[Deck] Solitaire (Enchantress)

[overseer1234]

I've been testing the deck for a while and realy like how it works so well in my meta.
I'm currently playing the following list:

4x Argothian Enchantress

1x City of Solitude
4x Elephant Grass
4x Enchantress’s Presence
2x Ground Seal
1x Seal of Primordium
4x Utopia Sprawl
2x Wild Growth
1x Words of War
1x Aura of Silence
1x Hoofprints of the Stag
1x Karmic Justic
2x Oblivion Ring
1x Sacred Mesa
3x Solitary Confinement
4x Sterling Grove

8x Forest Land
3x Plains Land
4x Savannah
2x Serra’s Sanctum
1x Taiga Land
4x Windswept Heath

2x Replenish

Is this a good starting skeleton for meta finetuning?

[Brehn]

Some choices could be argued over, but it's a good skeleton. Your curve looks pretty high to me, though... and people are thinking that I'm running a list with a high curve. But there's one thing which I really don't like:

4x Savannah

Test against decks with Wasteland. You'll lose far too often because the only lands you draw are duals and you have to put Auras on them. The very very first change I'd make to your list would be -2 Savannah +2 Wooded Foothills.

[landstill101]

Some choices could be argued over, but it's a good skeleton. Your curve looks pretty high to me, though... and people are thinking that I'm running a list with a high curve. But there's one thing which I really don't like:



Test against decks with Wasteland. You'll lose far too often because the only lands you draw are duals and you have to put Auras on them. The very very first change I'd make to your list would be -2 Savannah +2 Wooded Foothills.

I have stayed away fromt his thread because my list has many different views from most of the ppl in here but this reply is completly false, where in your math does 5 duals get drawn more than 11 basics, and you also have fetchland which will get basics, this deck runs more basics than it needs. I run 2 more duals in my build and competly rape decks with wasteland. Really how could this comment have any accuracy to it when most of the format runs atleast 3 colors and only 3 basics to the landstill and ITF builds that run maybe 1 basic and they win all the time. If you have problems with wasteland in this deck, stop playing magic...


overseer, you manabase is just fine don't listen to him keep all 4 savannahs. The one card you might want to test which I love and have 4 in the deck is runed halo.

[loop]

where in your math does 5 duals get drawn more than 11 basics

He never said that.

Really how could this comment have any accuracy to it when most of the format runs atleast 3 colors and only 3 basics

Maybe most of the format doesn't run 8 Enchant Lands.
A 2 lands hand is keepable if you have some Wild Growths / Utopia Sprawls and can enchant a basic. If your 2 lands are, say, a Savannah and a Serra's Sanctum (or even 2 Savannahs for that matter)... well, you're fucked.

Brehn's point is that the deck doesn't need to play so many duals, so why open yourself to such situations?

[Jaiminho]

I've never had a problem with running 2 Sanctums, 2 Savannahs, 1 Taiga, 4 Fetchlands, 1 Plains and 9 Forests (19 total). Aside from rare situations in which I mulligan to 5, I never get color screwed. Like... ever... and I run only 4 land auras. There's really no need to expose yourself to Wastelands, which will happen when you are filled with those Savannahs, Taigas and Sanctums.

About overseer's list, I'd run all 4 Ground Seals, taking out Aura of Silence and Seal of Primordium. You already have 4 Oblivion Rings. I don't think you need all that hate.

[GreenOne]

I've never had a problem with running 2 Sanctums, 2 Savannahs, 1 Taiga, 4 Fetchlands, 1 Plains and 9 Forests (19 total). Aside from rare situations in which I mulligan to 5, I never get color screwed. Like... ever... and I run only 4 land auras. There's really no need to expose yourself to Wastelands, which will happen when you are filled with those Savannahs, Taigas and Sanctums.

I'm actually running 3 savannahs +1 taiga + 2 sanctum + 4 fetch + 9 Forest and 2 Plains with 8 auras. I'll try to go -1 Savannah +1 Forest.

About overseer's list, I'd run all 4 Ground Seals, taking out Aura of Silence and Seal of Primordium. You already have 4 Oblivion Rings. I don't think you need all that hate.

He only has 2xO.Ring.
It's an ok list. I'd go with -1 Plains -2 Savannah -1 Aura of silence +2 Forest +1 O.Ring + 1 ild Growth.

[Julian23]

Completly agree with Brehn: I used to run 4/2 Savannah/Taiga but when I realized I just don't need that much duals I went down to 2/1. This was not done in "fear" of Wasteland but because it's possible and favours our Enchant Lands and Gaea's Touch (which is awesome!) even more!

/edit: I wouldn't run 3 Win Conditions though; Aura of Silence might be a metagame-choice. I really recommend trying 4 Elvish Spirit Guide and 2 Gaea's Touch! The deck works without them but once you pitched a ESG to Daze, Replenished back Gaea's Touch and played additional lands to it etc. etc. you get to love them! In my list I dropped 2 Wild Growth, 1 Ground Seal and a land (running 20 now) for ESG.

[Jaiminho]

He only has 2xO.Ring.
It's an ok list. I'd go with -1 Plains -2 Savannah -1 Aura of silence +2 Forest +1 O.Ring + 1 ild Growth.

How much having lots of targetted permanent hate adds to the deck? I only have 2 O-Ring on the maindeck and 2 Aura and 1 Seal on the sideboard. I don't think I should use more than this.

[GreenOne]

How much having lots of targetted permanent hate adds to the deck? I only have 2 O-Ring on the maindeck and 2 Aura and 1 Seal on the sideboard. I don't think I should use more than this.

I was just speculating that he needed more than the usual permanent hate because he was running 2 O.rings 1 Aura and 1 Seal. Now that I think about it, the list lacks a moat, so -1 ORing +1 Moat.

[overseer1234]

Moat isn't in my list for budget reasons, so that's why I play the 2nd O-Ring.

[Julian23]

I'd rather play the 4th Confinement over Moat if I couldn't afford it.

[falseprophet]

Julian, you've been at this deck (or at least active on this thread for some while)... What is the current list you are using?

Secondly, a question: during playtesting I find myself sometimes needing to keep the Solitary Confinement down, without any enchantments in hand. What is the recommended "out" in this case? (E.g. don't pay Confinement's upkeep, draw a card, cross fingers it's an enchantment and it won't fizzle untill you hit a Replenish or another Confinement...?)

Cheers,

falseprophet

[SpatulaOfTheAges]

You don't have much choice in that scenario, you let the Confinement drop.

I think you guys are going overboard on the defensive enchantment count. The best defense is a strong offense; efficient card drawing (either Ground Seal or "free" enchantments) lets you set up a Confinement-Grove combo more easily, which pretty much answers everything.

[GreenOne]

Secondly, a question: during playtesting I find myself sometimes needing to keep the Solitary Confinement down, without any enchantments in hand. What is the recommended "out" in this case? (E.g. don't pay Confinement's upkeep, draw a card, cross fingers it's an enchantment and it won't fizzle untill you hit a Replenish or another Confinement...?)

IF you have multiple Enchantress effects on board then an out is to tutor for another Confinament with Sterling Grove. No other ways other than topdeck what you need.

[Redlotus27]

I'd rather play the 4th Confinement over Moat if I couldn't afford it.

Or at least maybe Ghostly Prison. It will slow an opponent down possibly long enough to land a confinement. I've even toyed with Island Sanctuary as a poor man's Moat. Its nowhere near moat's power level; but it does shut down the attack phase similar to moat.

[Julian23]

Julian, you've been at this deck (or at least active on this thread for some while)... What is the current list you are using?

4x Windswept Heat
2x Savannah
1x Taiga
2x Serra's Sanctum
9x Forest
2x Plains

4x Argothian Enchantress
4x Elvish Spirit Guide (Brehn convinced me and they rock!)

2x Replenish

4x Enchantress' Presence
4x Solitary Confinement (gonna replace 1 with Moat)
4x Sterling Grove
4x Elephant Grass
4x Utopia Sprawl
2x Gaea's Touch (you really gotta try those!)
1x Karmic Justice
1x Seal of Primordium
1x Oblivion Ring
1x City of Solitude
1x Sacred Mesa
1x Words of War
1x Ground Seal
1x Wheel of Sun and Moon

SB:
4x Guttural Response
3x Sacred Ground
2x City of Solitude
2x Ground Seal
2x Runed Halo
1x Replenish
1x Karmic Justice


Especially my sideboard totally is a metagamecall because I got a lot of Landstill/Dreadnought/etc. decks flying around here. You even gotta face the occacional Solidarity which is why Wheel of Sun and Moon is played over Ground Seal. I wish I was able to squeeze in more of the latter, mostly because of Aggro Loam; therefor I got the much needed Sacred Ground as a 3off(!) in the sb because I really really wanna have one asap! Aggro Loam over here now always run Reverent Silence as a wishtarget *cries*.

Guttural Response is kind of an experiment right now but early (but not a lot of!) testing shows good results: Countering a FoW on a turn2 Enchantress really rocks! Splashdamage is done to Solidarity, TES(Dimishing Returns) and MS Paint (like..everything :D). And since I run ESG I can even use it without mana open, how good is that against Landstill? Or imagine being tapped out and still countering Stifle on Phyrexian Dreadnought..nasty!
Maybe someone will proof me wrong some time but right now I really dig those Guttural Response.

I recently dropped 3 Aura of Silence and don't feel very comfortable about it but as it seems noone plays Stax/Affinity over here anymore.

[Jaiminho]

I wish I was able to squeeze in more of the latter (Ground Seal), mostly because of Aggro Loam; therefor I got the much needed Sacred Ground as a 3off(!) in the sb because I really really wanna have one asap! Aggro Loam over here now always run Reverent Silence as a wishtarget *cries*.

Wouldn't lots of Aggro Loam request more Karmic Justice and Replenish? Sacred Ground will only save your non-basics from Wastelands. If someone blows your enchantments away, Karmic Justice will clean their board and Replenish will reset the gamestate prior to that sweeper. Can't see how Sacred Ground helps here. I'd also run more Ground Seals, since they aren't card disadvantage even when its ability won't matter and it owns Extirpate, a card known for screwing Sterling Groves.

I recently dropped 3 Aura of Silence and don't feel very comfortable about it but as it seems noone plays Stax/Affinity over here anymore.

No Chalice Stompy decks either? It's good to have more outs to the different chalice numbers, while being able to use Oblivion Ring to handle other things.



And, finally, is Moat/Island Sanctuary really necessary? Neither will force a concession from any decks in this format, except maybe Moat against Thresh-like decks (that don't run flyers, obviously), since they can't get rid of a 4cc enchantment. I'm talking about game 1 here.

[Jak]

Devastating Dreams hurts a lot by taking out Argothians and hitting our manabase. Sacred Ground is nice in there. Karmic Justice and Replenish work amazing also so I would try to have 3 Replenish, 3 Karmic Justice, and at least 1 Sacred Ground in your 75.

Moat isn't worth it, IMO. Every deck has an answer for it via fliers or MD artifact/enchantment removal. Oblivion Ring is much better.

[Julian23]

Wouldn't lots of Aggro Loam request more Karmic Justice and Replenish? Sacred Ground will only save your non-basics from Wastelands. If someone blows your enchantments away, Karmic Justice will clean their board and Replenish will reset the gamestate prior to that sweeper. Can't see how Sacred Ground helps here. I'd also run more Ground Seals, since they aren't card disadvantage even when its ability won't matter and it owns Extirpate, a card known for screwing Sterling Groves.




No Chalice Stompy decks either? It's good to have more outs to the different chalice numbers, while being able to use Oblivion Ring to handle other things.



And, finally, is Moat/Island Sanctuary really necessary? Neither will force a concession from any decks in this format, except maybe Moat against Thresh-like decks (that don't run flyers, obviously), since they can't get rid of a 4cc enchantment. I'm talking about game 1 here.

Yeah my first impulse was to increase Karmic Justice as well. But here's the problem even with Justice in play:

step1: They blow away your lands (and most of their permanents)
step2: 1-2 turns later they drop Goyf/Terravore;I can't maintain Confinement/got no mana to Replenish

To me, Karmic Justice just wasn't good enough in this matchup. With Sacred Ground Devastating Dreams isn't as painful; I also run 11 bascis and 4 Heath to fetch one (~15).
But even with Sacred Ground/Karmic Justice (at least I) still lose to Reverrent Silence as they will first play Silence for free, float mana and Devastating Dreams all your lands; if they now got a mox they can drop goyf the same turn and drop e.g. Terravore next turn. They run around 26 lands, I got 20.

/edit: Aggro Loam used to be piece of cake with Sacred Ground to combat Dreams but since my metagame now runs Reverrent Silence it got really tough

/edit²: Regarding Aura of Silence: Nope, no Chalice Aggro right now. But still - as I said - I feel kinda uncomfortable about it but during the course of the last tournaments I didn't run into anything where this card was really needed.

[Jaiminho]

For a moment, I forgot about devastating dreams. Silly me.