Main reason that Iona is in the main and that sire is in the board is because of Omnitel and lands. Going into the weekend I knew those, miracles and delver would be the best decks. Iona is insane if stuck against any of those (minus lands to a degree. An early Iona on green can be very difficult to answer), whereas sire is more answerable for sure. After the weekend there is no way I would cut Iona from the main, and when I make the torny report, it'll be more clear why. Sire is my favorite card in the deck though, and I think could easily be a maindeck card based upon your expected meta and personal preference. When I lost in the finals of scg jersey last year, I had a sire in the main, and it was great. After yesterday I would definitely consider doing it again.
Report to come in a few hours, thanks for the support guys :)
I'm more interested in the MB Grave titan. I see him as a SB target against decks with multiple LotV and edicts. What matchups do you use him in?Originally Posted by Gilderbarin216
Thank you for chatting with us and great job at the open! I am looking to take Reanimator to Eternal Weekend and the Invi, very interested to read your report!
Ok, drove to the event with some good friends, playing miracles, rug delver and lands. Felt pretty confident about every matchup except for death and taxes and some of the bug based delver decks. Omnitell, miracles, non-rug delver decks and lands are what i thought would be big at the event, mostly towards day two, so i wanted to make my deck as "low-to the ground" as possible, because i knew people would be gunning for the show and tell players. Because of that, i excluded show and tell. For a while I've been wanting to replace that slot with something that couldn't be pyroblasted or spell pierced in matches where i would want to go over their hate, but i wasn't happy with anything. Show and tell being 3 mana in a format dictated by wasteland and daze made me feel uneasy. In the end, i decided that instead of things like show and tell, i wanted to make our game plan as lucrative and efficient as it could be in each matchup, which is where my sideboard over performed. Earlier in this thread i discounted the power of the 7th discard spell, but after this event i think that discard is exactly where your want to be. I feel like people give you credit for being a blue deck because game one you have daze and force of will, but if what we want to be is a "blue deck" then we should just play omni tell. Blanking pyroblasts all weekend was very cool. Anyway, heres how my matches went as i can recall:
Here is my list for reference:
3 griselbrand
1 Iona, shield of emeria
1 tidespout tyrant
1 elesh norn, grand cenobyte
1 grave titan
4 brainstorm
4 ponder
3 thoughtsieze
4 careful study
4 entomb
4 reanimate
4 daze
4 exhume
4 force of will
3 lotus petal
4 polluted delta
3 verdant catacombs
4 underground sea
2 tropical island
2 swamp
Board:
3 abrupt decay
3 duress
2 pithing needle
2 surgical extraction
1 thoughtsieze
1 massacre
1 disfigure
1 Aetherling
1 sire of insanity
1) omni tell: win 2-0
probably the reason that the deck is so well positioned right now is because this matchup is very favored. At points in the game if you can hide the fact that you are on reanimator, they will cast show and tell into your griselbrand, which allows you to draw 14 cards and often kill them (Granted cunning wish is very good in this scenario.) Anyway, we are often much quicker, our disruption both games one and two is much better, and we have the added effect of having iona in our main deck, which makes it unreasonable for them to kill us through our first reanimate.
2) Infect: win 2-0
this matchup is better than not, but is definitely more intricate than the others. They are a daze/piece/force combo deck as well, and they are often just as quick as us. My opponent was not, unfortunately and i put elsesh norn into play through his disruption games one and two. Interesting thing about the games you play against the "Aggressive blue decks", is that once you resolve a timely discard spell, their pants are often down. If you know about your opponents fluster storm and daze, then play accordingly and take what you think you won't have the time to play around. Besides their drawsteps there is very little to feign at that point.
Some variants of this deck often splash white for things iike rest in peace and swords to plowshares, as well as crop rotation for karakas and bojuka bog, which makes your discard spells very valuable, as to not give them the time to resolve these spells or leave them up hoping that we play into them. An elsesh norn will close out a game here, as well as iona on green, but make sure that you are safe on board first. Ive lost many games to inkmoth nexus and blighted agent, even after i put a guy into play. Otherwise, i like this matchup a lot, and i think that our board plan of no counterspells, 7 discard spells and decay is very effective.
3) Miracles: lose 1-2
This is the only matchup that i actually cannot put my finger on. Based on their knowledge of your deck choice game one, the games can be difficult. People are taking after joe lossett with the double karakas lists, which makes your main deck men that aren't legendary very valuable. Game one, i try to stick grislebrand first, and then draw 7 or so cards, for when they get him off the table. You can try to prevent it, but if they have a karakas your game play has to shift towards tyrant and titan, which are admittedly alittle lackluster here. Watch for counterbalance, we have no decay main, so that plus top or even just a well placed brainstorm can be a k.o.
Game one i put a grislebrand into play on the play on turn two, and he dies. Game two he has surgical extraction and snap caster mage, which makes it tough for me to combo off. Game 3 I stick a sire of insanity after he resolves a dig and i get 7 spells out of his hand. He draws for turn and spikes a snap caster for the swords he discarded, and i lose my sire. I untap and draw exhume for my griselbrand, but am on 7 exactly. He untaps and draws jace and subsequently kills me.
for game 2 i board out all of my forces and dazes, as well as a careful study, the elesh norn, and the tidespout tyrant. study is not so hot in matchups that are incredibly grindy, because it is much less of a cantrip then we would like. Not netting a card off it makes it tough to have 4 in your deck after board, especially if they draw the game out to turns like 4 and 5. I like to again, give them as little time as possible here, because the closer they get to karakas, the closer we get to being locked out. When you try to pluck their hand, watch for brainstorm on their part, because our only other way to kill their balances and rest in peaces are the 3 decays. Your best threats game 2 are sire, if they tap out or if they have no top in play, otherwise griselbreand, and aetherling. Aetherling, besides pithing needle is unanswerable. They can race you with a timely entreat, but most lists have been playing things like monastery mentors, which make that less common.
4) Miracles: 2-0
If you lead with things like duress on turn one, and take their top, and then another discard spell on turn two, they fall very far behind. While that deck plays very well off the top, they have very limited manipulation other than their tops and brainstorms, which are very strained in this matchup. Watch for things like surgical out of the more creature heavy lists, and you should be fine. exhume is great against that card if you can manage getting 2 guys in the yard.
5) Miracles: 2-1
Game one goes well, putting a g grave titan into play on turn two and killing him with it on turn 4. Game 2 he is on the play and has rest in peace, cage, fluster storm, force and counterbalance in the first 3 turns, which i just couldn't get around. Game 3 i saw that his hand was pretty good too, when on the play i put sire of insanity into play on turn one with a discard spell. Lotus petal is pretty broken some times. :)
6) Shardless Bug: 2-0
Game one he mulligans to five and gets killed real fast. game two, he sticks a turn one deathrite which i then disfigure and he dies. The midrange matchups like stoneblade and shardless are often very easy. Their hate is limited, and their time is too. other than force and deathrite, their way of interacting on turns 1-3 are pretty strained, which makes it easy to stick an entomb and a reanimate through if you know their hand.
7) Omnitell: 2-0
he casts a turn two show and tell after a turn one preordain. I had pondered on my turn one and seen iona. He was not thrilled at how his show and tell turned out. Game two is much of the same, he brings in boseju, and because of it, my 3 discard spells make it difficlut for him to play the game, and he loses to my sire on turn 5.
8) Death and Taxes: 1-2
Worst matchup for sure. Cards like swords to plowshares and 3 karakas make it hard to play the game we want to. Thalia is a problem as well. The best way to win game one is to hope they don't have one of their karakas, and stick an iona on white, or an elsesh norn that gets good value when it hits play. Otherwise, don't have high hopes here. Game two, they have rest in peace, containment priest and the new thalia that flies. Makes it tough to win as well. Best chance is to be fast and go under them with grielbrand and draw into your massacre, or to stick a tidespout tyrant and put their board into their hand.
9) Rug delver: 2-0
easiest delver deck because of their lack of deathrite. They often have to chose between applying pressure or holding up their counterspells, which makes it easy to telegraph what they have, and how to play around it. Be careful of wasteland, and they often can't deprive you of enough resources to beat you. Game two, they have things like cage and surgical, as well as more pyroblasts and flusterstorms. For that reason, i board out all the forces and dazes, and try to just go under them. Again, very easy to kill them with a preemptive duress that lets you know which line to be taking.
ended day one at 7-2, pretty happy to be where i am, just hoping to dodge exactly death and taxes on day two.
10) CVM on omnitell: 2-1
Game one, he probes me and i thoughtsieze him early, so the cat is out of the bag on both sides. We sit their for a while, drawing and discarding because we are both low on resources. Eventually, i move to cast careful study, it resolves and i discard griselbrand. He probes me again to see 3 exhumes, iona, force, daze, blue card. He knows whats gonna happen, and conceedes. If you can sandbag your iona against them, they can almost never cast show and tell except for their emrakul. Another reason why the discard is so good, you can craft your plan around what you think their plan is, because show an tell often loses them the game unless they know a way around your fatties.
Game two, he catches me with my pants down and sticks an emrakul through a show and tell. Its difficult to have a guy in hand every game since we rely upon entomb so much for our combo to be quick. I lose two careful studies in this matchup because of that fact.
Game three I stick a grislebrand out of the yard while he has pyromancer in play with 3-4 tokens. i draw 7 and find land and a petal, and put iona into play the same turn.
11) Charlie Rineheart on camera: elves 2-1
I suggest going back and watching this match on the SCGlive archives on twitch, because its a good example of how the elves mashup usually goes. they put a lot of pressure on their death rites, and we have a lot of ways to make sure that they can't use it when we try to put elesh norn into play. Game one he dies to elesh norn after we both mulligan, game two he has double deathrite, i have needle, but he has surgical when i try to put elsesh norn into play. game 3 is quick, and my deck does what it wants to, which is disfigure/abrupt decay exactly their deathrite, and then kill them.
12) Travis Compton: lands 2-0
travis and i drove down together, and avoided each other every round on the account that we had had been in the same bracket since late saturday. We knew we would have to battle, and he was dreading it the entire time. I think that he doesnt give his deck enough credit in this matchup. They are a relatively quick deck to kill with dark depths, and they have maze of ith, karakas, and many, many ways to find their lands. You can also lose pretty quickly to wasteland locks, so be wary of that. I stick a grave titan game one, and he has only a maze of ith to answer it, and the zombies quickly eat him. Game two is much of the same. Tidespout tyranny is pretty unanswerable for them, and if you can get ahead of their trinishperes and sphere of resistances, and counter their crop rotations, you won't have too much trouble here.
13) Infect: 2-1
Got killed on turn two game one, with elf, invigorate berserk through my force of will and daze. Thats what i mean when i say the aggressive blue decks, often infect can use their forces in the way that we want to, which is to protect their combo, and make sure we stay dead. For the next games i recognize that i can't really afford to do that against a deck with fluster storm, daze and force, so i board them out. I don't remember much about these games except that he took the rout of killing me before i killed him, and thoughtsieze along with disfigure had something to say about it, and then elsesh norn got the last word.
14) Death and Taxes: 0-2
I just get rolled. Everything that could go wrong does. He has double swords for my tyrant and titan, and karakas for my griselbrand, and closed out the game with multiple flying thalias and some moms. game two, i thoughtsieze him to see containment priest, karakas, swords to plowshares, thalia, aethervial, wasteland and flicker wisp. He draws rest in peace after i take his priest, and we die very quickly. Next round is a win and in, just want to dodge D&T again, and i feel good.
15) James Rynkiewicz: 2-1
This match was really close, and i was just trying to cautious. I know what he is on, and he I, so he plays a glistener elf on turn one, and i lead with underground sea. He untaps, tanks and plays invigorate. he does it again, and i say ok. He then doesn't have a land, and plays heirarch for the last point to kill me on turn two, but i float a black and daze. I take 9 and entomb for elesh norn. I untap and have reanimate for it, and he conceedes. Game one you are both trying to accomplish the same thing, and the play is very relevant to the match because of it. Game two, he plays a turn one elf again, and i cast careful study binning iona and griselbrand. He then plays land, invigorate berserk, and we are on to game three.
Game three, he plays a few guys, and i struggle to recover from his early surgical. Eventually i ponder into 3 bad cards, shuffle, draw brainstorm. I cast brainstorm with nothing in had, and find entomb, exhume, thoughtsieze. Elsesh norn has something to say to his elves, and we are on to the top8.
In the top eight, I play Dylan Donnegan on the secondary camera match, but you probably didn't see it because he killed me so quickly.
4 Color delver: 1-2
Game one, he has dethrite with no green source, and i cantrip into exhume entomb, which i can cast on turn three. I thoughtsieze him on turn two to make sure the coast is clear, and that he isn't sandbagging the trop, and i take his cantrip leaving him with squat. In a swift motion he draws the misty rainforest off the top, and i die to a pyromancer pretty quick. Game two i kill him real quick because of thoughtsieze and a lotus petal, before he can interact much. Game 3 i lose on the draw. I have an out most of the game because he only has one deathrite, and i have a careful study with 1 guy in hand, exhume. Unfortunately, Dylan has 4 cabal therapy on his board, and i lose my hand before he kills me the turn later.
In any event, I had a great weekend, and i think the deck is really well placed. In a metagame filled with force of wills and very linear combo decks, I think reanimator is a great choice, and i really like the ability to just be the same game play after board. The only changes i would make to the list after the weekend is to fit another disfigure/massacre in the board, but i don't know at what cost. Also, i think that the aetherling could be an empyrial archangel, or at least something more general that could help in the death and taxes matchup. I don't like inkwell because i feel that it is very easily raced, but i assume the same could be said about archangel. My sideboard plans will be posted after i get home from work.
Sorry the report is so long, questions welcome about any of my matches of course, i was less thorough for the sake of the report being less than a full forum page long.
- Jake.
Grave titan is just a generally good guy, that isn't a legend. He puts 10 power on board, and if he isn't interacted with, will kill most people in two attacks. He is easily the worst creature in the deck, but he does work against most of the fair decks, and is good against karakas matchups like death and taxes.
Hey Jake!
Thank you for the Report! I was watching your elf match with a bad hangover and was cheering for you like a foodball Fan in front of the TV. My girlfriend now thinks i am insane.
I share you D&T problems, what do you think about Deed, Helm of obidience and Keranos in the sideboard?
I have tested Keranos a lot and he is just too slow. Have also tested Deed and have loved a single copy in the main to fight of deathrites and delver lists. My SB I have a split between 1 Massacre and 1 Dread of Night. Lists floating around now are skipping revokers and going for the Thalia Horse. I have also tried Tsabo's Web and while it is pretty solid against a couple of decks, I still struggle vs D&T. They are just heavily favored in my opinion
Thanks for the report!
I haven't tested Aetherling but wouldn't it be better in general for those spot removal decks? I have considered empyrial archangel a few times, however I haven't tested it at all vs D&T, it feels like it could be a better inkwell but is it worth pitching the aetherling avoidance for your miracles matches?
Keranos is definitely interesting, but i feel that the non-miracles matchups where i would want a card like that are already pretty good. If you can resolve a threat against stoneblade or shardless, regardless of what it is, it will probably kill them. that being said, miracles does not work that way either. Some players will trim on the white cards after board, and some will keep in up to 2 terminus and 3 swords. Because of that, i wanted something that could not be killed regardless of what they do (Unless they have needle in their deck, find it, and name aetherling.) I can testify that he is the real deal against miracles, but the question i have is "is he worth the slot for that one matchup.) There are definitely games where they lose to the first guy you put in play like sire or even griselbrand + 7-14 cards, so is there a real reason that that should be aetherling, and not just another guy who is reasonable in that matchup, but also in others like death and taxes where we are alittle lacking Thats where archangel would come in. I think after i play a bunch more sideboarded games against miracles, we can make an informed decision, but i don't have enough games under my belt yet to say for sure.
Sideboarding Guide:
Miracles:
Out:
4 daze
4 force of will
1 careful study
1 tidespout tyrant
1 elesh norn
In:
3 abrupt decay
3 duress
2 pithing needle
1 thoughtsieze
1 sire of insanity
1 aetherling
Rug Delver:
Out:
4 daze
2 force of will
In:
3 duress
1 thoughtsieze
2 abrupt decay
Bug/4 Color Devler
Out:
4 daze
4 force of will
In:
1 Pithing needle
3 duress
1 thoughtsieze
3 abrupt decay
Omnitell:
Out:
2 daze
2 careful study
1 lotus petal
1 elesh norn
1 grave titan
In:
2 surgical extraction
3 duress
1 thoughtsieze
1 sire of insanity
Esper/American stoneblade:
Out:
4 daze
4 force of will
1 elesh norn
1 tidespout tryant
In:
3 duress
1 thoughtsieze
1 disfigure
3 abrupt decay
1 aetherling
1 sire of insanity
Storm:
Out:
1 elesh norn
1 tidespout tyrant
1 lotus petal
1 careful study
In:
3 duress
1 sire of insanity
Lands:
Out:
2 force of will/1 thoughtsieze (1:2 respectively when on the draw)
4 daze
1 elesh norn
In:
2 surgical extraction
2 pithing needle
3 abrupt decay
Death and Taxes:
Out:
4 force of will
4 daze
In:
2 pithing needle
1 massacre
1 disfigure
1 thoughtsieze
3 abrupt decay
Elves:
Out:
4 daze
4 force of will (Preference, can leave in 1-2 if you then cut 1-2 thoughtsieze.)
In:
2 pithing needle
1 massacre
1 disfigure
1 thoughtsieze
3 abrupt decay
Shardless Bug:
Out:
4 daze
4 force of will
1 elesh norn
In:
2 duress
1 thoughtsieze
1 pithing needle
1 sire of insantiy
1 disfigure
3 abrupt decay
Grixis Control:
Out:
4 force of will
4 daze
1 tidespout tryant
In:
1 sire of insanity
2 surgical extraction
3 duress
1 thoughtsieze
2 abrupt decay
Infect:
Out:
4 force of will
4 daze
1 grave titan
1 careful study
In:
2 pithing needle
1 disfigure
3 duress
1 thoughtsieze
3 abrupt decay
Should be all the popular matchups, if there are any i missed, feel free to let me know :) Also the reasonings may be unclear places, so don't be afraid about that either.
-Jake
So you board out most or all of your countermagic in virtually every matchup?
I'm new to the deck, but why not just shave some main board for extra discard effects if they are coming in so often?
I play a slightly different version then Jake ( http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/16-07-15-reanimator/ ), but my sideboarding choices concerning what will be taken out are nearly the same.
Countermagic is important! But when you know (or anticipate) what your opponent will do to disrupt it, your sideboard is more important.
So countermagic is good game one when you are unsure about what they are going to be doing. Force of will as a catch all, and as a way to close the game with a griselbrand in play is important. After board you can afford to be more specific, and in the mathups where decay can answer their threats retroactively, and the duresses proactively, the counterspells are somewhat of a liability. There are mathcups where you can be the better "Blue deck", but against things like delver and miracles, where they have all of the countermagic you have, counter magic on their board, and elements like pyroblast and counterbalance, you want to go around their game plan of countering your spells effectively.
Exactly
Good to know, thanks guys.
Currently running 1 duress, 2 thoughtseize main, 3 duress in the board (somehow I only own 2 thoughtseize).
I'll play in a GPT this weekend and see how I like that change.
I played a round against Death&Taxes. Had a beautiful start with turn 2 exhume into non legendary creature (i was scared of karakas) but then he sworded it. From this point i couldnt recover because of wasteland, Port, Thalia, RIP and C-Priest. If i had a creature with shroud i would have won this match. I think i gonna play Inkwell leviathan maybe instead of Grave Titan and Sire of Insanity instead of Tidespout Tyrant. Therefore i lost 1:2
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Cockatrice: Deckerator
(
) Reanimator
Death&Taxes
I dont disagree that the death and taxes matchup isn't good, but don't go off the deep end. In the main, tidespout is crucial, and grave titan is much better in a myriad of matchups as well. Tyrant is our best card against lands, and is a catch-all for anything after board that we might have a problem getting off the board that elesh norn can't. I think there is a very strong argument for something like inkwell or empyrial archangel, but not at the expense of tyrant in the main. Just my 2 cents.
Thanks for your comment :) It helps me a lot to get a different point view of our creatures.
Tidespout Tyrant is mainly against what permanents in special?
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Cockatrice: Deckerator
Tyrant is generally good because regardless of the matchup, it becomes increasingly more difficult for your opponent to play with no permanents in play. Lands can't get it off the table, with 5 toughness it doesnt die to anything short of 3 punishing fires, and its a quick answer to dark depths and maze of ith. Against death and taxes, its unraceable, it can take thalia effects off the table, and without a swords to plowshares they can't get rid of it. It also lets you answer whatever your opponent uses to interact with you/ race you. Things like moat and jace that abrupt decay can't break.
How do you play against a deck with Turn 1 chalice?
More and more chalice decks appear nowadays.
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Cockatrice: Deckerator
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