[Primer] R/G Lands

[GoblinZ]

Do not side out maze against delver decks.

I don't like thorn or tireless tracker in this match up.

[TLK]

Do not side out maze against delver decks.

I don't like thorn or tireless tracker in this match up.

Yeah, I instantly figured that out afterwards regarding Maze. Tracker was what won me game 3, but I can see it being the wrong choice. What DO you side in/out vs Delver?

[kravkenov]

Yeah, I instantly figured that out afterwards regarding Maze. Tracker was what won me game 3, but I can see it being the wrong choice. What DO you side in/out vs Delver?

+4 Tracker
-2 Crop -1 Bojuka -1 Karakas

So this is my sideboarding plan against Delver deck. Drop of Honey dosent really help here since Delver deck usually play with tempo. They main goal is to disrupt our spell with counter, our manabase with stifle/wasteland while throwing a single creature to victory. They usually dosent play much creature so Drop dosent really help in this MU.

Tracker on the other hand really shine. It keep the "who draw often/better" war at a fair level while providing a huge creature to deal with. Crop is a terrible card to get counter, Karakas and Bojuka dosent help much too.

[Lormador]

My sideboard against Delver:

-1 Manabond
-3 Gamble

+2 Tireless Tracker
+1 Chalice of the Void
+1 Seismic Assault

I simply try to avoid any graveyard hate they've brought in (mostly Surgical Extraction), and appreciate Tracker as a thing that can get in the way of a Gurmag Angler that my list otherwise has a hard time beating (only Maze of Ith stops it). Chalice randomly generates free wins. Seismic Assault could be anything, really, I've brought in Ancient Tomb in that spot before to power out the other sideboard cards, combo more quickly, and mess up Pierce/Daze plans.

I personally don't like siding out any lands against Delver or most decks in general unless they really, really do nothing. They help to play around soft counters, fuel Mox Diamond, get value from Loam's random flips to the graveyard, etc. Crop Rotation I'm firing either in response to a Wasteland or when I have no other choice but a desperation Rotation.

[djxstream]

+4 Tracker
-2 Crop -1 Bojuka -1 Karakas

So this is my sideboarding plan against Delver deck.

I wouldn't take out crop rotation vs a wasteland deck. 2 cents.

[GoblinZ]

delver decks usually only play one spell pierce, I would not side out crop rotation for that, and I want to win with it as quickly as possible, especially against ur delver.

I would bring tracker in against midrange aggro-control, control and combo but would not play it against delver decks.

personally, vs grixis

-1 rishadan port
-1 gamble
-1 karakas

+1 chalice
+2 sweepers

vs ur delver
-1 karakas
-1 ghost quarter
-1 gamble
+1 chalice
+2 sweeper

[kravkenov]

I wouldn't take out crop rotation vs a wasteland deck. 2 cents.

I side-out Crop because if it get countered, you just Wasteland yourself. But yes, Cropping in response to an opponent Wasteland activation feels great too.

[manadrain]

Just so I'm clear with the chasm lock once you have two stages going you still have to sacrifice a land correct?

[Chatto]

Just so I'm clear with the chasm lock once you have two stages going you still have to sacrifice a land correct?

No, because saccing is only required when you put Chasm into play. Your lands are already in play. You do sac one, because you don't pay the upkeep.

[Claymore]

Think what they're saying is:

Play Chasm
Upkeep, copy it with Stage 1. Sac Chasm.
Play Stage 2
Upkeep, copy Stage 1 with 2 (it becomes a chasm). Sac Stage 1.
Play Stage 1.
Repeat.

[Dice_Box]

Yes, and keeping that lock in place, if you get three Stage you can Loam less often, drawing cards in hope of finding Gamble or Exploration.

[Lormador]

Do not side out maze against delver decks.

I don't like thorn or tireless tracker in this match up.

But.... but... Tracker makes the pretty little light in their eyes go out, that light that began sparkling when they resolved Surgical Extraction and Pithing Needle...

[Crimhead]

Yes, and keeping that lock in place, if you get three Stage you can Loam less often, drawing cards in hope of finding Gamble or Exploration.

You can also occasionally eat the 2 life if you want to draw cards.

[gigapatrick]

I would add a thing about Chasm lock. If it ever happens, be careful with Stage being a copy of Chasm. Age counter on Stage will stay even if it is no longer copying Chasm. Age counter will not be erased by copying something else. It might be useful to know before declaring "I pay" for cumulative upkeep.

This isn't actually correct. I've done the Chasm-lock on Modo enough times to know that age counters do not transfer when using a Stage to copy a Chasm.

Edit: Sorry, misread your post. Age counters will stay on a Stage that has copied a Chasm and then copied something else--but if it's copied something else, why would you have to pay any life for the counters?

[filln]

This isn't actually correct. I've done the Chasm-lock on Modo enough times to know that age counters do not transfer when using a Stage to copy a Chasm.

To clarify, I think kravkenov was referring to a scenario in which you have a Stage that has copied Chasm and you decide to pay the upkeep (add an age counter, pay 2 life), and then use that same Stage to copy a different land, say a Forest. Your Stage/Forest will retain its age counter, meaning that if you later use it to copy a Chasm again and pay the upkeep, you'll pay 4 life the first go-around since there would then be two age counters on the Stage.

gigapatrick is of course correct that the Stage's copy ability does not copy the counters that exist on a targeted land. Which is a great thing or else the Depths combo would be a lot less fun for us.

[manadrain]

Thanks for the help guys!

[kravkenov]

To clarify, I think kravkenov was referring to a scenario in which you have a Stage that has copied Chasm and you decide to pay the upkeep (add an age counter, pay 2 life), and then use that same Stage to copy a different land, say a Forest. Your Stage/Forest will retain its age counter, meaning that if you later use it to copy a Chasm again and pay the upkeep, you'll pay 4 life the first go-around since there would then be two age counters on the Stage.

gigapatrick is of course correct that the Stage's copy ability does not copy the counters that exist on a targeted land. Which is a great thing or else the Depths combo would be a lot less fun for us.

Yes that is that. Sorry, poor English.

[dimignon]

Hi Guys,

In this Weekend I am going to play a local tournament here in Brazil, which will have approximately 80 players.

This is the list I'm thinking of using:

Maindeck:

4 x Wasteland
4 x Grove of the Burnwillows
4 x Thespian's Stage
3 x Rishadan Port
3 x Dark Depths
3 x Maze of Ith
2 x Ghost Quarter
2 x Taiga
1 x Forest
1 x Verdant Catacombs
1 x Misty Rainforest
1 x Wooded Foothils
1 x Glacial Chams
1 x Karakas
1 x The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 x Barbarian Ring
1 x Tranquil Thicket
1 x Sheltered Thicket
1 x Horizon Canopy
4 x Mox Diamond
4 x Exploration
4 x Crop Rotation
4 x Gamble
4 x Life from the loam
3 x Punishing Fire
1 x Molten Vortex
1 x Mirage Mirror

Sidedeck

4 x Sphere of Resistance
1 x Thorn of Amethyst
1 x Pithing Needle
3 x Krosan Grip
1 x Ancient Grudge
1 x Kozilek's Return
2 x Tireless Tracker
1 x Bojuka Bog
1 x Ancient Tomb

Here in Brasil we have a lot of delver and death and taxes. Show and Tell and Burn always pops up to. And Miracles, Storm, Agro Loam and Elves mark your presence.

What do you think about this list?

[Ciubulu]

Mirage mirror is a nice idea but my suggestion is to try it side maybe switching in the tomb that's a good jolly to have game one to attempt an unexpected 20/20 with 3 lands out of a eot crop rotation.

[Lormador]

I'm quite chagrined that Miracles is somehow in the DTB section while we're down here with "hoi poloi" in coach. We shall see what the real control deck in the format is! They cannot contain the power of Loam without that little banned trinket! This is not over!

Regarding the above list, it's a small point really compared to the brave placement of Mirage Mirror in the main, but I do think it's important to play 4 fetch lands in order to maximize the value of Life from the Loam, and I personally think the value of the 4th fetch land exceeds that of the third "draw land," though it's cool that the above list does indeed play all of them.

I'm playing Port and Choke in my RUG list with 1 Trop, which is fine to fuel just Ruins and EE. I've tested it a ton. If the only blue requirement is exactly Ruins, one Trop is plenty. It doesn't clash with Choke because when Choke sticks it straight up wins, the land being small potatoes then. And it can always be used as fodder for various things in that state anyway.