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Thread: [Deck] TarmoTog!

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  1. #11
    Etherium is limited. Innovation is not.
    Hanni's Avatar
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    Re: [Deck] TarmoTog!

    One of the dilemmas of the deck is that it is fairly mana hungry and it wants to play free counters because it plays so many sorcery speed spells. Daze sets us back but it may be worth it. The only other option really is disrupting shoal and there isnt enough different cc blue cards in the deck to warrant that.

    You have to think what happens after my opponent blows up my grave because there is so much grave hate in sideboards now days.
    This deck isn't mana hungry when it is in Threshold mode. Brainstorm, Ponder, Nimble Mongoose, Tarmogoyf, Shriekmaw cast via Evoke, and Cabal Therapy are all low cc. Daze is an additional tempo-oriented disruption tool that compliments that aspect of the deck very well. Once the deck draws Intuition, it then shifts into control mode. However, the deck still isn't very mana hungry at this point. The deck becomes mana hungry once it establishes the Loam + Coliseum and Genesis engines. The fact that Daze answers an early problem typically negates the land drop setback. Obviously, if it is important to hit land drop #3 on turn 3, then you won't use Daze... instead you can discard it later to Cephalid Coliseum or pitch it to Force of Will. More often than not, it's not going to be a big deal. Loam ensures the deck makes a land drop every turn... and this deck doesn't need a billion mana sources to actually win a game anyway.

    You are right. Graveyard hate is something that this deck has to deal with. That's one of the reasons I like to run Daze.

    As for other options... I think that, rather than trying to add non graveyard dependant alternatives, simply bording into additional disruption would be better overall. This deck is obviously dependant on its graveyard and should remain that way because thats what makes the deck work so well. We have maindeck answers to graveyard hate in Force, Daze, Cabal Therapy, and Pernicious Deed. SB, we get access to cards like Stifle, Krosan Grip, and Pithing Needle. The only graveyard hate that honestly scares me is Extirpate, since its impossible to answer after it goes on the stack. Discard would be the only means of answering it... and even then it won't always work since they can cast it in response.

    The thing I like is that this deck doesn't roll over and die to graveyard hate like a deck like Ichorid does. Even once our graveyard gets nuked, we still have Goyf and Shriekmaw as beaters. Leyline just slows us down since we do have Deed as an answer and Planar Void can also be answered via Force, Daze, and Therapy. Even through Exitirpate or Crypt on our engine cards, we can still play out like Threshold.

    We can even board an extra Genesis, Loam, Gigapede, etc to bring in as additional engines incase our engine gets hit and we need the engine to win (typically vs a board control deck like Landstill).

    To be honest... half the time I don't even use the engine because simply playing the Threshold gameplan works against many matchups (...plus sometimes I don't get to see the engine).

    EDIT: **********************************************************

    Even though no one seems to be interested in this deck... I've been thinking lately about what the sideboard should look like. Now I know that if I had an actual metagame that my sideboard would probably be dependant on that... but given that I don't play IRL whatsoever and that I'm simply trying to build the deck so that it can handle everything and more specifically the DTB's, what should the sideboard look like?

    This is what I've got right now:

    Sideboard (15)
    3 Stifle
    3 Extirpate
    2 Krosan Grip
    2 Pithing Needle
    2 Engineered Explosives
    1 Pernicious Deed
    1 Stinkweed Imp
    1 Gigapede

    I'll explain this a little.

    I think Extirpate is an amazing card. It answers specific problems against certain decks... specifically other control matchups like Landstill. I can go into detail about this card but I definitely think its spot is well deserved in the sideboard.

    I was a little unsure if I really wanted to have Engineered Explosives in the sideboard since I already run Deed but then I decided that additional removal wasn't a bad idea. It's more effecient than Deed against tokens, whether they are EtW or Bridge from Below tokens. It also dodges Needle set to Deed... and diversifying the removal options in that regard seemed fine. My question about these still, though, is whether or not they are needed and whether or not a better card choice would fit here.

    I really think it's wrong to not run the 4th Deed in the sideboard though... this card just completely wrecks decks like Affinity, Stax, and Enchantress while still being an extremely strong card against decks like Goblins and Counterbalance Thresh.

    I feel that the lone Stinkweed Imp is entirely needed, at least for my build of the deck. The maindeck has absolutely no way to deal with an early Tombstalker. The only outs I have take a long time to get going... either popping Deed for 8 or getting a Wonder in the yard and blocking with enough meat. Tombstalker isn't a huge meta issue, which is why I wouldn't maindeck the Imp... but I feel that it is enough of an issue to at least have an out for it. I prefer Stinkweed Imp over other options for handling Tombstalker since it can be grabbed with Intuition and doesn't need anything for me to return it to hand. It's also reusable and can handle other random stuff. I was considering Maze of Ith but ultimately decided that Stinkweed Imp was the better option.

    The lone Gigapede can come in if you fear/know that the opponent will be bringing in alot of graveyard hate and if you need the lategame reach if the Loam+Coliseum and Genesis engines get RFG'd. It's untargetability makes it pretty solid against control decks too... which is the type of matchup where I'd want him most. I was considering Volrath's Stronghold here instead but utimately decided on Gigapede for a number of reasons.

    Now...

    I'm wondering how big of an issue combo is and whether or not more combo hate would be appropriate in the board. I feel like I have sufficient hate right now, especially since all of it is useful against other matchups as well, but... how much better would Duress/Thoughtseize be in the board? Or what about Counterbalances? These are some of the things that I think would be beneficial for discussion.

    So... what could get cut, what should get cut, and what am I not running that I should be running? Assume that the metagame is random and full of DTB's as well as full of other Established randomness (and when I say randomness, I don't mean bad decks). Basically, if there was a huge Legacy GP tomorrow, what would [you] put in the sideboard?
    Last edited by Hanni; 03-24-2008 at 12:56 AM.
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