[Deck] 5c Eternal Garden

[blitz]

Blizt,

I really liked gamble while I played the red splash. However, I really don't think splashing red will work as the deck is now. You'd have to rework the manabase a lot, and then make space for Gamble, B. Ring, etc. While I like Barbarian Ring and the like, I can't see making space for all of them.

If it's one thing a LAND deck can do, it's mana fixing. So yeah, 3 colors isn't asking much here, especially for you if you haven't seen any wasteland.

[94teen]

If it's one thing a LAND deck can do, it's mana fixing. So yeah, 3 colors isn't asking much here, especially for you if you haven't seen any wasteland.

I think you're stretching the mana base to the point of color screw. I also don't feel like there's space in the maindeck for it, but if you've found space I'd love to see how, as I really like gamble in the deck.

EDIT:

I'm liking the Ringvault combo here, though I'm thinking of dropping to 1 Time Vault, as multiples show up far too often. This gives you a way to 'just win' a lot more times than I thought it would, and is actually really easy to set up, especially because of City of Traitors. Recurring sources of 2 mana make it surprisingly easy to generate 7 mana in one turn, especially if you land exploration early.

Rings of Brighthearth are useful on their own for copying Coliseum and Maze and such, so they don't really hurt your gameplan, and actually help with the lack of slots a bit. I've been wanting to fit extra mazes and such in the deck for awhile, and this gives you the option. This also copies Coliseum and all kinds of other good stuff, but without requiring you to use up your land drops. This means you can effectively double (or triple with two Rings) the number of effects you get per land drop. This is huge, especially because this deck can produce that kind of mana.

The one thing that I'm really torn about right now is whether or not to go to a 2/2 split of Tombs and Cities. If you get a crucible, City is by far the better of the two in my experience. However, it also makes you a lot more vulnerable to FoW, because if you keep a crucible/city of traitors hand, and the crucible gets FoWed, there's not a whole lot you can do, because that kills your tempo and mana production for the next few turns.

Regardless, I do recommend testing the Ringvault combo a bit. Maybe it just fits my playstyle or something, but I really like it here.


EDIT (again):

Anyone considered Scrollrack here? I know it's not as efficient as top, but since I find myself digging for specific cards, it could be helpful, especially if you can't get Crucible online.

[blitz]

I think you're stretching the mana base to the point of color screw. I also don't feel like there's space in the maindeck for it, but if you've found space I'd love to see how, as I really like gamble in the deck.

EDIT:

I'm liking the Ringvault combo here, though I'm thinking of dropping to 1 Time Vault, as multiples show up far too often. This gives you a way to 'just win' a lot more times than I thought it would, and is actually really easy to set up, especially because of City of Traitors. Recurring sources of 2 mana make it surprisingly easy to generate 7 mana in one turn, especially if you land exploration early.

Rings of Brighthearth are useful on their own for copying Coliseum and Maze and such, so they don't really hurt your gameplan, and actually help with the lack of slots a bit. I've been wanting to fit extra mazes and such in the deck for awhile, and this gives you the option. This also copies Coliseum and all kinds of other good stuff, but without requiring you to use up your land drops. This means you can effectively double (or triple with two Rings) the number of effects you get per land drop. This is huge, especially because this deck can produce that kind of mana.

The one thing that I'm really torn about right now is whether or not to go to a 2/2 split of Tombs and Cities. If you get a crucible, City is by far the better of the two in my experience. However, it also makes you a lot more vulnerable to FoW, because if you keep a crucible/city of traitors hand, and the crucible gets FoWed, there's not a whole lot you can do, because that kills your tempo and mana production for the next few turns.

Regardless, I do recommend testing the Ringvault combo a bit. Maybe it just fits my playstyle or something, but I really like it here.


EDIT (again):

Anyone considered Scrollrack here? I know it's not as efficient as top, but since I find myself digging for specific cards, it could be helpful, especially if you can't get Crucible online.

I could see the rings speeding things up a bit, and the combo with vault is hilariously fitting, but I think it's still a cool thing and not a serious one.

[94teen]

Rings are definitely fun. They give the deck the second Maze, Wasteland, Colorfixing, etc that I've been trying for, and at a moderate cost. I really, really like it, and am going to keep testing it. Using ring in conjunction with City of Traitors and Cephalid Coliseum is all kinds of fun. I won't complain about drawing 12 cards and finding Time Vault.

Time Vault is...very hit and miss. But not as much as smokestack. Smokestack always either won the game or sat there doing nothing. More often than not it did nothing for me. Time Vault wins when you get it. I'm seriously considering dropping it down to one though. You have the means to recur it until it sticks, and if they're wasting resources to get rid of it, it's easier for you to continue applying pressure.

The most trouble I've had is getting the most effect out of my plays without consuming land drops. More land drops makes it much easier to control and win, and Rings give you (effectively) more.

I'm pretty sure Rings are going to be in my final list for the time being. Not so sure about Time Vault, especially as a 2 of.

[blitz]

Rings are definitely fun. They give the deck the second Maze, Wasteland, Colorfixing, etc that I've been trying for, and at a moderate cost. I really, really like it, and am going to keep testing it. Using ring in conjunction with City of Traitors and Cephalid Coliseum is all kinds of fun. I won't complain about drawing 12 cards and finding Time Vault.

Time Vault is...very hit and miss. But not as much as smokestack. Smokestack always either won the game or sat there doing nothing. More often than not it did nothing for me. Time Vault wins when you get it. I'm seriously considering dropping it down to one though. You have the means to recur it until it sticks, and if they're wasting resources to get rid of it, it's easier for you to continue applying pressure.

The most trouble I've had is getting the most effect out of my plays without consuming land drops. More land drops makes it much easier to control and win, and Rings give you (effectively) more.

I'm pretty sure Rings are going to be in my final list for the time being. Not so sure about Time Vault, especially as a 2 of.

I'm currently testing rings as a one of of, like I do with EE. So far, it has interesting results, but it still seems kinda win more.

[94teen]

I've been liking it because it gives me what are essentially additional copies of lands I've been wanting more copies of, but it doesn't take up deck slots or land drops.

I'm actually thinking of going up to three until I decide whether it's good enough or not, so that I can intuition for three copies if I want one.

[Silverdragon]

From http://www.zkforum.de/showpost.php?p...0&postcount=99
8. Platz: Christian Schäfer mit UG Lands.dec

Main:

3 Intuirion
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Tolaria West
1 Capsize
1 Upheaval
1 Deep analysis
3 Life from the Loam
1 Forbid
3 Trinket Mage
3 Eternal Witness
4 Exploration
1 Regrowth
1 Genesis
1 Manabond
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Phyrexian Furnace
2 Crucible of Worlds
1 Senseis Divining Top
4 Mishras Factory
4 Tropical Island
2 Forest
2 Island
3 Wasteland
3 Tranquil Thicket
1 Flooded Strand
1 Polluted Delta
1 Windswept HEath
1 Wooded Footfills
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Riftstone Portal
1 Glacial Chasm
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Academy Ruins

Board:

2 Propaganda
2 Trygon Predator
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Krosan Grip
1 Pithing Needle
1 Tormods Crpyt
1 Zuran Org
1 Root Maze
1 Gaeas Blessing

I think that list was incredibly tuned for the metagame that day. What do you think?

[ClearSkies]

That is certainly an interesting looking list. I suppose you couldn't find any reports that go with it right? It did only get 8th place. So even though it was tuned for the metagame that day,apparently, it wasn't enough.

Some noticable cards missing were:
- Crop Rotation
- Mox Diamond
- Maze of Ith

The list looks like some kind of Eternal Garden and 43 land hybrid...

[94teen]

It's definitely interesting. I've been advocating Gifts Ungiven in this deck for awhile, so it's a little gratifying to see it being sucessful somewhere.

That said, there are a lot of seemingly random singletons that seem...out of place. Genesis? Trinket Mage? Seems like there are better ways to accomplish that if it's really that necessary for the deck.

That said, Vroman had a really cool build here:

http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...ead.php?t=6798

and I think I'm going to try to do something about hybridizing these three decks. There's a lot of cool stuff going on here, all revolving around the Life from the Loam archetype.

There's a pure control deck, lock deck, aggro-control hybrid, and combo control, and there has to be some kind of balance between them that can be struck that accomplishes the most.

[Belgareth]

Has everyone stopped work on this deck ?

This list isn't exactly 5c Garden but it's similar and t8'd in Speyer Germany (42 man tourny)

Christan Schäfer

Main:
4 Engineered Explosives
2 Crucible of Worlds
1 Phyrexian Furnace
3 Eternal Witness
4 Exploration
1 Manabond
1 Genesis
3 Life from the Loam
3 Trinket Mage
2 Intuition
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Capsize
1 Forbid
1 Upheaval
1 Academy Ruins
4 Mishras Factory
4 Wasteland
2 Island
4 Tropical Island
3 Tranquil Thicket
3 Forest
1 Flooded Strand
1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Maze of Ith
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Polluted Delta
1 Glacial Chasm
1 Windswept Heath
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Riftstone Portal

Board:
2 Trygon Predator
2 Krosan Grip
2 Propaganda
1 Zuran Orb
1 Tormods Crpyt
1 Pithing Needle
1 Chaice of the Void
1 Energy Flux
4 Leyline of the Void

Not perfect imo, but certainly shows the archetype can do well.

[blitz]

still kinda tinkering with it, just haven't posted anything.

I've been thinking about forbid a lot, and have a few variations saved away that try to abuse it in the garden shell. The list you posted looks like someone took eternal garden, and gutted all the stax pieces for witness recursion and trinket mage tool box, and changed out the intuition engine for a few gifts ungiven packages.

I haven't been spending too much time on it though... been having too much fun making casual warp world decks =D

[94teen]

I've been having a lot of success lately with Ensnaring Bridge. It stops Tarmogoyfs and whatnot cold. It doesn't do anything against storm combo, but comes down quickly and shuts down threshold completely, as well as a lot of other aggro and controllish decks. It makes winning with Manlands difficult, but I've changed the deck around slightly.

I play Libraries over tops now, because of the synergy with Words of Wilding and War. Right now I only play words of wilding and was hoping to abuse its synergy with smokestack, but I don't have smokestacks at school, so I was playing Bridges instead, and they've worked out beautifully.

[94teen]

Morningtide has brought quite a few cards that push the non-basic land theme that this deck thrives on, so I thought I would try to start some discussion.

In no particular order:

Mutavault, which is clearly ridiculous, especially due to synergy with Mishra's Factory. This is almost definitely going to be finding space in my deck, along with a few extra copies of mishra's factory. This synergy, as well as this decks ability to tutor up whatever lands you need helps to shut down aggro and provide a method of winning. This card is more of a bomb in 43land.dec or Landstill, but I think it's powerful enough to be included here as well.

Recross the Paths

Is an additional tutor and accelerant. Not as good as intuition, but still worth considering, especially since the typical cmc of a nonland card in this deck will be higher than that of, say, threshold, so you have a halfway decent chance of winning the clash, especially with SDT or Sylvan Library. Again, nothing ridiculous, but worth considering.

Scapeshift

This card makes me giddy. With crucible and exploration to replay all your lands and rebuild your board position, this card is begging to be broken in half. I don't know if this is going to be the deck to do it, but there are so many nonbasics in legacy that there has to be a way to abuse this.



Again, there's nothing huge in morningtide, but hopefully this will help jumpstart some discussion for this deck. Some cards I've been testing with pretty good results that also might be good for discussion:

Rings of Brighthearth
Acts as a second copy of everything and enables a Time Vault based win condition. Copying Cephalid Coliseum effects, Maze of Ith Effects, Horizon Canopy Effects, etc is really, really good when you play lands like City of Traitors and Ancient Tomb.

Ensnaring Bridge
Stops Tarmogoyfs and stuff like Mossnought and Cephalid Breakfast dead, with a good chance of killing aggro in the late game.

Words of Wilding
Strong win condition + crazy smokestack enabler with Sylvan Library

Words of Wind
You can replay your hand. Other people can't. Plus it bounces your ensnaring bridges so you can attack.

Mouth of Ronom (one or two snow basics in addition)
More often than not, you can get this out early enough to kill tarmogoyfs so you can save STPs and explosives for the scarier stuff.

EDIT:

Hoofprints of the Stag? It's kinda ridiculous with Coliseum and Horizon Canopy recursion, as well as sylvan library

[Espenhein]

How exactly do you play this list.? Can someone give me a guide through some of the important interactions and a list of the good matchups and such. It looks like a very interesting deck, but I need a deeper understanding of the deck.

Main:

3 Intuirion
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Tolaria West
1 Capsize
1 Upheaval
1 Deep analysis
3 Life from the Loam
1 Forbid
3 Trinket Mage
3 Eternal Witness
4 Exploration
1 Regrowth
1 Genesis
1 Manabond
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Phyrexian Furnace
2 Crucible of Worlds
1 Senseis Divining Top
4 Mishras Factory
4 Tropical Island
2 Forest
2 Island
3 Wasteland
3 Tranquil Thicket
1 Flooded Strand
1 Polluted Delta
1 Windswept HEath
1 Wooded Footfills
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Riftstone Portal
1 Glacial Chasm
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Academy Ruins

Board:

2 Propaganda
2 Trygon Predator
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Krosan Grip
1 Pithing Needle
1 Tormods Crpyt
1 Zuran Org
1 Root Maze
1 Gaeas Blessing


Hope someone will help

[Adan]

Christian Schäfer T8'ed again by the way:

Christian Schäfer: The Perfect Loam

Main:

4 Wasteland
4 Forest
3 Maze of Ith
2 Tropical Island
2 Bayou
3 Tranquil Thicket
2 Windswept Heath
1 Polluted Delta
2 Wooded Foothills
1 Cabal Pit
1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Academy Ruins
1 Riftstone Portal
1 Volraths Stronghold
1 Glacial Chasm
4 Mishras Factory

4 Dark Confidant
2 Eternal Witness

4 Mox Diamond
4 Life from the Loam
4 Exploration
3 Intuition
1 Manabond
2 Crucible of Worlds
1 Engineered Explosives

Board:
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Krosan Grip
2 Trygon Predator
3 Trinket Mage
1 Tormods Crypt
1 Meekstone
1 Pithing Needle
1 Zuran Orb

The coolest thing is that it abused Eternal Witness-Volrath's Stonrghold to utilize Intuition as a triple-tutor. That's why things like Manabond are just there as a 1of.

In some of his lists he also ran Upheaval (gamewinning with Manabond).

But I can't say much about the deck itself, except that I find this Land.dec-archetype extremely gay.

[Windux]

// Lands
1 [LRW] Forest (1)
1 [JU] Riftstone Portal
1 [IA] Glacial Chasm
1 [TE] Wasteland
3 [TE] Ancient Tomb
2 [ON] Wooded Foothills
1 [DK] Maze of Ith
2 [ON] Windswept Heath
1 [JU] Nantuko Monastery
1 [FUT] Horizon Canopy
1 [OD] Cephalid Coliseum
1 [OD] Nomad Stadium
1 [DIS] Ghost Quarter
3 [B] Tropical Island
2 [B] Taiga
3 [B] Savannah
1 [TSP] Academy Ruins
1 [LG] The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale

// Creatures
1 [FD] Eternal Witness

// Spells
2 [FD] Engineered Explosives
1 [US] Smokestack
3 [FD] Crucible of Worlds
4 [SH] Mox Diamond
3 [DS] Trinisphere
4 [US] Exploration
2 [LG] Sylvan Library
2 [TE] Humility
4 [TE] Intuition
3 [UL] Crop Rotation
1 [RAV] Life from the Loam
3 [JU] Burning Wish

// Sideboard
SB: 2 [DK] Tormod's Crypt
SB: 4 [MR] Chalice of the Void
SB: 2 [TSP] Krosan Grip
SB: 1 [TO] Nostalgic Dreams
SB: 1 [TO] Devastating Dreams
SB: 1 [PT] Pyroclasm
SB: 1 [RAV] Life from the Loam
SB: 1 [FD] Rude Awakening
SB: 1 [US] Gamble
SB: 1 [PS] Hull Breach



This is the Build im going to play today.
I edit a report after the tournament.

What would you change?

[Pulp_Fiction]

I have no idea if anyone plays this deck anymore but I have built some kind of 42 Land and Eternal Garden hybrid type deck and it is quite good. I have no idea where to post this list but since it looks nothing like 42 Lands this seems like the thread to post in. I also have been meaning for a while to post this list so without further introduction here is the list:

4x Burning Wish
4x Mox Diamond
3x Life From the Loam
4x Exploration
4x Manabond
3x Crop Rotation
2x Crucible of Worlds
3x Gamble

1x Nomad Stadium
1x Savannah
1x Forest
1x Glacial Chasm
1x Tabernacle
3x Maze of Ith
3x Treetop Village
4x Wasteland
4x Mishra's Factory
1x Ghost Quarter
3x Taiga
2x Windswept heath
2x Wooded Foothills
1x Nantuko Monastery
1x Riftstone Portal
1x Horizon Canopy
3x Tranquil Thicket

Sideboard

1x Worm Harvest
1x Armageddon
1x Shattering Spree
1x Life From the Loam
1x Flame Jab
1x Devastating Dreams
1x Gaea's Blessing
1x Reverent Silence
1x Gamble
3x Krosan Grip
3x Ghostly Prison

This deck is really solid. I have taken it to my local tournament 3 times and made top 8 twice and split top 4 the other. This deck doesn't have to many bad matchups aside from combo. I got to play against 2 Thresh decks the other night and it was great! But in the end I just couldn't dredge into anything. Half the fucking deck is land and three turns in succession here is what I dredged Manabond, Manabond, Crucible; then Exploration, Burning Wish, Heath; then Crucible, Maze of Ith, Loam all while staring at double Negator and double Shade. I almost won against Mono Black Suicide .... something in the top 8 but the deck just wasn't being nice to me that night. Aside from my fairly bad luck this deck was performing at a very sub-par level contrary to its full potential and still made it to the top 8 of a tournamment with a field of 31ish people. Thoughts?

[TheLion]

Eternal Garden is just a blast to play... alway fun...

I'm currently testing a version with 3 Devastating Dreams... They just win the games against aggro. They are just amazing.

I like the list Windux posted more, than yours :-P.

Burning Wish seems to be a solid choice... Never tested it though.

[morgan_coke]

I think Tezzeret is broken beyond belief in half and sideways. He casts weak, repeatable "tinkers" without the spell, mana, or artifact. Plus he wins the game and double voltaic keys.

I think Garden is the existing deck that accommodates tez the best.

Not sure what the list would look like yet, but Tezzeret either solidifies your board/lock position or untaps some random artifacts then overruns the next turn. Provides mana from mox diamonds and can find important stuff like Crucible if you need it.

[Maveric78f]

The way we play the deck in France really differs from the lists I can see here. Our EG archetype is GU based with w/r or both splashes for armageddon, and the threshold lands. We don't like burning wish for instance because the deck needs a real SB and burning wish will not improve his bad MUs (tendrils combos and burn first of all).
We do not play humility neither because maze of ith already deals with big creatures, and because WW is too difficult to guarantee. But I admit that tool box creatures can be sometimes an issue (gaddock teeg, magus of the moon, harmonic sliver, etc...)
Our builds are far more LD oriented with either armageddon or smokestack MD in multiple.

Well actually, at reading this thread, this archetype is not really one. Everybody is playing a different deck. So I'll come up with my EGstax list:

Lands (only 30):
4 maze
1 tabernacle
1 glacial chasm
3 mishra
3 tropical island
1 savannah
1 taiga
1 forest
4 windswept heath
4 wasteland
1 barbarian ring
1 nomad stadium
2 horizon canopy
2 academy ruins
1 city of traitors

Tutors 7:
4*intuition
3*crop rotation

Engine 9:
4*crucible
4*exploration
1*life from the loam

Stax 14:
4*mox diamond
3*trinisphere
3*smokestack
1*EE
3*Rushing river (comboes so well with stax, and the sacrifice of a land is never an issue)

SB:
4*Krosan Grip
4*Chalice
3*meddling mage
1*tormod's crypt
2*EE
1*Zuran Orb

Just play stax as soon as you can. If your opponent tries to race you, then keep raising the counters and eventually, you'll bounce it with rushing river before having to pay yourself for the upkeep. Then on your next turn, you'll play it again and you'll leave it with 1 counter in order to lock your opponent. If your opponent does not try to race you, then leave the srtax with 1 counter and try to find some recursion, or keep playing permanents.

Gaddock teeg and magus of the moon remain the main threats for this deck, but MD rushing river helps a lot against them. Extirpate and tormod's crypt will be dealt with chalice and krosan grip after SB.

The SB is devoted to rape combo and control mainly.

Tezzeret could be good but I think, but UU is always complicated to gather and 5CC is a bit expensive, it would come into play sometimes too late.