That was absolutely brutalOriginally Posted by Admiral_Arzar
Just as I was despairing of Painter's place in the meta, WOTC makes us a new toy. The new Feldon card is BUSTED. And fetchable with Recruiter. Maybe U/R with Dack is the better home though...
And what card is that?
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I think he means this guy:
Yep that's it. Think about the possibilities: he can copy recruiters every turn, he creates instant speed food for Welder that is card advantage instead of neutral, the copy triggers exit and enter abilities on things like wurmcoil and myr battlesphere, etc. This dude may not be at his max bustedness with Painter, but I think IP can use him to good effect.
I didn't end up playing in eternal weekend as it was taking a while to start so I dropped out to chill and play casual. The mystery card I've been running is assemble the legion. Basically just a tutorable single card win-con that can't be decayed or attacked like a planeswalker and will eventually overrun even through bridge. Also been thinking about the meta and how it's all tempo I think I'm going to shift more towards Seth's build with rip-helm board over the underperforming crypts. It's going to be a struggle as I really don't know how to board with it, I just know it's probably a better direction to take.
Testing this:
Changes to main are -1 revoker, +1 EE/ratchet bomb. Leaning ee for counterbalance reasons but also need to keep moon in mind so it's undecided.
Side would be as follows, accounting for the new slot from bomb.
4 firebolt
3 rip
1 helm
1 bridge
1 reb
1 vandal
1 legion
1 canonist
1 thorn
1 trini
Could be terrible, could be great. Don't really know.
Strawberry Shortcake
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake
What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
#FreeNedleeds
So I took iPainter to SCG Minneapolis yesterday and made top 16. My win-and-in match came down to one decision, which was the wrong one, but I'll get to that later. Wanted to write a very brief tourney report and my thoughts on the deck and matchups.
First, here's the list I played: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=75202
The one slot I really wasn't sure about was the one Relic of Progenitus main. It was a third enlightened tutor until the night before but I was having a little difficulty with getting tutors stuck in my hand after a blood moon drop. I went with Relic as it cantrips in case it's irrelevant and it's the best card to hold back treasure cruise/dig through time without messing with your own grave. I actually only saw it in one game against Lands and it was somewhat relevant. You will also notice I'm down to 3 recruiters which I personally think is fine as you really only need to typically find one. I would consider taking the relic out for either the 3rd tutor again or another land, as my biggest problem on the day was being land short a few times.
Anyway, here's the report. This is mostly just by memory so bear with me....
Round 1: Bye. So, the tourney started at 9am and because SCG Opens historically started at 10am, many who pre-registered showed up late. I was the lucky beneficiary to one of those. I never saw an opponent. I did get to sit next to Feline playing High Tide which was kinda fun to watch.
1-0
Round 2: Jeskai Delver. (I don't play standard so I'm still getting used to these names). This was against Anthony, the guy who won the whole thing. I've played against him several times locally and knew he would be on some form of delver. Anyway, I lost 1-2. One game I locked him out with Blood Moon. The other two games he went stoneforge into Jitte quickly and once Jitte gets some counters on it, we are in trouble. This is the only reason I would consider going back to the RIP/Helm combo in the board. Again, more on that later.
1-1
Round 3: UR swiftspear delver: this deck was all over the place. I will just say that blood moon is better than I thought in this MU. They actually run very few islands and if they can't/don't fetch one early they can be in trouble. They also can't sac their fetch lands to fill up the grave for treasure cruise either. He got in early damage but I stabilized and combo'd out in 2.
2-1
Round 4: RUG delver: see above. I got blood moon out early and shut him off his colors and then just had to clean up the board.
3-1
Round 5: UR swiftspear delver: this one went to 3. I got him game one with blood moon. Second game and third game I land turn 0 Leyline which shut off his burn but in game two he answered everything else I did and beat me down. I was a little greedy this game and didn't play around daze the way I should. Game 3 I had leyline and CoP: red down which shut off his swiftspears. He still had flipped delver that was hitting me. His last turn he tapped his one red source (was busy fetching his 2 islands) for young pyro and I had combo in hand which I dropped and killed him with. He then showed me the bolt he had in his hand which he didn't keep mana open for.
4-1
Round 6: RUG delver: this was againsst the draconis2000 guy that streams on Twitch all the time. He is playing RUG delver with goyfs and treasure cruise and swears it still works. Well, I hit early blood moon game one. Game two he had answers and dropped 2 goyfs on the table early and started beating me down. He got me down to like 7 life when I dropped bridge to stabilize a turn, another blood moon the next turn to shut off his mana and then combo'd out. 2-0
5-1
Round 7: BUG Delver: yes, I played against 6 delver matchups in a row. This is why I started playing this deck. It was amazing. We went to 3 games. Game one was turn 2 blood moon and he was out of the game. I just beat him down with dorks and Jaya burn FTW. Game 2 he got me when I didn't see blood moon and he just attritioned me out. He had 2 abrupt decays for my two painters. Game 3 he answered two blood moons with FoW and had a delver and deathrite beating me but his hand was depleted. I dropped my combo with one red up and a pyroblast, knowing from his delver flip that he just had a brainstorm left. He brainstormed in response to painter and I blasted it. He had to top-deck an answer to my combo for the win....he didn't.
6-1
Round 8: Lands. This is my win-and-in match. I don't know what my opponent is on. Game one he drops taiga and rishadan port. I respond to him porting my fetch with a crack and drop a turn 2 blood moon and he scoops. Game two he turn one fetches a forest and has mox diamond. I drop an early blood moon but he has ray of rev to answer it. He also drops a dark depths. I take out ray of rev with relic so he can't flash it back and then drop RiP. He EOT crop rotates for thespian stage and smashes me with a 20/20.
Game 3 is interesting. My opening hand is mountain, tomb, 2 blood moon, painter, and 2 blasts. I'm on the play, drop mountain and pass. He cracks fetch for his forest and plays exploration and then drops a grove of the burnwillows. Here is my decision. I don't remember what I draw but it isn't a land. I drop tomb and can either play painter and blast his forest, or I can drop moon. The risk of playing painter is that if he has a wasteland then I am down to a mountain and won't get blood moon in. If I drop blood moon he might have an answer. Well, I decide to drop blood moon. He untaps, plays thespian stage and dark depths and passes. I again don't draw a land and drop painter with my two available mana. He eot krosan grips my blood moon, untaps, plays tabernacle and passes with dark depths/stage up. I untap, pay for tabernacle with tomb and draw a city of traitors. So now I have blood moon and 2 blasts. I know he will just make a 20/20 in response to blood moon so I attack with painter. He attempts to make a 20/20 in response but I blast his dark depths. Now however I don't have any more colored mana. He untaps and drops a second depths and doesn't make the same mistake twice. He immediately makes a 20/20 but is tapped out. So I untap with one mountain and 2 sol lands and painter on the board. I pay for tabernacle with my mountain, knowing that if I draw a grindstone I win. I could also draw a bridge to hold back his token. I draw......blast. I lose to lands 1-2 and am out of top 8. The lands player ID'd next round to make top 8. I am aghast that I just lost to lands, probably the best MU that we could ever ask for. I did mention to him my potential play of painter blast his forest. He had no answer and no wasteland in hand.
6-2
Round 9: shardless BUG. We I.D. to make top 32 for prize and because I played two of the people who are in top 8 I come in 15th on tie-breakers.
Overall, a fun day. I know the U/R painter player who made T8 and we were talking throughout the day. We have actually played each other at our local shop as well, which is another MU where the white leylines have won me matches. I will say, watching his win-and-in last round, that version of the deck is definitely a turn faster than ours unless we see natural combo or tutor. However, they are less resilient and he says he can't beat delver decks but he only saw one all day.
As for my SB, white leylines are amazing and the CoP red kept me alive against UR delver. I never saw miracles, elves, or chalice of the void so the vexing shusher and grafdigger's cage never came in. Pyrokinesis came in against delver a lot and was okay. If I were to play anything else, it would probably be sudden shock as I like it against stoneforge but doesn't do the work against elves or goblins (or soldiers!) that pyrokinesis can. I do think pyrokinesis is good. There were two occasions in the day where I put painter on red and pitched a land to it. Most of the other SB pieces are pretty standard. I do which I could fit in another bridge somewhere. I also wish we had a really good answer to Jitte. That card just wrecks us if we let it get 3 or more counters. I was playing a copy of shattering spree in my board but took it out for shusher. Would maybe consider going back to Manic Vandal over Heretic just because of Jitte. Heretic is just so much better against most other matchups, like MUD, Tezz, etc. I also bring it in against Miracles as you can continuously mess with their tops.
Chandra was fantastic every time she hit play and I definitely have no plans on taking her out. There was one game where I activated her 0 ability to flip a blast and then could drop combo and go off with protection. Her card advantage alone is great. She is also amazing against elves if you can get her online fast enough. Jack, I also played around with Assemble the Legions a little and could easily see swapping it in for Koth in the board against Miracles. Either is fine. Again though, I played with RiP/Helm combo A LOT online and could never get it to fire off. It's too hard to find the pieces. The only MU I really liked it in was sneak and show, as both pieces to real work in that MU, even without the other. However, I would take out the welders as they are obviously bad with RiP in play and then our main combo is just so much weaker. Rip does have splash damage against treasure cruise now so maybe if you totally committed with like 4 RiP and 2 Helm in the board and 3-4 tutors to make sure you see the combo pieces, it might work. I guess you will have to see for yourself.
Finally, I would just say that Blood Moon is still extremely relevant and won me most of my games. I can't believe I almost considered cutting one. Tutors are also very good and can either be turn 2 blood moons 5-6 (or 7) or get you your combo. However, they are a little difficult to play sometimes, even with 3 petals and a basic plains in my list. If I were to drop the relic for a third tutor I would probably split my acceleration to 4 petals and 1 monkey. Overall, as long as you have 4 painters, 4 grindstones and 4 blood moons, you probably are doing something right. Good luck painting.
Last edited by drude1; 10-27-2014 at 01:38 PM.
Good work man. I saw the name and list and knew I'd have a good report to read. As far as rip helm, I'm thinking I'd just bring it in vs bad matchups and ones where I'm already bringing rip in. Again I'm not sure.
Also, correct me if I'm wrong on the game state/what happened and I hope this isn't taken the wrong way, but I think you made a tiny misplay against lands game 3. But it's painter and we don't have crutchstorm so they get magnified and I think you would have top8d otherwise.
So he goes to stage copy the depths and you blast the depths in response right? If you allow that part to resolve, he sacs the depths with counters due to legend rule, leaving the copy depths. The 'when this has no counters, sac it, if you do make lage' trigger happens. So if you blast copy depths (stage) in response to that, there's no depths to sac, no lage, and you nab both lands in the process with one blast so when he has the follow up depths he needs to find a loam or 2nd stage.
Strawberry Shortcake
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake
What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
#FreeNedleeds
What a dick...
Yeah, as it turns out that play would have been ideal. The thought on how to best respond to stage trigger sat in my brain for a minute. I was thinking that because I know you can't stifle the effect of the dark depths making a token, maybe blowing up the land wouldn't necessarily have the effect I wanted either. I should have talked to a judge. I also didn't figure that he would have a second dark depths waiting in the wings either. In hindsight, that definitely would have been a better play. Live and learn I guess.
Congrats on the finish.
I saw the name and thought it might have been you. Shame about the Depths/Stage play. Honestly, I didnt know it was something you could respond to either. I thought it fell under state-based effects. Good to know now!
Congrats drude! When I saw the deck in the top 16 I was pretty excited and was hoping I'd get a report.
I also went to eternal weekend, but unlike Jack I decided to play despite the 2 hour delay. I also really wanted to practice for GP NJ and finished black bordering out the deck and needed to play in order to justify getting my German Plateaus. I was planning to do a detailed report but after an exhausting weekend (I played all ten rounds and judged sunday) I don't remember everything. Being on painkillers for a broken bone doesn't help.
Rd 1 - RUG Delver w/ pyro and cruise over mongoose
Game 1 - After all that waiting I go turn one blood moon and my opponent still doesn't get to play magic.
Game 2 - I resolved an early magus of the moon but he already had a goyf out and I couldn't get another creature to stick nor do I see an E Bridge. After a while I get goblin welder out but it's not doing much. Soon after I found a painter and was holding a reb. I play the painter but wait a turn to reb the goyf so I can weld painter back in in case he tries to bolt the painter in response. EOT he blasts my magus and I choose to let that resolve thinking getting rid of goyf is more important. I should have blasted then as I believe he might have been tapped out but I waited for whatever reason and he krosan grips my painter on his turn and I get punished for waiting.
Game 3 I him a few times before he plays a young pyro but I cast an ensnaring bridge and cut him off of attacking which gets more brutal when I resolve a blood moon. He kills 3 or maybe all 4 of my painter's and I'm not finding welders. My opponent is visibly annoyed at being locked out but keeps trying to find an answer. Eventually I use top and find two firebolts to kill him with. Yay flashback. His probes, force of wills, and fetches also helped me diminish his life total
(1-0)
Rd 2 - Esper Deathblade
My opponent was pretty pleasant which was nice after the previous match and we checked in on each other a few times throughout the day.
Game 1 - Pretty interesting match. I started with a mountain into Top. He does nothing on turn 1 but fetches to swords to plowshares my turn 2 welder. He then cast stoneforge mystic and gets batterskull. I cast revoker and name sroneforge. He soon after resolves a True-Name, lili, and deathrite. I had out ensnaring bridge so I was able to stop death that way and was able to use welder tricks with timing to get revoker in to and out of my graveyard naming lili for a bit and then deathrite shaman and was able to use top to filter into the combo while my opponent was hellbent.
Game 2 I got a blood moon while my opponent had one land. I won.
(2-0)
Rd 3 - Death and Taxes
Game 1 He has the early aggression and taxing effects just like he is supposed to but thankfully I am able to resolve a blood moon so that I can use my mana and then the turn before death I am able to engineer a win.
Game 2 was utterly ridiculous. He has an early revoker of grindstone but I am able to equip Sword of Light and Shadow to an early painter and start to gain life back and take out two chunks of my opponent. But then he has a flier so I have to get Ensnaring Bridge on the field. He flickerwisps to get some damage in and gets a revoker in on something else. Welder maybe? So we've come to a standoff of sorts with me having out two E Bridges and two Blood Moons which I left them in for karakas, wasteland, and port. He has multiple revokers, aven mindcensors, two mother of runes, and a spellskite or two. This ends when I draw chandra, pyromaster and over 11 turns punch out his life total. I did not pop the ultimate as the only spell I wanted to hit was firebolt and I had a top out so I always knew it wasn't in the top 3 and might not have gotten there. He finally top decks his final revoker for chandra while he was at two but then I finally found firebolt.
(3-0)
Rd 4 - Sneak and Show
Game 1 I kept a hand that might have worked against a fair deck but folded very quickly to sneak attack throwing monsters at my face. I'm not sure he should have kept his hand either but it worked out but he seemed a bit flooded.
Game 2 I had to mulligan low and proceed to flood out. I'm sad to get my first loss but am still happy with how its been going.
(3-1)
Rd 5 - Burn
I played against a local player. So we had some pleasant conversation. He had his deck stolen which sucks but thankfully (for him, not me) he was able to get burn together in time.
Game 1 - He kills me very quickly with 6 spells I believe.
Game 2 - We both mulligan to 6. Since I have to call a judge to shuffle the wonderful Liz Richardson comes over and while there we have a nice conversation between the three of us and she apologizes for being a slow shuffler which my opponent and I both laugh at. Not going to be a long match. So turn 1 he suspends rift bolt. I Play a turn 2 trinisphere. I won pretty easily after that.
Game 3 - I played turn one tomb into grindstone and was setting up for a turn three kill followed by a turn four kill with reb back up if he killed the painter the first time, but he cast smash to smithereens on my grindstone game two. Whoops, I missequenced. Should have led with the painter.
(3-2)
Rd 6 - Mirror
Game one I go turn 1 ancient tomb, lotus petal, blood moon. He goes arid mesa into a top and I put him on miracles. I okay turn two grindstone and leave one mana up. He plays turn 2 arid mesa, painter's servant. My mind is blown, first by the fact this is the mirror, second by the fact he would do that. I expect he has a simian spirit guide/lotus petal, and a blast effect but he says if I have a land I kill him. I play a land and win.
Game 2 Neither of us knows how to board. He takes out his welders and revokers, to bring in RIP, Koth, Manic Vandal, and REB. I took out blood moons for Koth, REB, E Bridge, and Tormod's Crypts. He plays a magus of the moon early, which I am surprised to see and get out an early grindstone and continue to leave three mana up. He plays recruiter to find painter's servant and I'm not sure what to expect. The following turn he casts a jaya, tapping out, I slam the painter and mill him.
(4-2)
Rd 7 - BUG Delver (comes with a funny story)
I see my friend Zach Dobbin behind me playing against manaless dredge. For those who didn't watch coverage, Zach has 4 leyline of the voids maindeck. As I am about to take turn one I mention to my opponent that I see my friend getting up with the slip. My opponent asks, "already?!" I say, "yeah", and as I start to cast blood moon I say, "sometimes you just get blown out." My opponent looks at the card in disbelief and goes, "yep, sometimes you just get blown out" and scoops them up. Having only seen turn one Underground Sea into main phase Brainstorm I put him on storm and board as such. I have to mulligan my hand and see a beauty at 6. My opponent goes turn 1 Trop into Ponder and I go turn two blood moon. My opponent concedes and wishes me luck asks how many free wins I've gotten off blood moon. Not Enough
(5-2)
Rd 8 - Miracles
My opponent was a friend of mine who I have played twice in event before though I was on delver for those. I am pretty salty about how these games went so I won't go into as much detail. We'll just suffice it to say he answered everything, even after I got him to draw with top and fetch it away. He still miracled terminus the following turn blind and followed it up with a top off the top into counterbalance and game 2 despite my revoker on Top he was able to lock me out when he found Venser to bounce revoker, and kept it going with Karakas, and counterbalance already out.
(5-3)
Rd 9 - MUD
One of the nicest opponent's I've had. I feel bad because I could have been nicer but I was bitter, super tired, and my arm hurt. Still though I think I was wrong, though he didn't seem to mind and we talked some day 2.
Game 1 I played turn one grindstone. I revokered his metalworker on turn two. Apparently he would have killed me the following turn. I killed him on my following turn instead.
Game 2 He had a very powerful start with an early lodestone and kudoltha forgemaster but I was able to combo off on turn three again
(6-3)
RD 10 - UR Delver (don't know how it took all day)
I was accidentally dropped before the round so I made them reenter and pair me. I did however get the pair down and asked him if he would concede as I didn't believe he could prize. He said no believing he could. Upon checking later he could not. I had to mull down to 5 but killed him while I was at 2 as he had no force of wills and tapped out on his turn.
Game two I had an early e bridge and he got flooded so I won.
(7-3)
came in 45th place
Last edited by Mapson; 10-27-2014 at 08:30 PM.
Nick's the luckiest miracles player I swear
He also played well. It was just furstrating though. And seeing only two red blast effects between both games was annoying. I try to activate grindstone with double reb back up and he had two swords to plowshares and a force of will...He had ALL DEEZ!
Could you help me understand this stage copy rule again? I am looking at the cards and I still do not understand how a single blast can get rid of both the actual and the copy? Thanks!
You activate thespian's stage to copy dark depths. Due to the legend rule the controlling player must sacrifice one, he sacs the one with counters on it. He's left with a thespian's stage that is a copy of dark depths with no counters on it. At that point, the "no counters" trigger on depths happens. In response to the trigger, you can pyroblast the depths clone, and they have nothing to sac for the trigger, thus no 20/20. You've gotten a two-for-one, forcing them to sac the first dark depths and blasting the copy.
I got it! Thanks for the detailed explanation. Good info to understand.
Practically, the trigger checks twice: it checks when there's no counters on the land (ah! Thus, trigger on the stack), and it checks when the trigger is up for resolving (ah, it's really happening then). It's practically like a spell that has a target, all necessary targets must be legal when you cast the spell, and all necessary targets must be legal when it's up for resolving.
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I agree Feldon of the Third Path seems like either he'll make Mono-Red more powerful again or at least become a good choice of tutor target. I'm cautiously optimistic but he's got a strong upside. I also agree he seems stronger in MUD.
Also not sure if we are on the same page here or not but when you say he makes instant speed food for welder, isn't it even better then that. He makes Instant Speed Welder's which can eat themselves.
I'm imagining a situation like this. Painter in the GY, Goblin Welder in the GY. Feldon in play. Activate Feldon, Target Welder, Activate Welder target Welder and Painter (or whatever artifact you want). Feldon and Goblin Welder seem like BFFs to me.
I have been playing mono red for the last while and preforming well. I do NOT play with either welder, Jaya, or koth. Also no main deck bridges.
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