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Guys, we are an agressive deck that wins by being ahead on board, while we waste/daze/hymn our opponent into nothingness. If we are not ahead on board, most of that stuff becomes useless.
The fact that delver costs 1 mana is super important.
As a sidenote, in the g3 of the quarterfinals. I played ponder and saw wasteland, deathrite, and clique. The delver did not flip bc. i considered that to be the perfect 3 to keep on the ponder, and i really do not mind that it took some time for it to play
Fantastic job, I was really impressed by your play on camera. Super tight and you clearly know your matchups!
I'm going to give your list a spin at my LGS this week and report back here. There is a lot more combo than Shardless at the moment so I'll play Envelops over Sowers in the SB like you say, though I do love Sower so it could be a 1/1 split :tongue:
I'm looking forward to trying out Stalkers and Cliques, your arguments are sound for each. I've been on a 2/2 split of Bob and TNN for quite a while now and hardly losing at my LGS thanks to these guys adding another angle, but Stalker and Clique may just be better versions of both.
Couldn't agree more on the Shardless matchup too, especially on DRS. It's amazing how many hands rely on this guy, FoWing the DRS is a winning line so often. Never understood why Shardless players board out FoW vs tempo decks as well...FoW is exactly that, tempo! Let's let them keep doing it.
Is there anything you'd change from what you played?
Open concerns with the deck are currently Lands and Eldrazi, which were not majorly on my radar for seattle.
It would be nice to have some relevant sideboard for the lands matchup, but i am not convinced there is a good card we can play. Most of the graveyard hate only comes when the damage is already done (except leyline which is hard to make room for, maybe planar void?) and pithing needle is bordering on irrelevant at times. I guess switching the null rod for a needle is a simple switch that does something. I am very open to suggestions here
As for eldrazi, i expect our matchup is good enough that we dont need anything, if this proves to be wrong we could switch a decay for a dismember in the main, and go to 4 goyf, 2 stalker, likely removing a clique. This would also help against lands. Both moves makes us weaker against miracles
I played against it this weekend and felt the matchup was fine (I won).
I do play the Hymn / Thoughtseize version, which pretty much has all the things in a deck that Stompy decks don't want to see - countermagic (to stop their early explosive plays), hand disruption / Wasteland (which increases their natural inconsistency). TNN / Abrupt Decay were hilarious vs Endless One and as expected, Liliana is great vs their deck.
About the Eldrazi matchup...
I recently played a local tournament where I faced Eldrazi 3 times: 2 in the Swiss (2-1 win) and 1 in semifinal (1-2 lose).
I play 12 creatures + 2 Stalkers, Hymn build with 19 lands, 1 Murderous Cut and 0 Liliana maindeck (1 in sideboard): I'm more on the tempo plan than midrange. 27 "flipping cards" for Delver, so he flips more often than standard Team America builds (but he still sucks compared to other Delver decks).
I would have won all 3 if I didn't miss a double Delver flip in G3 of the semifinal match: I drew Decay and... well, I remembered too late I had 2 unflipped Delvers in play :tongue:
I always lost G1.
Pre-side games are really difficult as any other Delver deck: even if we have Decay which is pretty strong, FoW and Daze are pretty horrible vs Cavern, so I always board them out. A T1 Delver can (rarely) steal some games, Goyf and Hymn are the best cards we have and Stalker does a great job too, but usually they are just stronger/faster than us and we die before stabilizing the board.
Post-board games I feel we are slightly favorite: even if I had no dedicate cards vs them, Thoughtseize and Liliana make a lot of work and Disfigure helps vs Mimic. I had so many cards to board out (4 FoW, 4 Daze, 2 Pierce) that I also boarded in Surgicals and Golgari Charms, even if they didn't do too much.
Without that brain fart about flipping Delvers I would have won 6 post-board games on 6, so I guess we are not that bad positioned against Eldrazi.
I'd say it's a 50-50 matchup: we lose the majority of pre-board games but we win the majority post-board.
I will add a second Liliana in the sideboard, and maybe (just maybe) an Ensnaring Bridge.
Another consideration: IMHO Stifle builds are way weaker in this Eldrazi meta. Stifle itself does nothing, Pierce does very little and Confidant accelerates our end. I like very much this version of Team America but I think it's pretty dead right now.
Fun fact: an Eldrazi deck (the one I lost in semi) won the tournament, losing only a swiss game vs my deck; I was a bit worried about Eldrazi dominance but the other guys' reaction was: "Don't worry, all luck. Eldrazi won't became a thing in Legacy".
Well, I guess they changed their mind now...
hey congrats, I went also to BOM but playing shardless. This time I tried to leave fow post board and I remebered why I didnt do it before, daze, if I want to force a deathrite or a delver and the bug delver plays daze I am done, the same goes for spell pierce. What do you think about the state of shardless and team america in the current metagame? also, do you guys think is better to play 4 hymn rather than 2 hymn 2 thoughtseize?Quote:
Originally Posted by Goddik
1) They should not have spell pierce after board in the matchup ( or indeed before board...)Quote:
Originally Posted by surface33
2) you can chose to fow the deathrite, or the followup play, or the daze on your disfigure depending on boardstate and to play around their stuff. The play that you want to avoid at all cost is deathrite into wasteland + creature. If he is otp and does that on t2, the game is practically over. If he dazes, then at least he cant tarmogoyf waste you, and you get to have one more land drop. With that draw he was going to daze you sooner or later anyways. There are other plays you may want to fow through, like deluge or liliana, not to mention fighting over jace tms. I likely would not fow a t1 delver barring a really weird hand.
Obviously if your shardless board has 10x disfigure effects, then you can feel free to board out the forces. But the discard does nothing when you are behind in the matchup, and i am super happy when my shardless opponent wastes his time with thoughtseizing and hymning me while i beat him down with the great goyf.
3) I think team america is much better, otherwise i would be playing shardless. Team America, if built well, has matchups against lands, shardless, and fringe creature decks (elves & D&T) which are loosable, but not horrific with the right sideboard. Shardless has problems with both decks that go under it (combo), and over the top (4c loam, lands, the same fringe creature decks etc). I simply feel like i have alot more positive matchups with team america then with shardless
4) TS is a non-card in alot of matchups. Hymn is very good against miracles and eldrazi, can win games by itself in alot of weird matchups, and is at least passable against shardless. It is the card i board out most often. If stoneforge mystic decks come back, i might reconsider thoughtseize, but for now i am very happy with hymn. It is good anti-bullshit protection
5) I am not convinced it is right to board out daze and fow against eldrazi. Firstly because there are other things you may want to fow/daze (dismember on goyf, chalice in some spots, trinisphere), secondly because you have wastelands for their caverns. I would generally prioritize wasting these over their stompy lands. I sideboarded very little in the matchup
mm interesting point, thanks. Also what do you think of the stifle version? I used to play that because stifle is good against lands and miracles, well against a lot of decks. It is true is bad against eldrazi, but is that enough to not play it? I used to play a similar list like the one that won the madrid mkm with 4 stifle 2 hymn and 2 thouhtsize, I think that going to 3 stifle 19 land and 4 hyms could be an option with your arguments.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goddik
On Stifle:
I have tried hard to make stifle happen, but usually end up regretting it. Stifle generally conflicts with our mostly 2-drop deck, as we want to tap out every turn. If you think stifle is good, you would be better served playing grixis delver, which can much easier afford to hold mana open.
With regards to matchups:
Midrange
Stifle used to be good in midrange blue mirrors, because they went long, and so a stifle on a fetchland would, if nothing else generally result in them having to keep lands on their brainstorms. It is indeed still very good against miracles, where a stifle hymn version is definately a good place to be
The problem is that most midrange blue mirrors now play deathrite shaman, and stifle is the worst card in the universe when they have deathrite shaman, and doesnt help you ride the nutdraws of your own deahtrite shaman.
Combo
With regards to combo, i am not too convinced it is actually that good. You can sometimes get storm and show&Tell on their manabase, but they can easily play around it when going off.
The end result is that stifle is a quite narrow card that is only really awesome against miracles. At that stage i would rather prioritize sylvan libraries, lilianas, cliques etc that do something against a wider spread of decks
Lands is an interesting comment, but i am not super convinced it would swing that matchup
yeah the drs point is good but for lands it might give you enough time to win.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goddik
Iam planning on running this list:
4 x deathrite shaman
4 delver of secrets
4 tarmogoyf
2 dark confidant
1 true name nemesis
4 FOW
4 abrupt decay
4 brainstorm
4 ponder
4 daze
1 spell pierce
4 hymn to tourach
1 liliana of the veil
19 ands
The reason for this is that I dont like playing 20 lands with delver(I like the greedy part of the deck) and wanted to keep the mana curve a bit bellow yours to avoid mana problems. I will also consider: -1 TNN -2 confidant + 2 tomb stalker, +1 vendilion but my meta is full of D&t and miracles so against swords and karakas TNN seems better. Against d&t do you abrupt the vial to find use for your counters or do you save the abrupt for equipments? I have a lot of experience in this MU and if they get a vial to 3 is almost game over. I would rather destroy the vial and force the mirran. Also use a fow in the mother of runs turn 1? just want to hear other points of view
The thing about Stifle vs. combo is... wouldn't you rather be wrecking them with gravehate+Hymn? I tried playing the Stifle version and it just didn't feel good. Hymn+Lili version fits my mindset better at least, as a general shell. The miser's Stifle is something I can stand behind, though. A single Stifle can be brutal. A Stifle-based gameplan, nah.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goddik
I find Tombstalker to be really underrated.
Most people say it's bad against white because of StP and RIP, but I never side it out vs D&T (which plays both) and, even if sometimes they land turn-2 RIP and make Stalker weird, most of the times you can land it before that happens, in which case he can win alone if they already spent an StP on some other creature. And anyways we have Decay for RIP, so Stalker is live in lategame too.
Against DnT I feel Stalker is nearly as strong as Goyf, since they have to play RIP before we land it.
Against Miracles (which also plays both StP and RIP) is another large threat they have to care about, or die.
Here Goyf is much better because it lands much faster, and because Stalker sucks against Jace's -1; yet I think it's decent against Miracles too.
Most people also say it's weaker than Nemesis, but:
- we can play Stalker with only 19 lands, while Nemesis should require us to go to 20
- Stalker ends games faster
- in my opinion, Stalker is stronger than Nemesis vs Eldrazi, because he blocks as well as Nemesis when we have to stay on defense, but he can end the game faster when we counter-attack
...so I guess Stalker is better than Nemesis if we wanna head towards the tempo strategy.
The only matchups where Stalker sucks is combo, which is a great matchup for us anyways: it's too slow (like Nemesis), and it doesn't pitch to FoW (unlike Nemesis).
In any other matchups, I feel it's strong.
I think Goddik aggrees with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombie
how do you feel about stifle in the SB against other Tempo decks, since often it comes down to mana denial?
PS: Shardless Player here, who wants to try Team America
PPS: Goddik, we were talking in front of the Marriot right after Top 8, u told me not to play Dark Confidant if you remember :D
@anakyn, well Nemesis is also great against Miracles, as they really need to find terminus for it as they have no other outs. Also Lands matchup is way better with Nemesis as it is the only thing that get through their Mazes, it stops and can kill Mirran Crusader like a champ ... and not to mention, against many decks it just show inevitable end. I am not saying, that it is better then stalker, he is amazing, played him for a long time (even before Delver was born with Innistrad), he can close games quickly and I always want to fit him in, the thing is, I can, but then the Delver flipping too late will cost me games, for the same reason i do not MD Liliana.
In my meta with D&T, Jund, Lands, Miracles, Storm, Grixis Delver, 4c Delver, Shardless Bug, NicFit, UG Cloudpost, 4cLoam ... I rather stick with Nemesis as it suits me better. Stalker is just another option, not being worse or better, both solutions have their merits. In the vacuum, imo it is more important to learn/drill upside down the version which you like/prefer.
This might of course change, when meta shifts towards -x/-x spells, like Toxic Deluge, Golgary Charms and such, then Stalker version becomes much better.
As for Lands matchup, Winter Orb is life saver, it buys the time which TA needs, and also has its uses against Miracles. Both matchups are not that great. Orb basicaly exploits Shamans even more, turn Dazes back on, as TA can easily play with just one land and Shaman in play and do very well.
Yeah I didn't mean to disagree, just add my own experience and say that I agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by btm10
@ mosaic
Yes, I agree: Nemesis is better in certain metas, but it also fits better certain TA builds.
When I was playing Stifle/Bob version, my creature of choice was Nemesis and not Stalker. Now that I play Hymn "tapout" version, I lean toward a tempo-aggro strategy, so I prefer 19 lands, no Liliana (higher probability of flipping Delver) and Stalker because it's faster in closing games.
One other thing to note about TNN is that it is not graveyard reliant at all, so, in the face of RiP it certainly has merit just based off that.
Not that I am disagreeing with anyone, TNN still doesn't go into all the builds (I think it's much better in the Stifle build).
I took Goddiks list (with a few SB changes due to card availability) to my LGS last night and went 4-0 beating Enchantress, Esper Mentor, UW Landstill and MUD (so take the results with a touch of salt :tongue:)
The power level of the deck is absurd, Enchantress actually felt like the hardest matchup due to MD RiP etc. One of the key strengths of the creature base seems to be the evasion. Eight flyers and DRS activations end games very fast while Tarmogoyf holds the ground, love it.
The manabase felt a little wonky at times (not the fault of the build, just the prohibitive BB costs) but the power level of individual cards leverages stumbles. I've been on the Stifle build for such a long time I'm used to fetching a Sea into Trop, but it seems like a lot of hands want a Sea turn one and turn two?
On the SB, would the Pierces be better as Flusterstorms? We have Decays to answer things like Chalices, Spheres, Counterbalance etc. Is the edge Fluster has over pierce in Delver mirrors worth the swap? Jace is the only thing I can think of that Fluster misses and can't be decayed.
Here it is again for reference.
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Tarmogoyf
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Tombstalker
4 Brainstorm
3 Ponder
4 Daze
4 Force of Will
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Abrupt Decay
2 Liliana of the Veil
4 Underground Sea
2 Bayou
1 Tropical Island
1 Polluted Delta
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
Sideboard:
3 Submerge (changed third to a Disfigure)
2 Golgari Charm
2 Spell Pierce
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Sower of Temptation (changed to Envelops)
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Null Rod
1 Sylvan Library (changed to Life from the Loam)
While I like that list in theory, in actual practice, once you have that many creatures, wouldn't it be better to drop Delver and run a more midrange deck? There are only 23 Instants and Sorceries, which means flipping Delver seems dicey, at best.
You & Goddick missing 4 Wasteland, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dissection
I don't think so, this is still a tempo deck utilizing Daze and Wasteland and as such is more often the beatdown deck than not, you need to be applying pressure early. You still have Ponders and Brainstorms to help flip it too. 23 is a reasonable, albeit greedy, number of spells while 15 is hardly an unusually high number of creatures for TA. As mentioned a few pages back, if we could run Shamans 5-8 it'd be a no-brainer, but for curve considerations Delver is the best option.Quote:
Originally Posted by H
Good catch, I just copy and pasted the list from a few pages back. Definitely four Wasteland!Quote:
Originally Posted by Manipulato
I am feeling like an idiot right now but is there not a primer for 4c delver? I see it talked about a lot but I can't seem to find it in any of the legacy development boards.
Depends on what you mean by 4c delver. If you want the thread with maindeck green spells and tarmogoyf: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...eck-bUrg-TempoQuote:
Originally Posted by Ryu
If you want the grixis deck that plays young pyromancer:http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...B-Grixis-Tempo
I'm sure whether or not I run Hymn vs Thoughtseize and how many Liliana's will affect the answer, but I was wondering if I could play Bug Delver if I have the following duals: 4 Tropicals, 2 Bayou, 2 Underground Sea. I've been working towards getting the playset of Goyfs and am holding off until later to get the last few Underground Seas, so that in the meantime I can play a deck first. Is this possible/advisable?
Yeah, you usually want to fetch Usea Usea, or Usea Bayou.
Spell pierce is exactly to be able to counter jace. I am not to bothered about other applications as we win combo anyways. I never board them in for delver mirrors where daze and fow do the work much better
You can certainly play the deck at a local tournament with only 2 seas. Just replace the last with darkslick shores, more fetches or watery graves (or something more creative).
One idea i would be interested in trying out would be winter orbs for the sideboard. With overlap between miracles and lands, it would allow space for some lands slots
i´ve been testing around the last few days with different approaches and finally tested goddiks list which felt great. How do guys think about the grixis delver matchup? Tested against several decks and had the impression that grixis was a tough one, even if you win the DRS/Ressource battle, basically their burnspells favor them at racing, while your hymns become dead pretty soon. At least Preboard i usually felt clunkier and couldnt fit a real control role either, cause its hard to control Young Pyromancer preboard or the Gurmag Angler
The matchup is fine
Level 1: Deathrite advantage - FOW/Daze deathrite agressively
Level 2: Bomb advantage - They have gurmag angler, you have goyf/stalker/liliana
Their bolts give them some advantage in level 1, your creatures give you advantage in level 2.
They delvers and Young peezis are super easy to kill, and usually only really get you if they get too far ahead in level 1. I have a strong dislike for peezy.
Tips and tricks to win the bomb war
1) Use your wastelands as mana + to "tap your oponent out" by wasting untapped sources before you need to daze through key plays
2) Board out hymns, keep all dazes and fows (otp and otd)
3) play your bombs when you can protect them with countermagic
Think of yourself as something akin to a 1-card combo deck with tarmogoyf/stalker/liliana as your combo
thanks for the great explanation :)
will give it a shot asap, this Weekend ive got a local tournament where i will give it a try. If i dont fail miserably on the supertest this weekend, i think im going to play it at Prague eternal as well
You could always include darkblast in your sideboard mix if you're having issues with delvers and young pyromancer. Or even maelstrom pulse if you wanted a less narrow but more expensive option.
@Goddick: Could you give us a short sideboarding plan gainst the most common decks with your list? Really looking Forward playing your list at my next locals, would be great! Thx.
I, too, would like to see a sideboard guide. A lot of it is obvious, but stuff like Jace the Mindsculptor seems so foreign to me in a Delver list.
I'm also sleeving up Goddik's list for my next Legacy local. Ironically, I was able to find a second Vendilion Clique really easily, but still haven't found anyone with 2 Tombstalkers for trade. :laugh:
Hi guys
Here are my sideboarding notes for the build against a couple of usual archetypes.
Shardless
-4 Hymn
- 3 Fow/Daze (Play/Draw)
+3 submerge
+2 Jace
+2 Sower
Lands
-4 Decay
+3 Suberge
+1 Spell pierce (not very good, but it is whats in the sideboard)
4c Loam
+3 submerge
-3 Hymn
Maybe cut the last hymn for sylvan
Miracles
-4 Daze
-2 Waste
+2 Pierce
+1 Null Rod
+1 Sylvan
+2 Jace
You can cut more wastes for envelop if you have them
Elves
+3 Submerge
+2 Toxic
+2 GG Charm
-2 Tombstalker
-1 V. Clique/Delver
-4 Daze
Cut more creatures for envelop if you have them
Dnt
-4 Fow
-4 Daze
-2 Delver
+2 GG Charm
+2 Toxic
+1 Sylvan
+2 Jace
+2 Sower
+1 Nullrod
You are control in the matchup. Otp it could be correct to shave more creatures to keep some dazes. Creatures often get plowed/brickwalled, so the usual gameplan is to kill everything that moves and eventually find a jace that brainstorms until they are dead. Prioritize lands and sweepers on the ponders
Storm
-4 Decay
-2 Stalker
+1 Null Rod
+2 Pierce
+1 Sylvan
+2 GG Charm
Cut more creatures for envelop if you have them/ toxic deluge if you know they are heavily on the gobbo plan
Grixis delver
-4 Hymn
+2 GG Charm
+2 Toxic
Mirror
+3 Submerge
-3 Hymn
(You can board jaces or sowers, i usually dont, but i know people i respect that do. In that case i would shave the last hymn and a fow/daze depending on play/draw. Bringing 4 4 drops in seems ambitious).
It may be right to shave the last hymn for the sylvan library
Eldrazi
+2 Sower
-2 Clique
Alternatively, an option is to cut a further 2 delvers otd to make room for Jace TMS and play around chalice. I doubt they can beat Jace
Goddik, congrats on the results, they speak for themselves.
Before seeing your success I was running this list and was pretty happy with it:
Lands - 19:
4 x Polluted Delta
4 x Misty Rainforest
4 x Underground Sea
2 x Bayou
1 x Tropical Island
4 x Wasteland
Creatures - 14:
4 x Deathrite Shaman
4 x Delver of Secrets
4 x Tarmogoyf
1 x True-Name Nemesis
1 x Vendilion Clique
Spells - 27:
4 x Brainstorm
4 x Ponder
2 x Thoughtseize
4 x Daze
4 x Hymn to Tourach
4 x Abrupt Decay
1 x Liliana of the Veil
4 x Force of Will
Sideboard - 15:
2 x Surgical Extraction
2 x Spell Pierce (or Envelope, or 1 x SP and 1 x Flusterstorm, this will probably become Invasive Surgery)
1 x Disfigure (or 1 x Dark Blast)
2 x Golgari Charm
1 x Null Rod
1 x Pithing Needle
2 x Dark Confidant
1 x Sylvan Library
2 x Submerge
1 x Liliana of the Veil
At our Legacy weekly last night I tried out a list much closer to yours. The only main deck differences were +1 Goyf, -1 V. Clique, and +1 Ponder, -1 land.
I didn't run the second T. Deluge or any Jaces in the SB.
I really like the idea of just going bigger, but in practice most of my draws felt somewhat clunky. I played against Lands, Elves, Stompy, and Miracles.
Tombstalker always felt hard to land. He would sit in my hand staring at me early when I wanted to play a threat and then later I would often not feel like I had the time to deploy a tomb stalker that could easily be answered or attacked around to close out a game. The four hymn were sweet though (double hymning someone is awesome). Maybe I should be running 4 hymn whether or not I play stalker.
Also, the delvers felt way worse than usual. One game I played double delver on turn 2 and they didn't flip for 6 turns (then again, this can happen with any configuration of lists).
Any thoughts on why this version didn't feel as smooth to me? It is possible the slight card changes make the deck play out differently and so I was prioritizing the wrong things.
Hard to say
The deck is very much a 75 card deck though. Some matchups will play out very differently without the toxic and jace, as that means you cannot take on the control role. One of the main strengths of the deck is the ability to switch roles after board.
you btw hit all the matchups where i would consider boarding tombstalker out. He is pretty bad against miracles, we just have worse cards to throw out. Same counts for lands, although a bad tarmogoyf there, is still a way to kill them through punishing fires.
@Goddik, How do you feel about your list and going to 19 lands and add the 4th Ponder?
Currently i am looking towards thay option, along with going to 4 Goyf and 1 Stalker.
You don't like Null Rod in these matchups for Mox Diamond?Quote:
Originally Posted by Goddik
I can't help it, what about to go with Goddik's list, get to know it from all perspectives first, instead of trying to modify to your liking? (almost every one tend to does that, myself included)
IMO each version of this deck require its own playstyle, even few changes will have huge impact on how to play the deck. Let me quote part of Goddik's response "The deck is very much a 75 card deck though"
TA is a deck with lot of options (hymn, stalker heavy, stifle, confidant etc), it is also deck, that has game almost against every possible deck one can imagine, it is also deck, that has no match-up considered "autowin/autolose", one hase to fight hard every game, which is exhausting in a long tournament. On the other hand, that is what makes this deck good in right hands.
I know, that I will do better with version I have experience with, meanwhile, why not try out other options. But do not get disappointed when score is not exactly x:0 every time.
btw: thanks Goddik for sideboard how-to with your list!
P.S. I do not play his version, my plan is still TNN, posted few pages back, but I am going to try Goddik's "retro" version for sure.
well, just came back from the local event i mentioned earlier and after i had a short break for some awesome sandwhiches here is my report :)
This was the 75 i played, i am still missing some cards so i had to make a few changes. Mostly i am missing the 2 Sower of Temptation, cause i imagine them really good in the Matchups, where you want to bring them in
http://deckstats.net/deck-9357437-fc...b9298f229.html
Maindeck i was missing the 7th Fetch target and one Tomb Stalker, i replaced those by a swamp and TNN. The Swamp is just a temporary Solution, cause i simply do not have another U-Sea nor the Trop, but i will get something soon. Along with the Dual i was missing the 2nd Tombstalker, but added a TNN instead, which i think isnt the worst replacement afterall. My Sideboard looked slightly different, but i will include Sower of Temptation and the 3rd Submerge asap. Anyway, lets get to the games i played.
Round 1 - UB Reanimator: I win the die roll and keep an opener containing Delver, Force, Daze, BS, Ponder and 2 Fetchlands. Against unknown i felt pretty comfortable with it, fetch for Underground Sea play Delver and say go. My Opponent opens up with Careful Study, discarding Iona and Grizzlebrand. I consider dazing it, but dont because i like to rather go for his reanimation spells with Daze + Force Backup. Anyway, on Turn 2 i take care of the delver flipping with BS, and look for some additional disruption, but cant find anything relevant. Relying on my Delver as clock and Daze + Force Backup i pass the turn and lose to his reanimate on grizzlebrand, sadly with Daze + Force backup as well.
-4 Hymn
+ Flusterstorm
+ Spell Pierce
+ 2 Submerge, expecting the green Splash for decay
Game 2 was rather quick. I draw DRS, Daze, Submerge, Wasteland, Fetchie + X. I open up with Fetch, Tropical, DRS and pass the turn. His turn 1 is Underground Sea, Petal, Petal, Entomb, Reanimate => GG, played it to the end, but he never fetched for a green Source and he counters my hardcast sumberge.
yeah, great Start at with 0:2. But to be honest, i havent been that sad afterall. Having playtested Reanimator for some time, i know how rare this draws with Combo + multiple protection are and im perfectly fine with having lost to those draws, because pretty much 95% of the field would lose to them. I think i might have been wrong not dazing the careful study, but in this case there wouldnt have been any difference, cause he had the counters anyway.
0-1 Overall
Round 2 - 4 Color Loam: Game 1 was close. First Delver gets hit by P Fire, Hymn takes down Dark Confidant and Abrupt Decay. The board is Tarmogoyf + TNN on my side, he has just Lands and a Chalice @ 1. We are both empty handed and his Lifecount drops quickly. My next few Topdecks are Bricks (Lands + Delvers) and he manages to find a decay, KoTR and last but not least a Zenith that goes and gets Scavenging Ooze which wins him the game, since he was at 1 life and is able to gain life and Race my TNN. Well, not sure i did any major misplays, but i think the Boardstate i accomplished should generally favor me?
- 3 Delver
- 1 Clique
+ 2 Submerge
+ Spell Pierce
+ Fluster Storm
I wanted to get rid of some Creatures that die to PFire and Chalice on 1, so i went this route regarding the SB. Have to mulligan to 5, cause my first to hands, where usea + 6 spells without can trip and wasteland only at 6. I didnt want to lose to a single wasteland with my initial seven, it felt like too much of a Gamble. At 5 Cards i find 2 Lands, Ponder, Goyf, Hymn and we got some game going. As expected he anwsers my Turn 1 Ponder with a wasteland on his side, so i think i was correct to not take the gamble. A few turns later i have Tarmogoyf + TNN on the board again and hymn him but it hits nothing relevant. Short after he plays Toxic Deluge, followed up by liliana the next turn and i never find a way back. Well 0-2 again sadly, but regarding the fact that i went down to 5 cards, i still had some pretty game. If i imagine having had those 2 extra hand cards, for example to have a counter up for deluge, it wouldve been a win for sure. So mixed feelings on my side, but im ok with it and it didnt feel miserable afterall. Honestly i think the matchup should pretty solid in general and absolutely winnable.
0-2 Overall, welcome to the losers bracket. Anyway i wanted to get some games going to gain some confidence in piloting it.
Round 3 - The Rack Artifact Burn Control(?!): Some interesting homebrew but nothing too relevant going on. Longstory short: I win 2-1
1-2 Overall
Round 4 - Goblins: He told me afterwards he tested it against Eldrazi, had a positive Matchup and wanted to rogue the meta (There were several Eldrazi decks around). I win the die roll, Turn 1 Delver, Daze his Vial, Delver Flips, Decay his followups, Hymn away his last handcards and win soon.
- 4 FoW
- 4 Daze
+ 2 Deluge
+ 2 Charm
+ 1 Jace
+ 1 Library
+ 1 Null Rod
+ 1 Jitte
Game 2 can be described as : Double Goyf, Deluge, Win. Add some random cantrips/fetches and there we go :D
2-2 overall
Round 5 (Last Round) - Burn: Mehhhh, burn. Lost the die roll and get burned into oblivion pretty quick game 1, nothing special to report here.
- 2 Wasteland
- 1 Clique
+ Jitte
+ Spell Pierce
+ Flusterstorm
Game 2 was the "easy" part since i am on the play. I have Delver + DRS in my opener and decide to open up on delver so i can race and im ok with him burning it away, rather than my DRS. My Followup DRS sadly gets searing blazed. My Lifecount is still pretty high anway and through fetching and cantripping im able to land T3 Tombstalker, which is followed up by Jitte and i win the Race. While Racing the only thing i did was deploying a wasteland to possibly target my own lands, which proved a great idea, because he told me afterwards that he had double Price of Progress :laugh:
Game 3 was the real struggle. He starts with burning me to the face and follows up with an eidolon. I decay his eidolon, take some more burn to the face, I hymn him down to 1 handcard and from there on can force him into topdeck mode with liliana. My Lifecount suffered a lot and im down to 2 Life in between, but with some cantripping i manage to get 2 DRS online and recover myself to 8 Life. At some Point i find a Goyf, which starts to go beatdwon mode and somehow manage to stay alive, through discarding Creatures, Spell Piercing his Burn Spells, etc. Not the nicest game, but somehow i got there :D
3-2 Overall. Anything but an overwhelming result, especially after the 0-2 start. But still im fine with those losses and the way i lost those games, especially regarding Round 1 against reanimator. After the Tournament ended, i get a "competetive" game going against a Death and Taxes Player which i didnt get paired against during the Tournament. Long Story Short i end up winning 2-1 against Death and Taxes and i am happy to have played that other matchup as well, just to get some practice. Just as goddik said, it comes down to being the control player and the Sideboard is great for that purpose. Btw something i didnt think of before, Clique is awesome against Stoneforge + Spirit of the Labyrinth - take your Equipment and you dont draw anything :cool::laugh:
yeah, so here we go with my 2 cents. Final Thoughts - Need some more practice but its fun and its capable of anything