[Deck] Ichorid

**Maëlig** · 10-01-2008 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by sunshine

Witness has really stood out in being able to return Firestorm (which as been awesome for me coming out of the board) and Chain of Vapor. The fact that you can also get back Breakthrough is what makes her a reasonable substitute for Sage in the first place.

There are definitely many times when playing Sage lets you dredge more in one turn, but that's irrelevant if you need to bounce a Moat or Propaganda (especially given a board like yours with no enchantment hate).

Just started playing ichorid here, so I might not actually see all the subtle aspects of your choice. I'm wondering though, how often do you need firestorm once you are already able to use DR? I thought the card was meant mainly to protect your bridges before starting to dredge too heavily, or as a removal against random stuff like yixlid jailer or samurai of the pale curtain (so in 95% of cases, before you can actually play DR). Same thing goes for chain of vapor. If you really want an out against moat/propaganda mid-combo with DR, why not play wispmare in the SB (which also gives you one more answer to LLotV)?

**Zappa** · 10-01-2008 10:06 PM

wow, took me almost a whole week reading everyones discussion on this deck starting from page 1. I was curious hat this deck was as I've never seen it, and when I used magic work station to play around with it I find it to be pretty interesting. I've also ordered the deck and waiting for the cards to arrive, but I've a few questions to those thats more expereinced with the deck, all I have been doing is just play testing for 40+ games on MWS, can't really call that experience =/.

But anyways, I am still waiting for my deck and a bunch of other cards I may find some use later, to come by. But currently heres what I have in mind.

4 Cephalid Coliseum
4 Gemstone Mine
4 City of Brass

4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Bridge from Below

1 Flame-Kin Zealot
1 Eternal Witness

4 Golgari Grave-Troll
4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Golgari Thug

4 Putrid Imp
4 Narcomoeba
4 Ichorid

4 Breakthrough
3 Deep Analysis
3 Dread Return

4 Cabal Therapy

Just the basic structure. Though I am a bit lost between the whole Eternal Witness vs Cephalid Sage, and the Street Wraith argument. Everyone sure brings up some good points.

My question though, if anyone can help me out. How do you pressure your opponent to blowing up his crypt, who is waiting for you to fill up your graveyard with more cards... and he can be... very very patient....

Which is a friend of mine I play test with at one time online that uses the classic UW Landstill build. He sits there and waits for me to fill up on my graveyard before blowing up his crypt, and he is very patient about it... which makes me more impatient

.

Are there certain conditions you should meet before pressuring with ichorids? like trying to get 1 bridge in graveyard first? Or an Imp to be casted to join ichorid in attacking. Should I try to achieve ThreshThreshThreshThreshThreshThreshThreshThresh? The one game I played him I had 1 ichorid I was bringing back and forth with 1 bridge in the yard, and he is sitting there with a crypt, crucible of worlds and cump blocking with factories. That time I ran out quickly of food for ichorid.

I know I am pretty noobish, but I had no idea what to do to presure the landstill player to crack the tormod's crypt. I was worried if I go all out with draw/dredge he nukes my graveyard.

I am new to this deck, and was hoping I can get some advise on how you guys go about pressuring someone (whose very patient) to cracking his crypt, especially landstill player.

Thank you.

**Mayk0l** · 10-01-2008 11:30 PM

Crypt baiting basically comes down to putting things in there that will kill him if he does nothing and will slowly progress your dredging, while at the same time your hand contains cards that will get you right back in. I usually harrass my opponent something along the lines of: attack with a lonely recurring Ichorid and a Bridge, while dredging a Thug, and playing and flashbacking Therapies while I can. Try to play the game but at a slower pace.
If your opponent plays a gazillion cantrips, or can search out Crypts, or can make it recurring (through Academy Ruins for example) you may want to be more aggressive; dredging faster to force him to use it, but always have some backup left in your hand! Otherwise you're in topdeck and that's a pain in Ichorid.
A Crypt or two with a good clock on your opponents side is usually very difficult to deal with though. But I've won games wherein my opponent succesfully activated three crypts. Remember that Putrid Imp is MVP, so is having two dredgers in your hand (so you get to keep one), hold on to Bridges if they're in your hand, etc.
What I noticed is that a lot of people don't even know when to blow up the crypt, but you shouldn't rely on that.

To disagree with a lot of people, I think Landstill is not such a great MU. They have multiple ways of dealing with your aggression and the slower you play them the more time you give them to set it up.

On the Ichorid recursion, I bring them back whenever it is beneficial for the game state. I won't bring it back if my opponent has a Propaghanda in play and I don't have the mana nor a Bridge in my yard. I'm also hesitant to recur it when it eats away my last dredger (which I usually try to avoid because Dredging hits more food).
Basically, Ichorid is awesome because he deals damage, is food for Therapy and Dread Return and makes tokens.
The situation you mentioned with the Factory, Crucible and Crypt is a difficult one though! It makes Ichorid underwhelming at the least. There're no conditions you have to meet before recurring Ichorids, just don't do it when it doesn't make sense to do it :)

**kensook** · 10-01-2008 11:40 PM

In the case you mentioned with Factory, Cruicible and Crypt, if they have crypt doesn't that mean it's postboard so you would probably have chain of vapor / pithing needle? If you can stall long enough with Ichorid recursion and play either one they would have to sac the crypt. Or you can go with the strategy the guy above me mentioned if you don't have them in your hand.

**Parcher** · 10-02-2008 01:08 AM

Originally Posted by Maëlig

Just started playing ichorid here, so I might not actually see all the subtle aspects of your choice. I'm wondering though, how often do you need firestorm once you are already able to use DR? I thought the card was meant mainly to protect your bridges before starting to dredge too heavily, or as a removal against random stuff like yixlid jailer or samurai of the pale curtain (so in 95% of cases, before you can actually play DR). Same thing goes for chain of vapor. If you really want an out against moat/propaganda mid-combo with DR, why not play wispmare in the SB (which also gives you one more answer to LLotV)?

Remember, the second most important aspect of Firestorm is that is can go to the dome. Especially since virtually no deck can completely stop Ichorid from dealing some damage. Also, swarm decks like Goblins and Elves can be troublesome because (among other reasons) they can produce enough creatures to consistantly block, and evasion is at a premium in this deck.

Wispmare is only excluded due to his sorcery speed. Against decks with discard and counters, the flexiblilty is simply more generically useful than the body+returnability of Wispmare. I run three enchantment removal spells plus bounce, but mostly for Leyline. Properly played, this deck can win through most hampering enchantments, but not a pre-game Leyline. While it is true that most decks are realizing that they cannot properly support a mulligan to Leyline, if they land it and you cannot answer immediately and through whatever disruption they can muster in addition to it, this is the one card you cannot with through. Plan accordingly.

**georgjorge** · 10-02-2008 04:06 AM

How do you guys sideboard against Landstill on the draw ? I know I want to bring in Unmask, Tolarian Winds and Ray + Riftstone Portal. I'm thinking about taking out LED (because of Force) and Street Wraiths...I don't play Return, so I can't take that out ; )

**Aleksandr** · 10-02-2008 06:06 AM