Rite of Flames would be bad because of Chalice @1.Originally Posted by deviant
How many Akromas would you run?
I was thinking of three.
Two is not enough and there is no room for four I think. Three jittes should be good with that many morphs you can't flip if all goes well. And anyways - Jittes are good.
You pretty much answered your own question. Seething Song is the only one worthwhile because it nets two mana and can exchangefor
, which is insane when dealing with Sloggers, Pit Dragons, or Akromas. Mox makes the cut because it's permanent and facilitates hellbent. SSG makes the cut because he's a threat and a Jitte carrier in a pinch.
Someone told you wrong. The deck barely gets away with 10. The correct number is somewhere around 10.5. Unfortunately, split card mountains don't exist yet. However, it's a little worse to be stuck with a flood of Mountains/Moxes in your hand than it is to be a little short, especially considering Pyrokinesis and Chrome Mox reward you for having too many red cards in hand but punish you for too many lands.
Taco.
You've been running this thing without the trinis for a week or so now. Have you been able to do some testing against *****, combo and such?
You know, the mu's where trini was good.
I was just wondering how much the absence of trinis affect these mu's.
(No, I can't test it myself unfortunately. That's why I have to ask others.)
Which means that it was a 4 round tournament, with top4 playoffs. Sure that's a total of 6 rounds but there's a difference between a 4 rounds top4 and 6 rounds top8. 4 rounds top4 can be anything from 14-20ish players I believe. But then again tacosnape hasn't posted the number of players as I asked :(
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There.
I too am interested in knowing about mu's w/o 3Sphere against Thresh, etc.
I stumbled across a DS decklist which sided 3 culling scales. (Some small tournament, 3rd.)
I don't think it's very good considering our morphs cost 0, cotv=0, many key permanents cost 3 and so on. Oh yeah, and needle=1.
Thought to inform anyway, you never know ;)
Threshold's still favorable. Obviously it's better -with- Trinisphere, but Chalice still hurts it, Moon hurts it if you get it early enough, and you still run a ton of big guys they have to worry about.
Other than TES and possibly Ichorid, Trinisphere doesn't really help you all that much against any other combo deck. Ichorid is still somewhat favorable. Epic Storm without Trinispheres anywhere in the build is probably in their favor. With Trinispheres in board only it was about even, possibly slightly in DS's favor.
Mox, Chalice, and Morph all die to Culling Scales. So no go. I must admit I had to look the card up, though, and it seems like it would have a lot of potential in certain control decks.
The deck is excellent in the current format and I'm already in the works of building my version.
Hope to finish the MB soon and startt playing around with it as I am in the works of finishing a Legacy Version of Korlash Control.
Wow, that was his first post, even...lol
I think more lands are needed. It's pretty important. I mull down to 5 way too much because of a lack of lands. That starts me out with less options and less threats. Helps with Hellbent, but it's not optimal. I think Fetches wouldn't be bad. We're mono-red anyway, so Blood Moon would be a trivial matter. More lands, plus thinning. I don't see how it would be bad.
I like consistancy...I need suggestions on what to drop. I'll post a list later, but like 2x more lands would be optimal. It seems like 18x lands, 4 moxen and a set of SSG's would be good, but I keep getting screwed.
I was having land issues too but it was while I was adapting myself to the deck. It's been a while since I last had to mull down to 5 due to bad land draws.
I've not dropped Trinisphere. I play exact same list as Taco, but with -4x Akroma, Angel of WHATEVER, +4x Trinisphere. It's the best first turn play. It's a timewalk. There's nothing your opponent can do t1, slows them down, makes counters go away, and disrupts combo better than CotV. It's not imprintable on Mox, but it has't been a big drawback much.
What does this deck match up really well against?
Anything with over 67% nonbasic lands. Anything relying heavily on cards that are shut down by Chalice-1 or Chalice-2. Any semi-control deck with an insufficient amount of removal. Any smaller aggro deck. Most combo decks. Threshold. Essentially the entire DTB Forum sans The Rock, some Survival, and possibly Aluren (I've honestly never once played DS vs. Aluren, but I suspect it could be troublesome.) Stax is decent, Affinity's usually who wins the die roll, and Enchantress = Scoop and go get dinner.
What makes the deck neat is its capacity to sometimes just win any matchup, good or bad, without thinking about it. I've beaten Solidarity by dropping a turn one Slogger. I've beaten The Rock by dropping a turn one Magus when my opponent had three fetchlands in hand.
The downside is that it's just as capable of losing its very best matchups without thought. I've lost against Goblins with Slogger/Jitte/Dragon in hand because I couldn't stop a turn one Lackey. I've lost to Threshold due to being stuck walking into Daze. I've lost to almost everything due to mulliganing myself into oblivion.
Taco, your build would get reamed by Aluren because you cut trinisphere, but In builds with trinisphere it is about 65-35 in your favor.
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The deck hoses Threshold and nearly every deck that loves to play spells under 3 mana if it could play out Trinisphere before any of those decks could be operational.
Then with the Blood Moon cards just gum up any player who runs too many Nonbasic lands which is a plus in the current meta game but I would recommend that players don't run full play sets of the actual Blood Moon.
What makes it so tough to hose out completely would have to be the fact that most of the creatures are mammoths to deal with as most modern decks in the format would run mainly cards to kill small guys.
Then it still has problems with Mono-Black Aggro and people who have figured out how to hose the deck.
That's sort of what I thought. I'll have to try it to see what the best strategy is between fast clocks, Moons, Needles, Chalices, Pyrokineses, etc.
Aluren's virtually invisible, though. Good or not, it's less played at Tournaments than Solidarity ever thought about being.
Also, for the record, I do still advocate Trinisphere in the sideboard of this deck. My decision to exclude it from my sideboard was a metagame call.
I know all to well about this decks matchup vs thresh. I played a dragon stompy in Top 4 last week. I was able to win post side board with beb, but it was still very difficult and came down to many lucky draws.
I currently have a plan where I have Sphere of Resistances and Thorns in the MB over a few other cards as well as some of those cards in the SB. My version is still in the progress of being put together and I hope to have it operational before mid year.
Might include Defense Grid.
I like the tariff plan of the deck that makes it uniquely hard for those who like Low Prices for spells.
You'd better play some stone rains than thorns. Your game plan is to cut the coloured mana of your opponent and adding thorns will not help in any way. Trinisphere is good because it's %3 and %3 is a lot for a deck playing 17/18 1-mana producing lands. If you play stone rain (or the haste echo guy for 3R), you can get rid of his basic lands and keep colour screwing him.
by the way, playing BEB in DS is very unexpected and tech ^^.
How do you manage blue elemental blast? Don't you mean reb? Beb sounds rediculous...
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