also keeps Thalia off the table, protects you from Show and Tell into Emrakul, etc.

I haven't personally decided to play with Seat of the Synod, but--reflecting on the number of times I've had a surplus of E.Tutors and needed a fourth land I was having trouble finding--I can see why some people would play it. Not playing Karakas, on the other hand, just sounds horrible--since its omission means you can potentially lose the game to a Grizzly Bear that can be tutored for. You have some options against Teeg without it, sure (Porphyry Nodes comes to mind), but Karakas is simply another avenue by which you can deal with one of the deck's major weakpoints.

Energy Field is designed to beat decks that run 4 Wasteland, so the more non-basics you play, the more likely you are to lose a key energy field.

Yeah, which is why you play nine basics. Do you not see how nine basics and eight fetches is sufficient to alleviate any Wasteland issues?

I don't see why opening yourself up to losing a great card is worth splashing a land you can enlightened tutor for.

But it doesn't do that. If you're truly in the awkward board state where you have E.Field and no Rest in Peace (which is--let's be honest--not really where you want to be with this deck) and you know your opponent is on Wasteland, then you simply elect not to put a non-basic land into play. It's just that easy.
In this scenario you'd also find fetch lands to be pretty awkward, but that doesn't mean "omgz don't play fetch lands"--it just means play thoughtfully and with an eye toward future turns and your resource needs.

[Pelikanudo]

@Akatsusi mainly

I've been testing the initial list with a strange side and noticed how good the deck is I won al all the first games even vs BG and BUG! but lost to second and third games, I need some side strategies aand a HowToSide with this deck.

Regarding the Side I've tried a combination of Vendilion and Karakas as this in conjuntion just win games vs control and provides another WinCon,
I've also tested Misdirection and it seems good and I think this can be potentiated more by M.Mage... but when I sided I felt like I wasnt doing it well, by itself for first games seems the best deck..

Please help!

[Griselpuff]

I don't think Meddling Mage is the answer, since you want to be creature light. I'm having trouble with the MU too, I would suggest more Needles and Misdirections and perhaps go from there. Maybe Leyline of Sanctity for discard?

Anyways, here's Caleb D's recent list that placed into the Top 8 and the Top 16. It's more Miracles-y, but does have both of our combos.

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=50524

[slaydo]

I have seen the that won Dutch nationals and I think that is the way to go. Caleb's list had both combos however he trimmed down on numbers in order to add more win cons. I think that dilutes the deck. I'd rather play those extra win cons in the sb.

[Darkenslight]

The two decklists are:

Jeremy Stowe Top 16 St. Louis Open:

Maindeck:

Artifacts
1 Helm of Obedience
4 Sensei's Divining Top

Enchantments
3 Counterbalance
2 Detention Sphere
2 Energy Field
3 Rest in Peace

Instants
4 Brainstorm
2 Counterspell
1 Enlightened Tutor
4 Force of Will
4 Swords to Plowshares

Planeswalkers
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Sorceries
1 Entreat the Angels
4 Terminus

Basic Lands
4 Island
3 Plains

Lands
1 Dust Bowl
4 Flooded Strand
1 Glacial Fortress
1 Marsh Flats
3 Scalding Tarn
4 Tundra

Legendary Lands
1 Karakas

Sideboard:
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Pithing Needle
1 Aura of Silence
1 Luminarch Ascension
1 Counterspell
1 Path to Exile
2 Spell Snare
3 Vendilion Clique
2 Jace Beleren
1 Supreme Verdict

Caleb Durward Top 8 St. Louis Open:

Maindeck:

Artifacts
1 Helm of Obedience
4 Sensei's Divining Top

Enchantments
3 Counterbalance
2 Detention Sphere
2 Energy Field
3 Rest in Peace

Instants
4 Brainstorm
2 Counterspell
1 Enlightened Tutor
4 Force of Will
4 Swords to Plowshares

Planeswalkers
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Sorceries
1 Entreat the Angels
4 Terminus

Basic Lands
5 Island
3 Plains

Lands
2 Arid Mesa
1 Dust Bowl
4 Flooded Strand
1 Glacial Fortress
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Scalding Tarn
3 Tundra

Legendary Lands
1 Karakas

Sideboard:
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Helm of Obedience
1 Pithing Needle
1 Aura of Silence
1 Luminarch Ascension
1 Counterspell
1 Path to Exile
2 Spell Snare
3 Vendilion Clique
2 Jace Beleren
1 Supreme Verdict

What I find interesting is in the choices of lands in otherwise identical lists.